The biggest problem

[cashmeowsidehbd 1,269]

I've been spawn camped before my plane actually showed on the screen before! How does anyone think you get a full 5 seconds of protection? When you re-spawn you are actually visible to the enemy before you even show up on the mini-map/radar. I guess we are learning here who are the spawn campers and the furball divers!

[Venatores 309]

Its not spawncamping, its spawnpushing. 

 

Questions about this? Watch theorangedoom's YouTube  video. 

[CloCloZ 375]

23 hours ago, HochgeborenKlown said:

You turned 5 sentences from me into a WOT, amazing!!...

 

It's because your sentences are typical of spawn camping apologists, so if you want to talk about that issue you have to make the picture clear, as I did.

 

By the way:

 

- "Your request to stop camping in AB, all planes in AB take off from the airfield..." is a statement that clearly shows you are talking about things you know nothing.

 

- it's so true that flak on german airfields was so lethal for Allied fighters that tried to shot down Me262s to the point they suspended that kind of attacks, to be cited even by Clostermann in "The Big Show".

 

- the statement "the advantage of what a P-47 or F4U can do, namely BnZ...Neither is noted for its turning ability which is what is needed in a furball" confirms that spawn campers choose just the planes allowing them to have easy kills (especially inexperienced newbies trying to climb in face of spawn campers) and less deaths even avoiding the furball, i.e. fighting where the AB main action is.
Q.E.D. and just another example of "egoistic" attitude neglecting team playing.

Even all the other opinions you wrote are so blatantly irrelevant or wrong that I won't waste further time arguing on them.

 

The fact is that, as Hohum33 wrote, Gaijin would very easily stop this sleaze if they would want.
But they don't want, just as it seems they don't want to stop kamikazeing in GF nothwithstanding the many uproars and the many suggestions received.
And I've learnt that when an easy and needed solution is not applied for long time, not just in a game but even in RL, it's always because someone, who could change things, is having benefit from the status quo.

I think this is another example.

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by CloCloZ

[cashmeowsidehbd 1,269]

4 minutes ago, CloCloZ said:

 

It's because your sentences are typical of spawn camping apologists, so if you want to talk about that issue you have to make the picture clear, as I did.

 

By the way:

 

- "Your request to stop camping in AB, all planes in AB take off from the airfield..." is a statement that clearly shows you are talking about things you know nothing.

 

- it's so true that flak on german airfields was so lethal for Allied fighters that tried to shot down Me262s to the point they suspended that kind of attacks, to be cited even by Clostermann in "The Big Show".

 

- the statement "the advantage of what a P-47 or F4U can do, namely BnZ...Neither is noted for its turning ability which is what is needed in a furball" confirms that spawn campers choose just the planes allowing them to have easy kills (especially inexperienced newbies trying to climb in face of spawn campers) and less deaths even avoiding the furball, i.e. fighting where the AB main action is.
Q.E.D. and just another example of "egoistic" attitude neglecting team playing.

Even all the other opinions you wrote are so blatantly irrelevant or wrong that I won't waste further time arguing on them.

 

The fact is that, as Hohum33 wrote, Gaijin would very easily stop this sleaze if they would want.
But they don't want, just as it seems they don't want to stop kamikazeing in GF nothwithstanding the many uproars and the many suggestions received.
And I've learnt that when an easy and needed solution is not applied for long time, not just in a game but even in RL, it's always because someone, who could change things, is having benefit from the status quo.

I think this is another example.

 

Like I said, they make money from allowing spawn camping. It's pretty dang obvious from their actions (or more correctly inactions) regarding this. Why people can still question this is beyond me. If they weren't making money from it, and they thought for a second that it was detrimental to their making money, the would put a stop to it. In fact they would have put a stop to it a loooong time ago when this thread was started. Obviously, spawn camping is to their benefit.

[HochgeborenKlown 1,276]

2 hours ago, CloCloZ said:

 

It's because your sentences are typical of spawn camping apologists, so if you want to talk about that issue you have to make the picture clear, as I did.

