tanks/vehicles Swedish Konigstiger [Tiger II]

[I_Am_Bob224 142]

The Swedish Konigstiger:
[Small Update 2019]

The Swedish Tiger II, a PzKpfw. VI Ausf.B finding its way into Swedish hands around 1947, but the differences between this and a normal Tiger II (P) make its story more mysterious

 

 

General Background: 
 

Sweden generally remained Neutral during the World War, also helping both sides out in indirect ways, they however also developed tanks and AT guns during the war. After the war between 1946 and 1947, the Swedish military sent people across Europe to acquire fully or semi-intact German Tanks for testing. The military wanted to see how effectively AT mines could damage or destroy heavy tanks, and how Swedish AT guns could fight modern armor. After acquiring a Panther the Konigstiger the Swedish were looking for was found in Gein, located south of Paris, and was transported to Stockholm Harbor. It arrived on November 27th, 1947 and was transferred to the P4 Regiment.

 

 

Origin and Design Differences:

There are several theories about the origin of this machine.

The first theory is because of its Porche turret, a one-piece monobloc gun tube, a binocular “Turmzeilfernrohr 9b/1” sighting telescope and armored covers over the wading equipment, it could have belonged to either the PanzerKompanie Funklenk 316, which was part of the Panzer Lehr, or the 1./sPz.Abt. 503, due to the fact that both of these were equipped with Königstigers of these characteristics and fighting in France in 1944. 

Another counter-argument is that both units fought in Normandy and then was transported to Gein by French forces as a trophy. The last theory is that the Swedish Tiger was one of the initial prototypes of the Tiger B that the French forces captured at Kummersdorf (South of Berlin). There are two known prototypes of the Tiger, the V1, and V2. The V2 was currently in the hands of the British (at the time) shared some similarities with this one. The lack of Zimmerit is one but the frontal mudguards and lack of hinges make it slightly different, the V2 also lacked a pistol port while the Konigstiger had it, this makes extremely unlikely it was one of the Tiger B prototypes.

 

A feature of the Konigstiger is its unique exhaust pipes at the back of the tank, they are larger and horizontal rather than the normal vertical pipes on the Tiger II, and the lack of Zimmerit makes it strangely unique.

 

Regular Tiger II vs Swedish Konigstiger:

 

In War Thunder:

It would be a 6.3 Premium German Tank [Rank IV] costing 6,090 gold. It would have normal premium bonuses for RP and Credits, or this could be an event tank of the same BR and Rank. I believe this would be a unique addition to the game with its strange backstory and its weird changes from a normal Tiger II. It would have the exact same stats as the Tiger II [P] Currently in game.

Edit In 2019: It would most likely be [Rank IV] For 6,090 Gold and be in the Swedish Tree. Most likely a simple Premiumn if Sweden dosent have any for Rank IV when GF Releases, or a Small Event to give away some nice vehicles.

 

Artist Impression [David Bocquelet]:

 

 

Fate:

 

Throughout 1949, the vehicle was subject to mine detonations and a barrage tests to gauge the strength of the Köingstiger armor and the effectiveness of Swedish ammunition. By November-December, this intense firepower turned the vehicle into a small pile of scrap that would have fitted into “the backseat of a Volkswagen Beetle” and what was left of the hull was scrapped and the turret being sent to the firing range in Kråk to be used as a target practice. The gun, which at this point had finally been removed, was kept for some time in Karlsborg until it was sent to the Bofors HQ in Karlskoga, where it remained until eventually being scrapped in the late 80’s. Unfortunately, two weeks later a member of the Swedish Armour Historical Society arrived enquiring about the gun. Had they arrived a fortnight earlier, the Kwk 43 would quite likely be found today at Arsenalen. Apparently, the only pieces remaining were the original motor, the gearbox, and the commander’s hatch, though there is no concrete evidence as to where these can be found today. [Taken from Tanks-Encyclopedia]

 

Caravan transporting the Konigstiger from Skovde to Karlsborg:

Two photos of the Tiger B named ’12’ from the PanzerKompanie Funklenk 316:

This example is considered to be the Swedish Königstiger by several online tank forums, however, there is no concrete evidence supporting this.

 

Sources:

• http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/coldwar/Sweden/SwedishKonigstiger
• http://www.achtungpanzer.com/the-swedish-pzkpfw-vi-ausf-b-knigstiger.htm
• http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/nazi_germany/Panzer-VI_Konigstiger.php
• Antonio Carrasco, Königstiger en combate (Madrid: Almena, 2013)

• Thomas L. Jentz and Hilary L. Doyle, Germany’s Tiger Tanks VK 45.02 to Tiger II: Design, Production & Modifications

 

Other Posts:

 

 

Edited January 26, 2020 by I_Am_Bob224
Spelling Errors

[CherryBlossom 4,210]

Open for discussion. 

