BMP-2 (GDR) - Tier 6 East German Infantry Fighting Vehicle

[Borotovas 4,500]

  

East German BMP-2

This suggestion is for adding the BMP-2 into the German tech tree at tier 6. East Germany is very poorly represented in War Thunder, however East Germany was a major part of the Cold War, as Germany was divided into East and West, and was legally two separate countries. It is only natural, that both East and West Germany be properly represented in War Thunder as part of the German nation. There are already several vehicles from East Germany in the game, such as the MiG-15, Mi-24, and various ships in naval forces. If we already have a partial representation of East Germany, I see no reason to not have a full representation of East Germany in War Thunder, and a further extension by adding East German ground vehicles such as the BMP-2 to Germany. It is unfair to East German fans, that only West German vehicles are being added into the German tier 5 and tier 6. We do not want to play any West German vehicles, and would prefer to only use East German vehicles in the German tree which actually saw full service and were built in greater numbers.

 

The BMP-2 is a good start for adding a good representation of East Germany into War Thunder. The BMP-2 would be a tier 6 troop carrier, and Germany does not have any historical troop carriers currently in the game. People might say that the "Begleitpanzer 57 AIFSV" is a German infantry vehicle and that the BMP-2 is not needed, however the 57 is purely a fantasy vehicle with only one prototype produced. The BMP-2 was a real vehicle, which was produced in greater numbers. The BMP-2 also saw military combat, granted not with East Germany, however it was proven in combat.

 

The BMP-2 would be identical to the already existing Soviet BMP-2 that is in the game. The main difference would be that this vehicle would have the East German NVA roundel painted on the turret for representation. This would make this vehicle easy to add for the developers.

 

The BMP-2 would be an 8.0 BR vehicle, the same as for the Soviet tech tree. The BMP-2 would be after the Jagdtiger, and before the Begleitpanzer 57. The Begleitpanzer 57 is an 8.3 vehicle, so the BMP-2 would fit perfectly before it.

 

Historically, East Germany received a total of 24 BMP-2s, yet had over 1,000 BMP-1s. So, it is assumed if East Germany existed for a longer amount of time, they would have ordered more.

 

A question that might arise is "Why does Germany need Soviet vehicles?" West Germany has the: M47, KPZ-70 (semi American tank), M48, and possibly will get more in the future. So, it is understandable that East German vehicles should be added as well.

 