 

By the way:

 

- "Your request to stop camping in AB, all planes in AB take off from the airfield..." is a statement that clearly shows you are talking about things you know nothing.

 

- it's so true that flak on german airfields was so lethal for Allied fighters that tried to shot down Me262s to the point they suspended that kind of attacks, to be cited even by Clostermann in "The Big Show".

 

- the statement "the advantage of what a P-47 or F4U can do, namely BnZ...Neither is noted for its turning ability which is what is needed in a furball" confirms that spawn campers choose just the planes allowing them to have easy kills (especially inexperienced newbies trying to climb in face of spawn campers) and less deaths even avoiding the furball, i.e. fighting where the AB main action is.
Q.E.D. and just another example of "egoistic" attitude neglecting team playing.

Even all the other opinions you wrote are so blatantly irrelevant or wrong that I won't waste further time arguing on them.

 

The fact is that, as Hohum33 wrote, Gaijin would very easily stop this sleaze if they would want.
But they don't want, just as it seems they don't want to stop kamikazeing in GF nothwithstanding the many uproars and the many suggestions received.
And I've learnt that when an easy and needed solution is not applied for long time, not just in a game but even in RL, it's always because someone, who could change things, is having benefit from the status quo.

I think this is another example.

 

 

[PARAMI 478]

I think I've let this thread go far enough. From a post where I all but explicitly said wasn't about the way I play, my skill, my squadron, or SPAWNCAMPING, but instead a comment on the ignorance of the community, this thread becomes just another useless, redundant argument on spawncamping. Are you idiots completely unable to derive the meaning of a very simply written message, or are you too caught up with the three digits next to my name (the 100, for all the philistines who won't understand that), and the fact that I happened to use spawncamping as an example to supplement my argument, which is completely NOT about this topic, to come up with coherent, relevant responses?

 

I was hoping that you forum warriors would be able to understand a simple message, but all I managed to do was to prove my point that this community is ignorant beyond all measure and so firmly entrenched in its delusions/opinions that there is just no way to get a point across anymore. 103 replies about spawncamping of all things, which is a topic that has been argued in and out for years, isn't going to change anything. So stop wasting your time and stop arguing, unless any of you are willing to actually understand the meaning of my message. 

 

Want more proof? Just look at the next post down (What the What by little556). 15-2 in a pair of decent planes and you're CHEATING? People are so arrogant and so completely uninformed that they can't imagine how someone can do better than they can. And you guys can't see beyond your own noses when someone posts something different and meaningful because it's something you don't want to see. And being the people you are, you obviously spin it so it does, and the rest of the forum warriors get on the lemming train. Great. 

 

[CloCloZ 375]

30 minutes ago, PennyWort said:

I think I've let this thread go far enough.

 

 

IMHO, you are right in complaining that the thread deflected to off-topic, wrong about any other thing.
Quite a noteworthy performance.

 

43 minutes ago, HochgeborenKlown said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SneakySausage 786]

Penny

All online gaming communities are like this. The better players will always get hate mail accusing you of hacking, of cheating, or using unfair tactics/strategies. Warthunder has a larger learning curve than most other games, spanning from brs, matchmaking, factions to individual differences between planes and ground vehicles, from map to control set ups, arcade to realistic.

 

You can not expect new or casual players to ever want to familiarise themselves with all of this. I have always loved military history, so i was able to familiarise myself with most vehicles rather quickly and already knew there differences and yet this took me many months before i can really say that i knew what i was doing. I wont say that i have mastered the game tho, because i haven't, there are many things i still have to learn.

 

Most people in the war thunder community have only bad opinions of 100. from the case that i had pointed out before, to just regular chats i have with people you can see this. Most squadron battles i have against 100 usually begin with a one sided exchange of comments.  The truth is several 100 players are loud and obnoxious, throw in unlikable tactics (spawn camping, quitting after 1 death, using ''op'' vehicles) you will of course get a response to your forum posts of this nature.This post was talking about the mail that 100 gets and the ignorance regarding them, so we must examine the squadron and you must understand why such a group is not liked, and why any post you make regarding the ''toxicity of the community will be met with shall we say resistance.

