Bases and airfields in arcade battles, spawn height

[fortunadus 350]

it is nice you just ask such questions and patch bombers down to non playable planes...

you should instead ask why this base rushes started since 1.37!

 

you destroyed effectivness of bombs...

you made less ground Targets...

you took the gunners out of the game...

you lowered benefits from ground Targets...

you made base bombing more lucrative...

 

and you even ask why ppl start just to do boring base bombing since 1.37?

Edited February 6, 2014 by fortunadus

[PapaPnut 44]

Battles played in arcade - Probably 40 yesterday battles

 

2. Preferred aircraft class - fighter/bomber/attacker  I like play all classes and always build a balanced stable of planes. 

I fly what the team needs me to fly to be successful (i.e.  if the team puts mostly bombers in the air, I'll play fighters and vice versa)

 

3. Are the changes noticeable? yes/no  FANTASTIC changes

 

4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly. Yes/no  I absolutely LOVE the changes, but the bases seem just a  just a little too fragile.  I have yet to have a game end with the airfield destroyed FANTASTIC.  It used to be VERY demoralizing when your team fought well and had a big lead only to have the airfield destroyed and almost instantly loose.

 

5. Gameplay became better/worse/did not change  It made the gameplay much much better.

 

6. My thoughts in general

 

In general the changes are FANSTASTIC.  Much improved game play.  Makes heavy fighters useful again. Except 1) The bases seem a little too fragile now and 2) I don't think the spawn altitudes needed to be changed it makes bombers too easy to catch now and kill. But I guess that;s to balance the bases being easier to kill.

 

Great job at actively working to improve the gaming experience.!!!!

Edited February 7, 2014 by DB_III

[DreamCapture 0]

1. Battles played in arcade - Not sure- battles
2. Preferred aircraft class - fighter
3. Are the changes noticeable? yes
4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly. Yes
5. Gameplay became better
6. My thoughts in general
I think to prevent the bomber rush, you can increase the range of AAA such as if the searchlight is on and it's pointing at the bomber that's on high altitude, AAA will fire specific on you and it will get stronger when the searchlight is pointing at you for longer time. Also, each base can have M2 browning gunners that destroy the bombs that bomber drop. If a bomber drop the bomb at high altitude, there's more chance to M2 browning gunners to shoot down the bomber's bomb in the air.

[minnesota_ace 5]

Over all everything is better bases first has always been my mentality BUT why are there not bases on all maps airfield rushing still happening on those cause airfield is active right away aka crater, hidden base, green field to mention a few. other thing is 

AI gunners need to be better. too often they are shooting at .6 miles away and run out of ammo when they actually get in range to be killed or crippled. I think you guys are making a fantastic game keep it up . BASES NEED TO BE ADDED TO ALL MAPS

[AirborneDaddy 142]

Also, each base can have M2 browning gunners that destroy the bombs that bomber drop. If a bomber drop the bomb at high altitude, there's more chance to M2 browning gunners to shoot down the bomber's bomb in the air.

 Now this made me laugh....Brownings aren't a Sea Wiz.

 

I can barely make it to any target now with my slow bombers. Most fighters are too busy taking out all the stationary ground targets to support the bombers anyway. Why not fix the real problem with base rushes? Oh wait, the Yer is "under performing!"

 

 BASES NEED TO BE ADDED TO ALL MAPS

 

Not to Domination maps they don't!

[Aztec7771 50]

Bombers are hard enough to game. Slow, boring, vulnerable (unless very high...and then, a lonely grind)  GJ should return the lions and RP and make the bombers AI.  Mission structure could be defend/escort the bomber stream or defend a strategic target from the bomber stream.  Tickets could be reduced for AI bomber assets lost as well as bomb damage to target, in addition to usual player losses.  Keep the fighter-bombers for tac-air missions, bombing/shooting ground targets.  

[Czappu 874]

Gonna complete the survey when il be back from work and have some looks on a gamercard.

Over 10 000 AB and a former bomber player (1.25 - 1.33) then fighter pilot.

Solutions easy to make:
Increasing Spawns to 2500m fighters / 5000m bombers.
Increasing reward rate for ground targets by 10%.
Increasing stock aircraft performance in AB by 20% (influence of upgrades is a bit too high).
Increasing ground target count by 20% on ground strike matches.
Reducing mini bases HP by 10%.

