Games are simply too short! 3:34!!!

[Venatores 309]

It is ironic that victory and win squadron comment on this thread since their squadron is built around winning matches quickly. They always bomber spam and especially only play low tiers since they noticed they dont win enough at higher tiers

[sidchicken 721]

 

So this just happened... longest ground strike I've played in a loooong time.

[Alabama-Shrimp@psn 735]

I mainly play low tier air combat due to being poo and it's a novelty if a ground strike actually has bases to bombastic opposed to the normal vehicles. 

 

I'm not sure the whole problem with ground strike is the bomber spam but the fact that most of the targets are weak and can be killed by normal fighters just strafeing the ground. It's normal to see a non bomber pilot with 10-15 ground kit but no air kills. 

 

So why not just make more targets tanks that have to be hit with bombs or make their effect on the ticker less? How about some missions that are only bombing things like more factory's or other buildings as essentially nothings changed in ages. 

[sidchicken 721]

14 hours ago, *Alabama-Shrimp said:

I'm not sure the whole problem with ground strike is the bomber spam but the fact that most of the targets are weak and can be killed by normal fighters just strafeing the ground.

That's only true in [light vehicles] ground strike, which only happens at BR < 3.0 or thereabouts.  Beyond that there's a lot more tanks and the non-tank targets don't count toward victory.  Also the non light vehicles maps pretty much all have bases (Wake Island being a notable exception).

[Allesmeins 56]

Yes! They ARE! Above 5.0 simply is unplayable. They gotta fix this immediately but apparently they won't bother fixing anything

Edited November 3, 2016 by Allesmeins

[kireta21 795]

Ironically I think ne of reasons for Do 217 spam, is Do 217 parts grind, where bombload isn't worth much until plane is pretty much spaded. So rather than go after minibases or airfield, they spend most grind process racing others to GTs, because it's pretty much all they can kill with default bombs.

[sidchicken 721]

9 hours ago, kireta21 said:

Ironically I think ne of reasons for Do 217 spam, is Do 217 parts grind, where bombload isn't worth much until plane is pretty much spaded. So rather than go after minibases or airfield, they spend most grind process racing others to GTs, because it's pretty much all they can kill with default bombs.

Yeah, the default load is pretty awful.

[ArthurBloss 633]

Sure, there are those games where you get terror of the sky with 3 kills and then there are those games:

 

It shows two things:

1: you can still have plenty o fun in this game

2: the influence of fighter pilots on the game outcome is limited due to the amount of respawns the enemy gets.

We would probably have won the game if I had run out of fuel earlier in my fighter. Ditched it in a field seconds before the game ended.

 

[sardinha08@psn 3,179]

My first game after adding F8F-1B(6.3 BR) on my 5.3 BR US line:
 

So much fun, and when you talk about it there's always someone saying "then stop the Do's!", so easy to say...

[kireta21 795]

Just in case anyone doubts Ground Strike is straight up broken at high tier: Start of battle and WEP-diving bombers reaching minibases faster than our own fighters can reach them.

[CryoLew 89]

Late game DO17's kinda make a joke of all the other bombers

On 05/11/2016 at 5:26 PM, ArthurBloss said:

Sure, there are those games where you get terror of the sky with 3 kills and then there are those games:

 

It shows two things:

1: you can still have plenty o fun in this game

2: the influence of fighter pilots on the game outcome is limited due to the amount of respawns the enemy gets.

We would probably have won the game if I had run out of fuel earlier in my fighter. Ditched it in a field seconds before the game ended.

 

Firstly well played sir.

Secondly as much as Id hate it ..... I think 3 planes should be the limit.  Maybe 3 planes & 1 bomber. But yeah as a multi garage owner its not fair for other people cause Im not the agood yet I end up on top alot due to having more planes

 

[Game_Baron 402]

I find the "new" front line missions much better than the standard ground strike.

It has good things for every kind of player.

 

For bombers, they can chose between base attack and ground targets attack. Its similar to ground strike, but ground targets are much closer and easier to kill more than in traditional GS.