 

I do not like the idea of 100 players 'teaching' newbies.The last thing i want in this game is more spawn campers and the obnoxious personalities i and many other have come across could influence the newer players. BUT i do like the idea of squadrons specialised in KDR, its harder than most would think to achieve these kinds of results. It gives another 'branch' to the game and in itself can be a fun way to play. I do have very similar beliefs to many ''objective based'' players to

 

YOU ARE RIGHT!!! People do not ask for help they just criticise, people dont go to the wiki, forums. youtube and so forth for there questions, people dont go look at the server replays either this isent restricted to air arcade, but is a problem across all modes. How do you think a forum topic will help i do not know

I help a few people here and there every now and then, but will not go out of my way to help, i never fancy myself a teacher 

 

[Hohum33 680]

3 hours ago, cashmeowsidehbd said:

Like I said, they make money from allowing spawn camping. 

 

How?

1 hour ago, PennyWort said:

I think I've let this thread go far enough. From a post where I all but explicitly said wasn't about the way I play, my skill, my squadron, or SPAWNCAMPING, but instead a comment on the ignorance of the community, this thread becomes just another useless, redundant argument on spawncamping. Are you idiots completely unable to derive the meaning of a very simply written message, or are you too caught up with the three digits next to my name (the 100, for all the philistines who won't understand that), and the fact that I happened to use spawncamping as an example to supplement my argument, which is completely NOT about this topic, to come up with coherent, relevant responses?

 

I was hoping that you forum warriors would be able to understand a simple message, but all I managed to do was to prove my point that this community is ignorant beyond all measure and so firmly entrenched in its delusions/opinions that there is just no way to get a point across anymore. 103 replies about spawncamping of all things, which is a topic that has been argued in and out for years, isn't going to change anything. So stop wasting your time and stop arguing, unless any of you are willing to actually understand the meaning of my message. 

 

Want more proof? Just look at the next post down (What the What by little556). 15-2 in a pair of decent planes and you're CHEATING? People are so arrogant and so completely uninformed that they can't imagine how someone can do better than they can. And you guys can't see beyond your own noses when someone posts something different and meaningful because it's something you don't want to see. And being the people you are, you obviously spin it so it does, and the rest of the forum warriors get on the lemming train. Great. 

 

 

If your intention was to encourage more people to learn; you will catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

[cashmeowsidehbd 1,269]

create demand! Allow better players an easy way to get kills, and at the same time frustrate new players into spending more to upgrade their weapons. By not separating by skill levels but by what can be bought, (i.e. better weapons), you are creating demand. Spawn camping plays in to this by frustrating new players to the point where they feel that they need to buy to get better.

[cashmeowsidehbd 1,269]

2 minutes ago, cashmeowsidehbd said:

create demand! Allow better players an easy way to get kills, and at the same time frustrate new players into spending more to upgrade their weapons. By not separating by skill levels but by what can be bought, (i.e. better weapons), you are creating demand. Spawn camping plays in to this by frustrating new players to the point where they feel that they need to buy to get better.

btw, it worked for me!

[Hohum33 680]

12 minutes ago, cashmeowsidehbd said:

create demand! Allow better players an easy way to get kills, and at the same time frustrate new players into spending more to upgrade their weapons. By not separating by skill levels but by what can be bought, (i.e. better weapons), you are creating demand. Spawn camping plays in to this by frustrating new players to the point where they feel that they need to buy to get better.

 

Buying stuff reduces grind, but absolutely nothing you can buy helps versus spawn camping. Nothing suggests it does.

[cashmeowsidehbd 1,269]

3 hours ago, Hohum33 said:

 

Buying stuff reduces grind, but absolutely nothing you can buy helps versus spawn camping. Nothing suggests it does.