Try making changes like that, and overall feeling of a game would be better then in 1.35 / 1.37 Edited February 7, 2014 by Czappu

[Badballie 1,219]

I will reply in the proper format as soon as I get home, I don't know my battle numbers off hand, My only problem is the bomber spawn height being lowered again. Most bombers do not have any climb ability and stand no chance at lower altitudes. I feel that we have destroyed the viability of 90% of the bombers, because of the 10% that actually do have a decent climb rate and top speed.

[swedeonthemoose 12,809]

I will reply in the proper format as Soon™ as I get home, I don't know my battle numbers off hand, My only problem is the bomber spawn height being lowered again. Most bombers do not have any climb ability and stand no chance at lower altitudes. I feel that we have destroyed the viability of 90% of the bombers, because of the 10% that actually do have a decent climb rate and top speed.

nothing new, by now it should be clear that gaijin hates bombers, the basebombing was a result of less effect on bombs on viechles and tanks from high alt thanks to nerfed splash, and lowered amount of groundunits needin to be killed to win, and now everyone flying a bomber gets punished for the minority of baserushing asshats

[Silent_Witch 1,452]

1. Battles played in arcade - can't remember , but over 4/5 of my total battles
2. Preferred aircraft class - fighter/bomber/attacker all
3. Are the changes noticeable? no
4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly. Yes on tier 2 and early 3, no for late tier 3
5. Gameplay became worse, main mission of acrade is to bomb out ground target, those BR around 3.7 have no problem climb to the bomber height before this utterly stupid patch
6. My thoughts in general, it is utterly hopeless and stupid by screwing all other bombers simply becoz they need a fix to those base rush bomber

[Dune91 1]

Base changes are good thanks for that.

 

Bombers now there's a whole new can of worms. It seems that bombers are being fazed out of the game by making then in the main entirely useless, lets be honest who wants to fly something that at the first sign of an attack folds up?

 

Changes need to be made to help bomber pilots, during the WW2 fighters did not go after bombers on there own they had a squadron because the bomber was a fearsome foe well capable of defending its self, in War Thunder a quick pass and a squirt on the guns and the bomber blows up. This has to change to make bombers a viable part of the game they have to be able to withstand punishment not fall apart at the first sign of an attack. This would also promote more team play into arcade mode as you would need more than one fighter to knock one out of the sky as is currently the case, or specific bomber hunter class aircraft, the Japanese have one if memory serves.

 

These changes will only benefit the game making it more diverse for not only the bomber pilots but the fighter pilots as well.

 

I should point out that I do not just fly bombers I like to fly fighters as well but getting into a bomber is becoming to much of a chore  

[TASARDUR 1]

 I think that the spawn height for the bombers is no adequate for heavy planes, because at that height heavy bombers don't stand a chance against fighters especially Yak9K, which I think should be banned from the game completed. Also note that the games don't last long because now bombers don't go for bases but instead they go for ground units. I have been in matches that lasted only 4 minutes with the new modification. My personal opinion is that heavy planes should spawn at a higher altitude so at least they have enough time to reach a base and make the fighter jokers work for the kill.

Also like to point out, that with the new spawn height some intelligent fighter jokers have learned that if they claim and get on top of the spawn area of the enemy team, they are in for a big party killing everyone that spans back into the match, and is very frustrating to get back into the game and see 2 or 3 fighter diving on you and with the only options of diving to cut the grass or  leave the match. 

Edited February 9, 2014 by TASARDUR

[Bart_S 6]

Well, I think changing the base base destruction mechanic was a good idea, as well as reducing the fighter's spawn height which was way too high previously. People won't stop lawn mowing, no matter the spawn height. The problem with high spawn heights however is, that people, who just got killed within the furball in the middle of the map, will just respawn and high-speed dive back into the furball within seconds, leaving the guys who are still alive barely any chance of gaining some altitude.

 

On the other hand, I have my doubts about reducing the distance between fighters and bombers. Personally, I fly mostly (heavy) fighters and primarely go after bombers at the start of the match because a) it's what my planes are made for and b) I hate short games and I think bombers have too much influence on ending the game.