For fighters, it's similar to traditional domination matches with targets together and easier to shoot several planes in 1 match.

 

For all, it lasts longer than ground strike and every player can come out of it with a decent score.

 

I like front line missions a lot. I like them both when I play fighters or bombers. It's a win/win type of match.

[kireta21 795]

17 minutes ago, Game_Baron said:

Its similar to ground strike, but ground targets are much closer and easier to kill more than in traditional GS.

They're not bunched in groups. This means getting to them in WEP dive, and spamming spacebar is not going to achieve a lot. In result, large bombers tend to sneak above battle and go after bases and airfield, while frontline becomes domain of light bombers, close support planes and strike fighters, which are maneuverable enough to pick target after target.

 

This mode goes extinct at high BRs as well. There seem to be nothing but Ground Strikes and (rarely) single cap Dominations at 6.0. What a joke.

[Josephs_Piano 7,044]

12 minutes ago, kireta21 said:

They're not bunched in groups. This means getting to them in WEP dive, and spamming spacebar is not going to achieve a lot. In result, large bombers tend to sneak above battle and go after bases and airfield, while frontline becomes domain of light bombers, close support planes and strike fighters, which are maneuverable enough to pick target after target.

 

so pretty much as it should be then - I agree - great mode

[GeneralArmchair 675]

In my experience, it isn't bombers killing airfields that ends the match fast in ground strike missions.   Very rarely do I ever see the airfield itself die.   While a good chunk of the tickets are exhausted by the destruction of the mini-base.

 

It's the ground attackers mopping up ground targets that eats up the lion's share of the tickets.   I'd really like to see the number of ground targets required for victory in ground strike increased by 3-5 times or something.

[Light_Flight 269]

GeneralArmchair: Agreed. In my experience, the shortest games are those where a squadron attacks exclusively ground targets.

[Sokaku 43]

7 hours ago, GeneralArmchair said:

In my experience, it isn't bombers killing airfields that ends the match fast in ground strike missions.   Very rarely do I ever see the airfield itself die.   While a good chunk of the tickets are exhausted by the destruction of the mini-base.

 

It's the ground attackers mopping up ground targets that eats up the lion's share of the tickets.   I'd really like to see the number of ground targets required for victory in ground strike increased by 3-5 times or something.

 

IMO the issue is that with Ground Strike, it doesn't matter how many tickets you have, losing all flashing ground targets = immediate loss. Frontline has the ticket bleed, but it's so fast I doubt you'd ever see a team recover from it.

 

What I would like to see is Front Line and Ground Strike both operate similar to Front Line in that killing the flashing vehicles net a more significant ticket count than non-flashing secondary targets. Killing all flashing targets would start a very slow ticket bleed. The other team may have a higher, or lower ticket count, and the bleed would last several minutes to let a game close out and one team would be declared a winner either by ticket bleed out or end of match. The same would go for airfield & base destruction with a cumulative bleed effect, enough to end the game reasonably quickly. I'd probably add that with a destroyed airfield, planes couldn't be repaired. The "fastest" ticket bleed would be on loss of all aircraft, s a team that rushes to kill ground units might start a slow bleed, but the other team still has time left to take full domination of the area for a potential win. Bombers could strike both ground units and the airfield/bases to increase the bleed rate. At least a few games should go the distance, decided by remaining ticket count.  The objective would be to try and wrest control of the field from the enemy and either keep an advantage for the duration, or take complete control by destroying both sets of objectives or shooting down all planes.

 

I'd recently had a Domination game play out like this, and I can tell you it was exhilarating. Both teams were contending a 2 field map, my team got an early lead, but was "leaking planes". About half-way in we had 4 fewer planes than the enemy team and they were pressing back, securing one field and pressuring our remaining field. By the end my team was down to 3 planes vs. 8. 2 of us fought to defend our field while the 3rd headed off to pressure their field to draw players off. We managed to defend our field until the end of the match to hold on for the win.  IMO Domination is the fairest mode. Sure, games get lop-sided where only one team seems to know how to take objectives, but it definitely has the potential to live up to some epic games, win or lose.