Specifications

Spoiler

Crew	3
Troop Capacity	7 passengers
Combat Weight (mt)	14.3
Chassis Length Overall (m)	6.72
Height Overall (m)	2.45
Width Overall (m)	3.15
Ground Pressure (kg/cm 2 )	0.63
Automotive Performance
Engine Type	300-hp Diesel
Cruising Range (km)	600
Speed (km/h)
Max Road	65
Max Off-Road	45
Average Cross-Country	35
Max Swim	7
Fording Depth (m)	Amphibious
Radio	R-123M transceiver or R-173
Protection
Armor, Turret Front (mm)	23-33
Applique Armor (mm)	On BMP-2D
Explosive Reactive Armor (mm)	Available
Active Protective System	N/A
Mineclearing Equipment	KMT-8 mine plow available
Self-Entrenching Blade	N/A
NBC Protection System	Collective
Smoke Equipment	6 smoke grenade launchers, VEESS
ARMAMENT
Main Armament
Caliber, Type, Name	30-mm automatic gun, 2A42
Rate of Fire (rd/min)	550 cyclic in bursts/ 200-300 practical
Loader Type	Dual-belt feed
Ready/Stowed Rounds	500/0
Elevation (�)	-5 to +74
Fire on Move	Yes
Auxiliary Weapon
Caliber, Type, Name	7.62-mm (7.62x 54R) machinegun, PKT
Mount Type	Turret coax
Maximum Aimed Range (m)	2,000
Max Effective Range (m)
Day	1,000
Night	INA
Fire on Move	Yes
Rate of Fire (rd/min)	250 practical/650 cyclic, 2-10 round bursts
ATGM Launcher
Name	9P135M1/M3
Launch Method	Tube-launched
Guidance	SACLOS
Command Link	Wire
Launcher Dismountable	Yes
Firing Port	4 on left side, 3 on right side 1 in left rear door
FIRE CONTROL
FCS Name	BPK-1-42 or BPK-2-42
Main Gun Stabilization	2-plane
Rangefinder	Laser
Infrared Searchlight	Yes
Sights w/Magnification
Gunner
Day	BPK-1-42 or BPK-2-42
Field of View (�)	8
Acquisition Range (m)	2,500-4,000 (est)
Night	BPK-1-42 or BPK-2-42 II/IR
Field of View (�)	INA
Acquisition Range (m)	INA
Commander Fire Main Gun	No
MAIN ARMAMENT AMMUNITION
Caliber, Type, Name
30-mm AP-T
Maximum Aimed Range (m)	2,500
Max Effective Range (m)
Day	1,500
Night	INA
Tactical AA Range	4,000
Armor Penetration (mm)	18 (RHA, 60�) at 1,500 m
30-mm APDS
Maximum Aimed Range (m)	2,500
Max Effective Range (m)
Day	2,000
Night	INA
Tactical AA Range	4,000
Armor Penetration (mm)	25 (RHA) at 1,500m
30-mm APFSDS-T M929
Maximum Aimed Range (m)	2,500
Max Effective Range (m)
Day	2,000+
Night	INA
Tactical AA Range	4,000
Armor penetration (mm)	55 (RHA) at 1,000m/45 at 2,000m
30-mm Frag-HE
Maximum Aimed Range (m)	4,000/ 2,500 point target
Max Effective Range (m)
Day	4,000
Night	INA
Tactical AA Range	4,000
Armor Penetration (mm)	INA
Other Ammunition Types	30-mm HEI-T
Antitank Guided Missiles
Name	AT-5/SPANDREL
Warhead Type	Shaped charge (HEAT)
Armor Penetration (mm)	650 (RHA)
Range (m)	4,000
Name	AT-5B/Konkurs-M
Warhead Type	Tandem shaped charge (HEAT)
Armor Penetration (mm)	925 (RHA)
Range (m)	4,000
Name	AT-4/SPIGOT
Warhead Type	Shaped charge (HEAT)
Armor Penetration (mm)	480 (RHA)
Range (m)	2,000
Name	AT-4B/Factoria
Warhead Type	Tandem shaped charge (HEAT)
Armor Penetration (mm)	550 (RHA)
Range (m)	2,500

 

East German Camouflages And Paint Schemes

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

Blueprints

Spoiler

 

Sources:

Spoiler

 

https://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/row/bmp-2.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMP-2

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/30_mm_automatic_cannon_2A42

http://armscom.net/products/30mm_apfsds_t_m929

http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/coldwar/USSR/BMP-2.php

 

 

Edited December 16, 2018 by Borotovas

[Princess_Pinch 5,625]

Open for discussion. o7

[TheTurtleTanker 1,167]

Are we modeling West or East Germany? They get Sabres and MiGs. They get Leopard tanks. They get Hinds, Hueys and even French helicopters. Such a mess of a tech tree. I'd say no to adding this, since the German tech tree already seems a lot more catered towards modeling West Germany (Leopard tanks, RU 251, Sabres, Huey, that French chopper, Raketenjagdpanzers, not-WWII Gepard and the Begleitpanzer 57 with TOW ATGMs to name a few). Just add the Marder series of IFVs to counter the other IFVs.

[MyWaifuIsKeqing 756]

How about put the East German garbage in the USSR Tech Tree and the West German stuff in the German Tech Tree.

[Borotovas 4,500]

1 hour ago, TheTurtleTanker said:

Are we modeling West or East Germany? They get Sabres and MiGs. They get Leopard tanks. They get Hinds, Hueys and even French helicopters. Such a mess of a tech tree. I'd say no to adding this, since the German tech tree already seems a lot more catered towards modeling West Germany (Leopard tanks, RU 251, Sabres, Huey, that French chopper, Raketenjagdpanzers, not-WWII Gepard and the Begleitpanzer 57 with TOW ATGMs to name a few). Just add the Marder series of IFVs to counter the other IFVs.