[Kazumi_ 6,575]

I support it heavily, since we already have a premium variation of the Tiger II(H) using a diesel engine and with even more segments of track placed upon the turret and an MG34 (or MG42, I cannot recall for the life of me) mounted on the roof.

 

So why not?

[Admiral_Aruon 2,264]

this would be a good addition to the Fennoscandiavian tech tree suggestion. +1

 

 

[kissHUN 73]

another copy paste tank... pointless.

[igeticsu 3,400]

What would be the point of it? They denied the Swedish TT, and I don't want copy & paste vehicles in the first place.. So no :/ Nice suggestion though.

[Rohrkrepiererer 1,393]

Nein.

[Nope 10,634]

Another Tiger II for Germany? Seems like a potentially bad idea if that's the case, unless another nation gets hold of that.

[dotEXCEL 5,969]

and why exactly do we need another ctrl+c tank?

[seadogpirate@psn 888]

+1 but I would rather have it for the general tree. 

[Admiral_Aruon 2,264]

15 hours ago, igeticsu said:

What would be the point of it? They denied the Swedish TT, and I don't want copy & paste vehicles in the first place.. So no :/ Nice suggestion though.

 

they denied a Swedish TT for the same reason they originally denied a Japanese GF. thanks to Blockhaj and the addition of the rest of Europe's great white north, that myth is more than busted.

[CoMurey2 131]

18 hours ago, dotEXCEL said:

and why exactly do we need another ctrl+c tank?

Honestly I was thinking in the same way. a copy tank?! maybe yes if the Swedish get it's own tree. then that tank will fill a space.

[igeticsu 3,400]

5 hours ago, Admiral_Aruon said:

 

they denied a Swedish TT for the same reason they originally denied a Japanese GF. thanks to Blockhaj and the addition of the rest of Europe's great white north, that myth is more than busted.

They denied the Swedish TT quite recently tho... If that isn't and indication that it won't come anytime soon, then I don't know what is.

[dotEXCEL 5,969]

2 hours ago, CoMurey2 said:

Honestly I was thinking in the same way. a copy tank?! maybe yes if the Swedish get it's own tree. then that tank will fill a space.

na, will be a premium, i know our great snail too well...

[pieve 3,578]

Konigstiger to be first premium tank on Swedish line

[KorEEnium 2,533]

No. We don't need another copy paste tank. Also instead of swedish tech tree shouldn't it be in the german tech tree? After all this is the prototype Fgst. Nr.V2.

 

[Admiral_Aruon 2,264]

On 12/23/2017 at 6:28 AM, igeticsu said:

They denied the Swedish TT quite recently tho... If that isn't and indication that it won't come anytime soon, then I don't know what is.

 

yeah but that's just sweden. half the tech trees these days are semi-composites anyways what with the US lend-leasing/exporting everything. sweden lumped in with the rest of the scandis and finland and potentially all the foreign equipment they all acquired via whatever means (cent mk.3, finnish panzers, tiger II, BT-5/BT-42, etc.) makes for a surprisingly well filled out tree if Blockhaj's spreadsheet lists are anything to go by.

Edited December 25, 2017 by Admiral_Aruon

[Wolf_89 2,525]

Only in a Swedish tech tree. As a limited time Prem tank(Good old cash grab )

[Sp15 266]

While i wouldnt be 100% against the idea i cant say im a fan. We basically got it to shoot it to pieces it couldnt even run properly due to a damaged gearbox iirc.
Besides i doubt they would add the other Swedish heavy tank option so i think its kinda pointless.

[kamikazi21358 998]

Yes, in the Swedish tree.

[kamikazi21358 998]

Also we should petition for the Tiger IIs in game to revive the name “Königstiger”, infinitely cooler name.

[Delta_48 471]

Hmmm.... I have no issue with this, especially with its interesting origins

[Comrad-Kruschev@psn 822]

On 21/12/2017 at 08:54, I_Am_Bob224 said:

The Swedish Konigstiger:

The Swedish Tiger II, a PzKpfw. VI Ausf.B finding its way into Swedish hands around 1947, but the differences between this and a normal Tiger II (P) make its story more mysterious

 

 

General Background: 

Sweden generally remained Neutral during the World War, also helping both sides out in indirect ways, they however also developed tanks and AT guns during the war. After the war between 1946 and 1947, the Swedish military sent people across Europe to acquire fully or semi-intact German Tanks for testing. The military wanted to see how effectively AT mines could damage or destroy heavy tanks, and how Swedish AT guns could fight modern armor. After acquiring a Panther the Konigstiger the Swedish were looking for was found in Gein, located south of Paris, and was transported to Stockholm Harbor. It arrived on November 27th, 1947 and was transferred to the P4 Regiment.