No, not in game. But the frustration people get from being spawn camped makes them THINK they can do better against the spawn campers if they pay to upgrade without grinding. Like me. But after I spent some money I figured out that without assistance from my team members or my joining a spawn squad myself it's pretty much useless. So now I do what everyone else does, pay to upgrade lower tiered aircraft and troll the lower tiered games! I actually did a little spawn camping myself. If the red team can't climb up after a Ju-87 than they deserve a little spawn camping right?

[Hohum33 680]

I think that just reinforces the point the OP makes - that people need to learn better.

[CloCloZ 375]

The whole reasoning about money and spawn camping has to be reversed, IMHO.

It's not that "spawn campers push newbies to pay (to become better), so giving benefit to Gaijin" but "since spawn campers usually pay (we all know that experienced long-time players, especially belonging to squadrons, are addicted enough to put money in game), Gaijin protects them (by not changing spawn mechanism)".

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by CloCloZ

[GregKjr 520]

3 minutes ago, CloCloZ said:

The whole reasoning about money and spawn camping has to be reversed, IMHO.

It's not that "spawn campers push newbies to pay (to become better), so giving benefit to Gaijin" but "since spawn campers usually pay (we all know that experienced long-time players, especially belonging to squadrons, are addicted enough to put money in game), Gaijin protects them (by not changing spawn mechanism)".

 

Do you have data on that?

[CloCloZ 375]

46 minutes ago, GregKjr said:

Do you have data on that?

 

What data?

 

About the quota of spawn campers players that are paying players? Just Gaijin has that data and for sure don't make them known. But it doesn't need a genius to understand that the typical spawn camper belongs to the typical paying payer class and even of the "hard" type (experienced, often Level 100 or around, addicted, often fighting in a squadron etc.) and even the observation of spawn camping apologists in this Forum fully confirm that.

Not even it needs a particularly good observation skills to notice that in battle.

 

About Gaijin favouring paying players? The whole game and business logic too say that is true, spawn campers would be just one case amongst many.

 

About the fact that Gaijin is protecting spawn campers not changing the spawn mechanism? This is a fact so, yes, here I have even "data".

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by CloCloZ

[RolandofSalem 280]

Penny you are good at this game, but I really don't care much about that... I like flying with ya anyways.  It's not easy to be good at this game which makes you a target to many, but you just gotta deal with that as it comes with the territory. I like flying alongside and against people who are much better than I am...it helps me become a better player. I like flying with all the 100 guys because they are not condescending and have taught me a lot about the game. People who play this game have different levels of competency due to various reasons, so we can't all be great, but we can all be better. I'm not a fan of 100 just the people in it that I've flown with...it's not how good you guys are in game, I just think y'all are a bunch of nice guys.

 

...now tell MasterHyashi to please stop shooting me down.

 

: )

[Hohum33 680]

1 hour ago, CloCloZ said:

The whole reasoning about money and spawn camping has to be reversed, IMHO.

It's not that "spawn campers push newbies to pay (to become better), so giving benefit to Gaijin" but "since spawn campers usually pay (we all know that experienced long-time players, especially belonging to squadrons, are addicted enough to put money in game), Gaijin protects them (by not changing spawn mechanism)".

 

 

This seems like wild speculation.

[CloCloZ 375]

4 minutes ago, Hohum33 said:

 

This seems like wild speculation.

 

No, it's just logic coupled with observation.

 

A lot of people asks for "data", perfectly knowing that just Gaijin has those data and keep them confidential, just to not acknowledge what reason suggests. Usually because they don't like what reason suggests.

So they starts talking about "conspiracy theories" etc.

Deja vu.

 

 

[HochgeborenKlown 1,276]

46 minutes ago, CloCloZ said:

 

What data?

 

About the quota of spawn campers players that are paying players? Just Gaijin has that data and for sure don't make them known. But it doesn't need a genius to understand that the typical spawn camper belongs to the typical paying payer class and even of the "hard" type (experienced, often Level 100 or around, addicted, often fighting in a squadron etc.) and even the observation of spawn camping apologists in this Forum fully confirm that.