 

Modeling both would be the best, and separating them in battle.

 

Why do I have to be forced to research West German vehicles when I am finished with researching the Wehrmacht? I want to use East German vehicles, and not West German vehicles. West German vehicles are also usually fantasy tanks and half baked prototypes.

 

1 hour ago, _Amatsukaze said:

How about put the East German garbage in the USSR Tech Tree and the West German stuff in the German Tech Tree.

 

Since the BMP-2 is already in the USSR tree, you are inferring that the GDR BMP-2 would be a premium. Why do West German fans get to have American tanks in the German tree, but if you want East German units you have to pay to play. Doesn't make sense.

 

By that logic, all American tanks in the German tree should also be moved to the American tree. Which you don't seem too fond of suggesting.

Edited December 17, 2018 by Borotovas

[Stuhlfleisch 3,762]

I fully support this suggestion, the BMP-2 would be a great support vehicle for German groundforces. +1 

Edited December 17, 2018 by Stuhlfleisch

[Borotovas 4,500]

17 hours ago, Stuhlfleisch said:

I fully support this suggestion, the BMP-2 would be a great support vehicle for German groundforces. +1 

 

Thank you for your support!

[kamikazi21358 998]

+1

 

I don’t care about all the hate East German suggestions get, East Germany is still Germany.

 

I can only wait 30 minutes for a SB battle so many times before I start to get salty.  I would love East Germany to come and support us Russian tank players.

 

 

Not to mention, I bet East German aircraft are about to become more common, since we’re going full coldwar now and — frankly West Germany didn’t have quite the arsenal compared to their ground forces when it comes to aircraft diversity, I bet we may see MiG-17s and IL-28s now, etc.

 

 

 

 

Also I think East Germany could be a possibility, because now if you look next to the name of the vehicles, you now see flags of the country of origin.  Perhaps this could be used in the future to separate West and East in Realistic Battles?

 

 

 

Another option would be an “East German tab” that can be unlocked once you reach say rank 3 or so, like helicopters, and you can start buying T-34s and PT-76s and stuff.  This could be a second way to separate the two, where RB and SB will have separate East vs West lineups (AB I bet nobody cares really).

[WulfPack 1,693]

Eh as long as it gets matched with the USSR in RB and SB

[MyWaifuIsKeqing 756]

9 minutes ago, WulfPack said:

Eh as long as it gets matched with the USSR in RB and SB

Honestly, East German stuff should be in the USSR Tech Tree.

[WulfPack 1,693]

17 minutes ago, _Amatsukaze said:

Honestly, East German stuff should be in the USSR Tech Tree.

Unless they were skins, I can't see duplicate vehicles working 

[kamikazi21358 998]

1 hour ago, _Amatsukaze said:

Honestly, East German stuff should be in the USSR Tech Tree.

No.  I am tired of the long que times.  East German line/tab and eventually China is a must, we need more Warsaw Pact forces in other trees, so popular trees such as Germany have the ability to play with the Russian side.  And eventually, hopefully this could also lead to more realistic team matchups in RB too — who tf actually likes US, UK, Japan vs USSR, Germany, and France?

 

 

Not to mention it is East GERMANY.

Edited December 19, 2018 by kamikazi21358

[Borotovas 4,500]

5 hours ago, kamikazi21358 said:

No.  I am tired of the long que times.  East German line/tab and eventually China is a must, we need more Warsaw Pact forces in other trees, so popular trees such as Germany have the ability to play with the Russian side.  And eventually, hopefully this could also lead to more realistic team matchups in RB too — who tf actually likes US, UK, Japan vs USSR, Germany, and France?

 

 

Not to mention it is East GERMANY.

 

I missed the que times as one of the reasons to add East German vehicles. I will add that as another reason why. 