But instead of making the bomber pilots' live harder, you should do the opposite. Give them some more altitude advantage and more stuff to bomb but reduce their impact on the match outcome. Both fighters and bombers should have fun playing the game, but as things are now, I'll keep killing bombers because otherwise they'll ruin my matches.

Edited February 8, 2014 by Bart_S

[kfjkweljlwej 74]

1. Battles played in arcade

~1k

 

2. Preferred aircraft class - fighter/bomber/attacker

fighter

 

3. Are the changes noticeable? yes/no

yes

 

4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly. Yes/no

yes in maps without bombing points, no in maps with bombing points

 

5. Gameplay became better/worse/did not change

Gameplay became MUCH better. Now, bnz is a viable tactic again in arcade: people aren't spawning in space and have to climb. This means energy management (even in arcade) is important

 

6. My thoughts in general 

I explained it pretty much in 5, but the game has become much more enjoyable. The lowered fighter spawns are fantastic, you can't argue with this. I do however find that bombers spawn too low, they get slaughtered all the time. This doesn't really bother me because I don't enjoy bombing but I'm sure others do. I do tend to climb high at the beginning of the match and now I feel rewarded for this because of the new spawn heights.

 

Total: Fantastic update for bnz playstyle, but bombers are too vulnerable.

[ebbor10 93]

1. Battles played in arcade -               A not insignificant amount. Not sure how much

2. Preferred aircraft class -                Bomber

3. Are the changes noticeable?          Yes

4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly.          Sometimes, it depends on the mercy of the Matchmaker. But generally, not really. Not that they were bombed out quickly before

            - On a map without minibases, the bases can be destroyed after 5-7 minutes 

            - On other maps, it depends on the matchmaker. On tier 1-2, bombing out the minibases is trivial, on higher tiers you pretty much need Yer's to blow something up

 

5. Gameplay became better/worse/did not change:

           - Worse

6. My thoughts in general 

          - The variety of available targets that can be bombed is again reduced. Previously, Heavy bombers went for the airfield, medium bombers went for the minibases, and ground attack/light bombers went for ground targets. With, depending on the map, some of the options being of the table, you see bombers increasingly going for suicide runs against ground targets, in order to get some reward before being blown to pieces by whatever happened to be flying around. With the significantly reduced amounts of ground targets, this means that games length issue has not been resolved, and actually perhaps been worsened.

[swedeonthemoose 12,809]

1, thank for killing the last little bit of fun i had in this game with my bombers making them even faster lionpinatas to teh big gun fighters,

 

2. thank you for constantly ignoring the mm problems and just say soon to us. a yak 9 can split my b17 in half in 1 shot, a mig 9 in a tier 4 battle can do it faster then i can even get close to a target.

 

3. how can this lovely game go from my daily drug of joy to becoming just infuriating grind for teh daily x4 and nothing more ?

 

for several months now all the patches have done is to make the life for the bombers harder and harder, wtf is the point of having them ingame when you are clearly trying to make them obsolete ?

[Carrier_ 2,933]

1. Battles played in arcade - Every day about 20 battles
2. Preferred aircraft class - All of them, depend on nation
3. Are the changes noticeable? Hell they are
4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly. I saw it once since this change
5. Gameplay became better/worse/did not change - Rushes are gone, but bombers have hard time due altitude
6. My thoughts in general - Good work, great step... now you need only polish details

Edited February 8, 2014 by Carrier_

[Doublekick 115]

 

Today's hotfix brought some changes into arcade gameplay

 

 

1. Spawn heaight has been changed - fighters now spawn 1000 m lower and bombers 1500m lower.

 

2. Enemy airfield can now be destroyed only after all enemy bases are destroyed.

 

We try fix the bomber rush issue that is a concern to a lot of players. This update should change the situation and prevent the airfield bombing rush tactics

 

 

Please leave your opinion using the form below

 

1. Battles played in arcade - ____ battles

2. Preferred aircraft class - fighter/bomber/attacker

3. Are the changes noticeable? yes/no

4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly. Yes/no

5. Gameplay became better/worse/did not change

6. My thoughts in general 

 

Work on something more important first,prices,they are a complete joke for a pixel!