[sidchicken 721]

4 hours ago, Sokaku said:

What I would like to see is Front Line and Ground Strike both operate similar to Front Line in that killing the flashing vehicles net a more significant ticket count than non-flashing secondary targets.

Pretty sure the non flashing targets in ground strike are worth no tickets at all.

 

You're proposing that completing the objective first (in the case of ground strike killing all the ground targets) should somehow not secure victory, which is kinda silly.  I can get behind proposals to make it more difficult to achieve that goal, but making the objecive not really the objective is kinda backwards IMO.

 

[Sokaku 43]

10 hours ago, sidchicken said:

Pretty sure the non flashing targets in ground strike are worth no tickets at all.

 

You're proposing that completing the objective first (in the case of ground strike killing all the ground targets) should somehow not secure victory, which is kinda silly.  I can get behind proposals to make it more difficult to achieve that goal, but making the objecive not really the objective is kinda backwards IMO.

 

 

It's not that it doesn't secure victory, it's just not an immediate victory guarantee. Case in point, if a team spawns in attackers to dive in at ground targets, there is little that another team can do to prevent it, you won't shoot them down before they strike. What I propose doesn't prevent them from doing it, or contributing to a win by doing it, only to secure the win they still have to defend their assets long enough for the lead to be finalized and the ticket bleed to run down.  As it stands now, these game modes are merely a race to kill ground targets.  Making ground targets harder to kill penalizes bombers and just turns games into fighter furballs. I feel the game needs to find a balanced mix of both. There should be games where ground targets are the objective to attack or defend, but not just set up to end the match the moment one team destroys all of the objectives. The other team may never be able to tip the balance in tickets even if they manage to kill the ground targets themselves, but players still have the opportunity to digfight & such down to the end. Others can leave the match, and provided that's after the 5-6 minute mark they aren't penalized with crew locks anyways.

 

[sidchicken 721]

On 11/12/2016 at 10:17 PM, Sokaku said:

As it stands now, these game modes are merely a race to kill ground targets.  Making ground targets harder to kill penalizes bombers and just turns games into fighter furballs.

Yes.  That's the mission - ground strike.  The game should not award you victory because you eliminated all the enemy aircraft AFTER they already eliminated all the targets you were supposed to be defending.  Making life a little harder for the bombers is a perfectly acceptable solution to this problem, or more accurately, making things scale for bombers - at Tier 1, it's HARD for bombers to take out the runway, requiring numerous passes, and even through late tier 2, the bases take multiple drops to bring down.  But as the tech level gets higher the bombers become so much more effective, to the point where one pass per base is enough, and then the airfield dies that much quicker as well.  Buff the HP of the bases, increase the number of required ground targets (so the game doesn't just turn into a lemming train for the tanks instead of lemming train for bases) and remove the GD ground unit auto-pop (the bombers DON'T need that help), and the games will last longer.  And if the game ends in a fighter battle because both sides lost all their bombers, that means the fighters did their job, doesn't it?

[SENAdmiral 2,030]

tier 4 and 5 become a sad joke: hordes of Tu4 (sometimes almost ALL team !!! ) AND Marte-like clouds from 500m up to 6k, make the perfect recipe for disaster: 2-3 min games and - example of how ridiculous the devs drive the game mechanics ! !  ; 

As a fighter pilot one feels humiliated by the actual game mechanics, who reward ONLY the bombers and make fighter pilots to become almost useless on this mod/game. A single bomber can easily gather (with almost no skeels involved! ) easily 150-250 000 lions & 5-15 000 RP IN A SINGLE GAME but a fighter even with a dozen kills will get - on best case - some 1/10 of that. 

 

 

 

 

Thank you Failjin for the russian version of "fast food video game".... 

Edited November 14, 2016 by SENAdmiral

[SENAdmiral 2,030]

at 7,7 8.0 BR now this its a common view: 90 % (!!!) of enemy team are on TU4 !  Until this its not fixed, the game its just a sad joke. All because of the (more then) obvious russian bias when it come to Tu4 .  

 

 

 

 

 

[l_AM_GOD 1,959]

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