 

China is too much of a copy and paste nation. It's more realistic having socialist Romanian tanks in the Italian tree, since we already have Romanian planes in the Italian tree.

 

 

7 hours ago, WulfPack said:

Unless they were skins, I can't see duplicate vehicles working 

 

It's a bit silly having a Soviet T-55 in the Soviet tree, and an East German T-55 in the same tree right next to the Soviet T-55. It doesn't work in theory, and it sure won't work in reality. 

[onemax9000 1,243]

I support +1

[WulfPack 1,693]

On 19/12/2018 at 02:50, Borotovas said:

China is too much of a copy and paste nation.

That's unfortunate, since their are some Chinese AFVs that'd I'd like to see.

[Borotovas 4,500]

6 hours ago, WulfPack said:

That's unfortunate, since their are some Chinese AFVs that'd I'd like to see.

 

Which Chinese AFVs would you want to see?

[WulfPack 1,693]

46 minutes ago, Borotovas said:

 

Which Chinese AFVs would you want to see?

Things like the Type-89, Type-88, ZBD-08, ZBL-08, Type-96. The more unique ones.

[Borotovas 4,500]

2 hours ago, WulfPack said:

Things like the Type-89, Type-88, ZBD-08, ZBL-08, Type-96. The more unique ones.

 

I don't see how those could be added. I don't think they would belong in the USSR tech tree, since China did not like the USSR. I don't think the Chinese tree would get a lot of demand from players, so Gaijin may not want to add it. Most Chinese people play on the Chinese version of War Thunder, so the entire player base for that nation is not here.

 

China is not in the same situation as East Germany in the game.

Edited December 21, 2018 by Borotovas

[User94998549 2,838]

I'm completely and utterly against it.

 

GER tree is a farse, especially it's top tier and you want to make it even more of a farse.

 

What's the point of grinding other nations when you get everything best in one tree by playing Germany? From MiG-15 to Mi-24 to all the low tier Soviet tanks and if you and your buddies had your way through all the demands for Soviet vehicles (T-72, T-55, BMP, etc.) in what as actually a West Germany tree. Did you know that GER players pay 30% less for MiG-15 bis and it's crew than the players of it's original tree? Not only does GER have a vehicle it shouldn't have in the first place, but it's also significantly cheaper than Soviet to buy and train.

 

You want BMP-2? Play USSR and stick appropriate decals on it. Had there been war NVA would've been integrated under USSR command to begin with, there wouldn't have been an independent East Germany military.

 

Low tier is bad enough already (especially in SB) with the flood of "captured" T-34s, OP KV-1Bs with 75mm cannon and more armor (in event against KV-1 L11 and T-34 1942), KV-2s, Shermans and so on (and with conspicuous lack of Soviet prem Tigers, Tiger 2Hs, Panthers that anyone can buy, Pz IVs and so on); I definitely don't want to be seeing non-Soviet Soviet tanks in high tier as well. There is no way to split a tree and have only select vehicles serve on one side of an SB event, while the rest serve on the other side. USSR is scr-wed in top tier SB as it is already (alone against US+UK+ITA+FR+GER).

[User94998549 2,838]

On 21. december 2018 at 04:41, Borotovas said:

I don't see how those could be added.

 

To sum up the rest of your post: your arguments hold no water and no validity. Chinese vehicles could easily be added into Soviet tree AS THEY HAVE BEEN ALREADY.

 

On 21. december 2018 at 04:41, Borotovas said:

I don't think they would belong in the USSR tech tree, since China did not like the USSR.

 

So? West Germans didn't like East Germans either, especially after they got them back...

 

On 21. december 2018 at 04:41, Borotovas said:

I don't think the Chinese tree would get a lot of demand from players, so Gaijin may not want to add it.

 

Ever heard of Type-62 and Type-65?

 

On 21. december 2018 at 04:41, Borotovas said:

Most Chinese people play on the Chinese version of War Thunder, so the entire player base for that nation is not here.

 

Um, you're wrong there.