 

 

Origin and Design Differences:

There are several theories about the origin of this machine. The first theory is because of its Porche turret, a one-piece monobloc gun tube, a binocular “Turmzeilfernrohr 9b/1” sighting telescope and armored covers over the wading equipment, it could have belonged to either the PanzerKompanie Funklenk 316, which was part of the Panzer Lehr, or the 1./sPz.Abt. 503, due to the fact that both of these were equipped with Königstigers of these characteristics and fighting in France in 1944. Another counter-argument is that both units fought in Normandy and then was transported to Gein by French forces as a trophy. The last theory is that the Swedish Tiger was one of the initial prototypes of the Tiger B that the French forces captured at Kummersdorf (South of Berlin). There are two known prototypes of the Tiger, the V1, and V2. The V2 was currently in the hands of the British (at the time) shared some similarities with this one. The lack of Zimmerit is one but the frontal mudguards and lack of hinges make it slightly different, the V2 also lacked a pistol port while the Konigstiger had it, this makes extremely unlikely it was one of the Tiger B prototypes.

 

A feature of the Konigstiger is its unique exhaust pipes at the back of the tank, they are larger and horizontal rather than the normal vertical pipes on the Tiger II, and the lack of Zimmerit makes it strangely unique.

 

Regular Tiger II:

Swedish Konigstiger:

 

In War Thunder:

It would be a 6.3 Premium German Tank [Rank IV] costing 6,090 gold. It would have normal premium bonuses for RP and Credits, or this could be an event tank of the same BR and Rank. I believe this would be a unique addition to the game with its strange backstory and its weird changes from a normal Tiger II. It would have the exact same stats as the Tiger II [P] Currently in game.

Artist Impression [David Bocquelet]:

Fate:

Throughout 1949, the vehicle was subject to mine detonations and a barrage tests to gauge the strength of the Köingstiger armor and the effectiveness of Swedish ammunition. By November-December, this intense firepower turned the vehicle into a small pile of scrap that would have fitted into “the backseat of a Volkswagen Beetle” and what was left of the hull was scrapped and the turret being sent to the firing range in Kråk to be used as a target practice. The gun, which at this point had finally been removed, was kept for some time in Karlsborg until it was sent to the Bofors HQ in Karlskoga, where it remained until eventually being scrapped in the late 80’s. Unfortunately, two weeks later a member of the Swedish Armour Historical Society arrived enquiring about the gun. Had they arrived a fortnight earlier, the Kwk 43 would quite likely be found today at Arsenalen. Apparently, the only pieces remaining were the original motor, the gearbox, and the commander’s hatch, though there is no concrete evidence as to where these can be found today. [Taken from Tanks-Encyclopedia]

Caravan transporting the Konigstiger from Skovde to Karlsborg:

Two photos of the Tiger B named ’12’ from the PanzerKompanie Funklenk 316:

This example is considered to be the Swedish Königstiger by several online tank forums, however, there is no concrete evidence supporting this.

 

Sources:

• http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/coldwar/Sweden/SwedishKonigstiger
• http://www.achtungpanzer.com/the-swedish-pzkpfw-vi-ausf-b-knigstiger.htm
• http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/nazi_germany/Panzer-VI_Konigstiger.php
• Antonio Carrasco, Königstiger en combate (Madrid: Almena, 2013)

• Thomas L. Jentz and Hilary L. Doyle, Germany’s Tiger Tanks VK 45.02 to Tiger II: Design, Production & Modifications

 

Other Posts:

 

 

No, simply because the swedes only acquired 1 of them and that was after the war for munitions testing. Yes we already have captured vehicles in the game, some are sensible T-34-747r, T-V, KV-II-754r, T-III ect.... But most however, should never have made it in game in the first place.

Edited October 15, 2018 by *Comrad-Kruschev

[Delta_48 471]

21 hours ago, *Comrad-Kruschev said:

No, simply because the swedes only acquired 1 of them and that was after the war for munitions testing. Yes we already have captured vehicles in the game, some are sensible T-34-747r, T-V, KV-II-754r, T-III ect.... But most however, should never have made it in game in the first place.

I mean, this is most likely gonna be a German premium (unless they confirm Swedish tree), and it's just a Swedish Tiger II.... so it's not really a captured vehicle

Edited October 16, 2018 by Delta_48

[kamikazi21358 998]

4 minutes ago, Delta_48 said:

I mean, this is most likely gonna be a German premium (unless they confirm Swedish tree), and it's just a Swedish Tiger II.... so it's not really a captured vehicle

They indirectly have - someone asked them about a Chinese or a Swedish tech tree coming, and they actually said they may consider it for 2019.