[Doublekick 115]

somehow it feels i get punished for just being a bomber pilot =_= ive never killed a base ever and now the fighters can get to me even faster then before

I havent either,whats new?? They change crap constantly so we dont know whats going on,always tweeking something!

[swedeonthemoose 12,809]

I havent either,whats new?? They change crap constantly so we dont know whats going on,always tweeking something!

well seeing we spawn close to teh ground and to the fighters, the bigger bombers dont stand a chance in ab trying to climb cus a yak 9 can easily intercept you and pow pow, all this long before you get into the range of bombing anything

[Teo41_ITA 637]

Then, on a future update, what about spawning bombers below the ground and below the sea?

[GritiTheOdd 18]

 

 

 

 

1. Battles played in arcade - _10 battles a day since patch

2. Preferred aircraft class - fighter/bomber/attacker, mainly figheter and attack, bombers rarely.

3. Are the changes noticeable? yes/no Somewhat. Kept getting Hidden Base recently and that has no minibases to bomb and most of those games got Yer rushed quick. Other Games managed to be a bit longer but still not by much.

4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly. Yes/no Yes people with lots of yers can still knock out the minibases with only a bare minimum of coordination and even other heavy bombers can still end games rapidly

5. Gameplay became better/worse/did not change. Have not really noticed much of a difference other than bombers being easier to climb after but still not cost effective to climb after them most of the time.

6. My thoughts in general. My biggest concern right now is Bombers have very little in the way of choice in what to do during a match. As riduluous as the Yer's bomb capactiy is, the larger problem to me is that Bombers can only do two things in order to be profitable. Either suicide dive down to drop a bombload on a column of ground targets or try to climb high and bomb the large area targets like the airfield or bases. While dive bombers can do better against moving targets, the heavy and medium bomber crowd  in order to get the most out of their bigger bombs need to go after airfields and bases. While bombers can make more credits and rp in a match if they eliminate all the ground vehicles, going after them generally is riskier and does not give the same pay out as multiple successful base rush games in a row. While lowering the bomber spawn hight does make them easier to kill, the only way to truly cure the bomber rush problem is to remove the auto win feature for knocking out the air field. I don't have a problem with bomber pilots getting good credits and RP for destroying the airfield, I do have a problem that destroying the airfield usually means even players on the winning team don't get as much time to earn comparable rewards by doing their jobs, be it hunting fighters or the other ground targets. Wins should be earned by the TEAM's performance, not by only a few players on the team.

 

Edited February 9, 2014 by GritiTheOdd

[Pez_Watley 123]

had a few fly outs yesterday,i think its 2200 total now,i like lower spawn...i fly bombers,the changes seem good...although,i did'nt have any trouble with 1.35 or 1.37....as stated earlier my game play has been mostly reduced to weekends,so i may not be a good judge of the over all game play components...but again thank you for your efforts

[Sadolf 2,385]

1. Battles played in arcade - ____ battles

Today about 10 battles with bombers, to test, in a whole about 2700 battles in arcade-(edited: today about 20 battles , most with bombers to test)

2. Preferred aircraft class - fighter/bomber/attacker

Fighters but i like bombers (in normal, not yerish way)

3. Are the changes noticeable? yes/no

yes

4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly. Yes/no

no (in average fight)- since no yers was used- in most fights I took part. Enemy bomber squad with most B17 ended one game in about 7 mins. One more game with one yer in each team was simple a race between opposing Yers. It took about 10 minutes and base was gone (yers got help from medium level bombers like b25.

5. Gameplay became better/worse/did not change

worse for bombers , especially weaker ones. No change for yer, zerg is still possible but in more organized ways.

Clan squadrons from zerg specialized clans are still able to do this with no problems- one yer load taking about 75% hp from ground target so 4 organized yers can kill 3 bases in one run (tested)

6. My thoughts in general

Its very nice Gj team trying to adress the issue, unfortunelly this not worked.

The only difference is the weaker bombers (not the yers ofc.) becaming an easy pray for fighters.

This solution resolving the problem only partially, blocking gamebreaking done in most simplified way. Experienced Yer players still  will be able to destroy airfield quickly . All other bombers will suffer instead being easy targets or having less opportunities to gain score.