 

On 21. december 2018 at 04:41, Borotovas said:

 

China is not in the same situation as East Germany in the game.

 

You're right, China for one actually has grounds to demand it's vehicles because they actually had their own designs or just modifications, instead of just slapping their own stickers onto Soviet tanks without changing anything like East Germany did...

 

Pesonally I want USSR tree expanded into Communist block tree to encompass other nations like Yugoslavia, China, Czechoslovakia, Poland and so on, especially without them having to be premium vehicles.

[Borotovas 4,500]

12 hours ago, jackTIGR said:

I'm completely and utterly against it.

 

GER tree is a farse, especially it's top tier and you want to make it even more of a farse.

 

What's the point of grinding other nations when you get everything best in one tree by playing Germany? From MiG-15 to Mi-24 to all the low tier Soviet tanks and if you and your buddies had your way through all the demands for Soviet vehicles (T-72, T-55, BMP, etc.) in what as actually a West Germany tree. Did you know that GER players pay 30% less for MiG-15 bis and it's crew than the players of it's original tree? Not only does GER have a vehicle it shouldn't have in the first place, but it's also significantly cheaper than Soviet to buy and train.

 

You want BMP-2? Play USSR and stick appropriate decals on it. Had there been war NVA would've been integrated under USSR command to begin with, there wouldn't have been an independent East Germany military.

 

Low tier is bad enough already (especially in SB) with the flood of "captured" T-34s, OP KV-1Bs with 75mm cannon and more armor (in event against KV-1 L11 and T-34 1942), KV-2s, Shermans and so on (and with conspicuous lack of Soviet prem Tigers, Tiger 2Hs, Panthers that anyone can buy, Pz IVs and so on); I definitely don't want to be seeing non-Soviet Soviet tanks in high tier as well. There is no way to split a tree and have only select vehicles serve on one side of an SB event, while the rest serve on the other side. USSR is scr-wed in top tier SB as it is already (alone against US+UK+ITA+FR+GER).

 

How exactly is the German tree a farce?

 

So you are saying that every German aircraft is the best. From the Fw 190 to the Bf 109 to the Arado 234. Most other nations do not have Bf 109s or Arado 234s or Fw 190s. Most other nations don't have Tiger tanks. Germany is a unique nations, with very unique vehicles for each tier, that demonstrates the history of Germany through the tiers.

 

The Third Reich is not West Germany. Try flying Third Reich flags in Germany today (continuation of West Germany) and you will be arrested. East and West Germany was built on the ruins of the Third Reich, and it is not a state nor ideological continuation of the Third Reich. West Germany and East Germany are both equal occupiers of the Third Reich, therefore both should be equally represented as such.

 

The majority of post WWII German vehicles were foreign built. It's silly to assume that only West German vehicles should be added.

 

East Germany was apart of the Warsaw Pact, therefore efforts would be coordinated with the USSR. However, the USSR would not take over control of East Germany in the event of a war.

 

I'm sure that splitting the German tree into East and West is the easiest thing that could happen. It shouldn't take more than a day for Gaijin to do.

 

11 hours ago, jackTIGR said:

 

To sum up the rest of your post: your arguments hold no water and no validity. Chinese vehicles could easily be added into Soviet tree AS THEY HAVE BEEN ALREADY.

 

 

So? West Germans didn't like East Germans either, especially after they got them back...

 

 

Ever heard of Type-62 and Type-65?

 

 

Um, you're wrong there.

 

 

You're right, China for one actually has grounds to demand it's vehicles because they actually had their own designs or just modifications, instead of just slapping their own stickers onto Soviet tanks without changing anything like East Germany did...

 

Pesonally I want USSR tree expanded into Communist block tree to encompass other nations like Yugoslavia, China, Czechoslovakia, Poland and so on, especially without them having to be premium vehicles.

 

What Chinese vehicles are in the Soviet tree? I don't see any.

 

East and West would be split.

 

Those are just irrelevant event gifts.

 

If I am wrong, then why is there a Chinese client.