Not even it needs a particularly good observation skills to notice that in battle.

 

About Gaijin favouring paying players? The whole game and business logic too say that is true, spawn campers would be just one case amongst many.

 

About the fact that Gaijin is protecting spawn campers not changing the spawn mechanism? This is a fact so, yes, here I have even "data".

 

Anecdotal

Your opinion only, based on what you claim to have seen or not seen...Alt facts are not facts...

[CloCloZ 375]

10 minutes ago, HochgeborenKlown said:

Anecdotal

Your opinion only, based on what you claim to have seen or not seen...Alt facts are not facts...

 

ROTFL.

 

It's just some time I started thinking that there is just one thing as ridiculous as many aspects in WT: some of WT players and their ineptitude to recognize what this game is and why.

Then there is the other issue: WT players trying to convince themselves that the game is really what they like it would be.

Often those coincide in the same player.

 

A psychologist would have here a good subject of study.

 

Edited August 15, 2017 by CloCloZ

[HochgeborenKlown 1,276]

2 hours ago, CloCloZ said:

 

ROTFL.

 

It's just some time I started thinking that there is just one thing as ridiculous as many aspects in WT: some of WT players and their ineptitude to recognize what this game is and why.

Then there is the other issue: WT players trying to convince themselves that the game is really what they like it would be.

Often those coincide in the same player.

 

A psychologist would have here a good subject of study.

 

Also Anecdotal...Also pointless to respond to a troll any further...Got better things to do...Roll on...

[Pat_McGherkin 2,074]

@PennyWort

People don't pm you for advice because you'd give the wrong advice. 

 

They would pm you on the premise that you've just spawncamped them and killed them repeatedly. Every spawn camper in the game gives the following solution to dealing with spawn campers:

 

'Dive away, side climb and return to deal with spawn campers'.

 

Wrong advice.

 

This is exactly what spawn campers want; more easy kills, less players attacking objectives, a greater chance for an all too rare win.

 

What chance does a player who is inexperienced enough to be killed repeatedly at spawn have at taking on a squad of spawn campers? None.

 

But the crux of your posting this thread is this..

 

You happily make players' game time a miserable experience to the point of being proud of it and expect to be seen as a pillar of this community. 

 

That's the real ignorance in this thread.

 

You, and your fellow spawn campers, make no distinction between inexperienced players, near total newcomers and players that just have 20 minutes to kill and want to chill out and shoot stuff to unwind after a stressful day.

 

A high KDR through spawn camping gives you the right to claim some things (some more dubious than others) but it gives no claim to be an all-encompassing WT guru with great intentions towards the improvement of a greater well-being.

 

Spawn campers are blind to the consequences of their actions or, more likely, they know the consequences of their actions exactly and yet they continue to spawn camp anyway. That portrays a personality that isn't going to help when asked. So why ask.

 

 

I'm so far from a great pilot it's not funny and yet I get the occasional pm from players I have played against or alongside, asking to squad or asking for help and I'll happily give any advice on topics I feel I can help with. If I don't feel l have the expertise to counsel on a given subject I'll admit to it and suggest other options for learning.

 

So if I get pm's for advice, whilst anonymously sat behind my keyboard, and you don't whilst sat anonymously behind yours - send yourself a pm and ask 'what's the difference?'.

[Venatores 309]

Even when i (pro100 member) am 5km away from the spawn they message me with all kinds of swear words. Mostly including cheater and spawn camper. So it does not really matter how far you are from their spawn. They will always resort to these names eventhough you are just using an altitude advantage. 

Players dont know how to look around. Nor do they know when they pull up they will loose speed. Basics of air combat?

Most are too stuck on killing tanks that they forget that there are also red enemy fighters around. Then they get upset that some enemy fighters actually know how to shoot down a plane? Perhaps be less focused on the silly objective and embrace the beauty of air combat vs an actual player instead of an ai steared tank that anyone can kill. 

Edited August 15, 2017 by Venatores