 

Furthermore a need for bombing target areas to made airfield vulnerable fits in star wars universe (aka force field generators)

 

As mentioned before only remedys for this issue are:

1. To Make base loss causing only ticket drop

2. To Give base much more hp

3. Also lowering Yer2 dive speed may be helpfull.

 

Another Changes with may improve gameplay:

1. Since longer matches are better for everyone, as mentioned above by Another player, make more ground targets visible for everyone (as it was before)

2. Give all bombers max historical payloads, its simply a joke yer2 have 2 times payload of b17. Generally more bombs and more hp on targets /more targets will prolong fight and make it more intressting for everyone. Game should more naturally end by eliminating a whole enemy team first long before all ground targets are eliminated.

Way it is now people spending more time waiting for game to start than actually gaming.

 

 

one thing more: matchmaking for top bombers OTHER THAN YER are completly sadistic- like 1941 year model of B24 vs korea war jets.

Connecting this with too low bomb loads making those planes completly worthless, and flying it in most causes means a free kill for someone

 

P.S.2

Idea for matchmaking with 5 tiers wasnt so good, really, it simply dosent work.

10 tiers with max 2 tier spread is better.

Otherwise there will be less and less players who willingly will go thru tier 4 inferno with migs and sabres bashing everyone who are stupid enough to "try" research anything.

And nobody sane will Exchange free rp for gold simply because prices are rediciulously high. (yes i have over 10 000 000 free rp but its no way i will Exchange it for those prices)

 

P.S.3.

We really do appriciate Your concern about issues like gamebreaking by yers etc.

Nice idea to make Changes. But please listen more to players since ideas about resolving this problem was circling forums for some time and in most causes are different to this approach.

Edited February 10, 2014 by Sadolf

[kramak 0]

1. Battles played in arcade

2073 battles from the beginning maybe 50 since this patch

2. Preferred aircraft class

none i love them all

3. Are the changes noticeable?

yes, i used to have two bombers in my lineup, i have only one since that patch and only because i love them. now you get lucky if you manage to bomb something before getting shot. on the other hand now it's easier to reach our bomber and provide cover but most of the time escort fighter are too far from the first wave of derpcobra and yak and on arcade battle which last only 10 min nobody bother to build a formation

4. Our/enemy team managed to destroy bases and airfield quickly.

The poor bases doesn't last long, The airfield get's destroyed only on a long battle (15min +)

5. Gameplay became worse for the bomber that's for sure, better for the fighter 'cause you only need to climb up a bit and there you are, and once you had shot one or two bomber you are in a perfect spot to BnZ lawnmowerz,

6. My thoughts in general 

Personally i find it just fine prior this patch (just talking about bombing rush and the like not the MM who still suxx),if bombers managed to destroy the airfield on T3/4 it's because nobody wanted to climb at 5000/6000m to shot bombers, failed tactics, period. Everybody runs for the easy kills no tactics just a huge free for all, sometimes people BnZ your target rather than the boggys tailing you, etc...

I think that it's up to us, common player to change our behavior, not to the dev to change the game. Sometimes the game is broken like the yer's rush after 1.37, that change was needed because even with coordination we simply couldn't stop it, but i think this patch is just a gift to derpplayer. One of the huge flaws i find in arcade is teamplay is not rewarded, climbing up to cover bomber get 2/3 kills and managed to win the game with the bomber, you get 1K rp while the one who derp at low alt getting 10kills+, no ground units gets 3k... AS for the rest i'm not good enough to speak about FM, but like other i find it unfair that german planes must manage their heat engine and other don't, either every must manage it or nobody, and if you want to test it, use a test server, not the prod.

About MM and FM i don't know if the I 185 FM is correct or UFO, but if his FM is correct then his BR is too low like the yak3P with both of these i still manage to shot 109K fw190D and the like.

This game has huge potential i just hope that someday we will have proper FM, less grind, a working MM. It's possible but i'm not sure that gaijin will manage it, WT lost players (for what i have seen on EU serv it's around 5k during the week and 10K on week-end) since 1.37, i'm happy to see that they decided to communicate with their player bases. i hope that in the next few patch i could recommend this game again like i did in 1.35.