 

The majority of Chinese vehicles would be exactly the same as Soviet vehicles, except with Chinese markings. There were only one or two Chinese vehicles that had modifications.

Edited December 26, 2018 by Borotovas

[kamikazi21358 998]

On 19/12/2018 at 01:50, Borotovas said:

I missed the que times as one of the reasons to add East German vehicles. I will add that as another reason why.

Because I am tired of the T-55 meaning

“Time in que = 55 minutes”.

On 25/12/2018 at 08:11, jackTIGR said:

You want BMP-2? Play USSR and stick appropriate decals on it. Had there been war NVA would've been integrated under USSR command to begin with, there wouldn't have been an independent East Germany military.

I would like to, but 25 minutes a match isn’t exactly ideal.

 

On 25/12/2018 at 08:11, jackTIGR said:

There is no way to split a tree and have only select vehicles serve on one side of an SB event, while the rest serve on the other side. USSR is scr-wed in top tier SB as it is already (alone against US+UK+ITA+FR+GER).

Actually there is.  We already have a visual stat: different nation vehicles have different flags to indicate their nation of origin.  Centurion Mk.10 has British flag, while Strv 81 has Swedish flag, while the Sho’t has an Israeli flag.  Like the Panther and Königstiger have a Nazi-German like flag (without swastika obviously), the CL-13 and Ru-251 has a West German flag — and the Mi-24D and MiG-15bis has a East German flag.

 

So we already have visual differences, why not a matchmaker difference?  Why not put them in a separate tab, or have a value not allowing them together in RB and SB?

 

It’s a programmable video game, if they can program ponies with jet packs and laser cannons, I think they can come up with a separation device for East and West Germany.

 

Plus keep in mind, I can pretty much say with 90% confidence we’ll see more East German air vehicles: yeah they can get G.91s and F4s and such, but I think we know that West Germany doesn’t have an airforce like the USAF or the RAF, or the Soviet Air Force, etc.  I would not be at all surprised if Germany gets like a MiG-17F or something in the near future.  So it would be beneficial to get the separation between EandW anyways.

 

So if you separate East and West — I don’t understand really, why is everyone against it other than that one problem?

 

(Before you say VeHIclE UniQueNeSs, East Germany doesn’t get the best of each vehicle class, plus I couldn’t care less — I would love to fly my IL-28 next to a German IL-28, it would be a step to a more historical high tier matchmaker, since there is only one tree you have to go down to play Warsaw Pact vehicles and UK-Japan-US-Italy vs USSR-France-Germany-whatever matches are starting to get old.  Plus add a Sherman to every tech tree in the game, nobody bats an eye, suggest a T-34 in anything not the Soviet tree, everybody looses their mind.)

 

 

~~~~~~~~~

 

 

As for China, they’ve already hinted before a possible Chinese tech tree on the main server, including hinting that in 2019 we’ll probably either get a Swedish tech tree or a Chinese tech tree.

 

Yeah it would have a lot of Soviet copy-paste vehicles rank 1-4 or so — don’t like it?  Don’t play it.  They would assumably be match up with the communist factions in game.

 

Rank 4, 5, and 6 expecially, they do get their own vehicles.  They only have the largest military on the planet — we’re not asking for a North Vietnamese tech tree or whatever.

 

 

~~~~~~~~~

 

 

In most cases, my motto usually is:

is it in the timeframe of War Thunder?

was it produced?

was it used?

will it cause a problem?  If so, can it easily be fixed?

(bonus) — will it help the game?

-if yes, then “Why not?”

 

East Germany:

-yes, East German vehicle’s existed, by the thousands.

-not in combat, but they were in active service and would have been used in a WW3 Europe scenario.

-yes, they cause a problem: potentially Russian vehicles vs Russian vehicles.

-is it solvable? Yes: separate MM for east and west, which would fix some current jet high tier stuff too.

-(bonus) will it help?  Yes, players from a popular tree being able to participate on the WP side in SB may help reduce que times, also more communist factions may help in the future with potentially more realistic matchmaking in Realistic Battles?

Conclusion: “Why not?”

 

[Borotovas 4,500]

2 hours ago, kamikazi21358 said:

As for China, they’ve already hinted before a possible Chinese tech tree on the main server, including hinting that in 2019 we’ll probably either get a Swedish tech tree or a Chinese tech tree.

 

Yeah it would have a lot of Soviet copy-paste vehicles rank 1-4 or so — don’t like it?  Don’t play it.  They would assumably be match up with the communist factions in game.

 

Rank 4, 5, and 6 expecially, they do get their own vehicles.  They only have the largest military on the planet — we’re not asking for a North Vietnamese tech tree or whatever.

 

China began building a lot of its own vehicles after WWII, and nowadays they build a lot of their own military equipment. The Chinese tree may work if WT adds a Tier 6 and Tier 7, so that we can get unique Chinese built modern vehicles.

 

That gave me an idea, we may be able to get North Vietnamese tanks and North Korean tanks within a Chinese tree, since I think China supported those sides during the Korean War and the Vietnam War. It would then be like a tree for Socialist Asian states.

 

Spoiler

 

 

Edited December 28, 2018 by Borotovas

[kamikazi21358 998]

On 28/12/2018 at 01:13, Borotovas said:

 

China began building a lot of its own vehicles after WWII, and nowadays they build a lot of their own military equipment. The Chinese tree may work if WT adds a Tier 6 and Tier 7, so that we can get unique Chinese built modern vehicles.

 

That gave me an idea, we may be able to get North Vietnamese tanks and North Korean tanks within a Chinese tree, since I think China supported those sides during the Korean War and the Vietnam War. It would then be like a tree for Socialist Asian states.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

I completely agree with this too, I didn’t think of Vietnam but I did suggest North Korean tanks before for a Chinese tech tree — they are probably the closest thing to an ally they got and fought on the same side during the first Korean War.

 

It has been pointed out before, I don’t know if it will be an issue though if getting information on DPRK tanks will prove difficult or not.  But it might be a good way to get vehicles like the Ch'ŏnma-ho or whatever in game, to have a North Korean line in the Chinese tech tree.

 

They perhaps can do the same with Vietnam as mentioned, or any other communist Asian country potentially.

Perhaps as it is suggested to have like the Italian tree to have other minor axis European powers, or a potential Swedish tree to be a Scandinavian tree with Findland as well, the Chinese tree could contain Pacific and Asian communist nations.  I did before suggest, since they would be on the same side in a WW3 Asia scenario and in the same region, perhaps using the Japanese tech tree, which admit, will never be a full tech tree for tanks (it’s an Island nation), it could be helped filled by adding South Korea and perhaps some SEATO nations, which South Korea’s ‘70-80s MBTs would help give Japan another composite armoured tank other than the Type 90, but I would also understand why it would get pushback since South Korea and Japan have a... interesting past.

 

But these could be potential ways to get more smaller nations represented in game.

[Aerobane 4,140]

I appreciate the effort put into this suggestion, but Germany has lots of light vehicles already: the TAM, Bagel, heck even ru 251 in a pinch. They don't need more copypaste vehicles that will mess with immersion and seriously break sim battles.

Reasons to add it: Its cool for German players who want to play the top of the Russian tree but don't want to grind out the lower tiers.

Reasons not to add it: Devalues the Russian tanks, screws up sim battles (bmp vs bmp with no markers yuck), hurts immersion, not necessary.

 

I'm down for a premium east German BMP 2 in the Russian tree once we inevitably get to tier VI premiums, but not in the German tree. Its bad enough with the "everybody gets a huey, a hind, a p47, and five different shermans" thing going on, lets not add the BMP to that disaster.

IF gaijin implements split matchmaking for captured vehicles in nations, then I'd be ok with this. BUT. I think adding it because "gaijin can then fix the matchmaking" is a terrible idea. They didn't fix sim matchmaking when they added the italian M26s, Sherman fireflies, etc. No reason to believe that adding this will make it happen. The MM must be fixed FIRST.