Republic P-47D-25

[DSRT888 1,603]

I wanna why does War Thunder doesn't add the P 47N Thunderbolt. It is final version of the "Jug" which is much faster than the P 47D and also with larger fuel load.How the Hell can the P 47N does not appear in War Thunder.And I hope it can be placed in rank 11 if it appear.

Its on the release tree and MORE fuel is bad thing in WT.

The  P-47D should be rank 12 and the P-47N rank 15. 

[SunsetShimmers 7,929]

Its on the release tree and MORE fuel is bad thing in WT.

The  P-47D should be rank 12 and the P-47N rank 15. 

 

Not gonna happen: the P-47D is barely competitive at Tier 9 as it is. Even the Devs are aware of that; see the the massive 110% AB reward bonus on the P-47D-25.

 

If it were accurately tiered by performance, it would be Tier 7 or 8.

 

If it were at Tier 12, it would end up with a 200% or greater AB reward bonus, and nobody in their right mind would use it for anything but suicide attacks on ground targets.

[Taranok 3,920]

Its on the release tree and MORE fuel is bad thing in WT.

The  P-47D should be rank 12 and the P-47N rank 15. 

 

I'm actually curious as to why.  While the P-47D was a great diver, it wasn't exactly the strongest plane out there.  Its maneuver wasn't stellar (though not a slouch, either) and the major noteworthy thing about it is that it can take a massive beating.  Everything I've seen from using the plane is that it's actually, genuinely outclassed by BF 109s and FW 190s in every way even though it can technically hold its own in skilled hands.  The plane should be tier 8, not tier 12.  Hell, not even the P-51D deserves to be tier 12 (nevermind the current 13) just due to how the game is right now.

 

So, really, why does the D deserve to be fighting Focke Wulfs, late model yaks, and in general planes that are better than it in every regard except maybe tankability (if the P-47's damage model is ever fixed) when it is still sub-par at tier 9 compared to its competitors even a mere tier lower than it.

 

The P-47 is more on par with an F4U 1A or 1D than it is a yak 9P.

[Salen_Stormwing 737]

Here's something for the folks looking for some P-47 info...

 

A Design Analysis of the P-47.

 

It covers a good amount of technical data about the design of the aircraft in all sorts of ways, so if you're looking for some info on mechanical specifics, this is a good place to look. Like on that Supercharger, or the movement range of the control surfaces.

[Bullfrog_ 3,180]

Its on the release tree and MORE fuel is bad thing in WT.

The  P-47D should be rank 12 and the P-47N rank 15. 

100% agree, the P47D should be above 10, below 13. 

Personally, I want the P47D to fly with my P51D. But I've fought against tier 16 Germans back in 1.31 days when they had no competition and always getting matched up with lower tier, and it handled fine. This is when it had a really poor FM. 

If the P47D gets 150 High octane, (what it's climb rate resembles is 150, but other attributes don't), along with more historical flight characteristics It could easily handle planes around tier 10-13 margin.

It's note-able that the P47 could out beat the Fw190, that start at tier 11 in game. P-47C is a good tier 9 plane, or arguably, the P-47D-11 (witch was pretty much a P-47C) should be 9, as the D25 should be tier 12.


If the US gets long range escort spawns, then they should diffidently put these planes at tier 13. They can fill in the gap, with earlier variants of these aircraft that had lower fuel capabilities and require them to start on the airstrip. 

For example, the P-47D-15 is the D model that got extended fuel capabilities for extended range. So a P-47D-11 or less would start on the airstrip, and the P-47D-15 or greater would start in the escort spawns. 

[DEATHSTRIKE 53]

The P-47 is probably one of my favourite WWII planes, but the game has given me a plane that can be out-paced by almost everything, out-gunned, out-climmed, out-turned, but what i dont get it the fact that the Thunderbolt takes maybe a handfull of machine gun rounds before it explodes.

 

This is what really annoys me about the stats on this plane, the Thunderbolt was sapposed to be one of the hardest to kill planes of WWII due to sheer amount of armour and that it could take round after round and keep functioning but no, no, the game has it that a mere handful of rounds will render it useless.

 

Game designers please FIX IT. I want my flying tank.

[Rumpullpus 3,883]

The P-47 is probably one of my favourite WWII planes, but the game has given me a plane that can be out-paced by almost everything, out-gunned, out-climmed, out-turned, but what i dont get it the fact that the Thunderbolt takes maybe a handfull of machine gun rounds before it explodes.

 

This is what really annoys me about the stats on this plane, the Thunderbolt was sapposed to be one of the hardest to kill planes of WWII due to sheer amount of armour and that it could take round after round and keep functioning but no, no, the game has it that a mere handful of rounds will render it useless.

 

Game designers please FIX IT. I want my flying tank.

in reality only the engine was a flying tank, the rest of the plane was sturdy, but not so armored that it could take 10x20mm hits and not feel it.

[Heliosiah 4,718]

in reality only the engine was a flying tank, the rest of the plane was sturdy, but not so armored that it could take 10x20mm hits and not feel it.

People fail to realize that multiple connections from 17 grams of high explosives to an exposed area is going to cause damage. A majority of P-47's that survived such hits, crashed landed on the airfield back home due to the damage. The difference being that in game, people are going to follow you until they get lions. Another difference is mouse aim exponentially increases accuracy and exposure time.

 

Now this isn't to say that the DM of the P-47 is incorrect in areas. Such as the fact that its tail can fall completely off from being shot, the B-17 suffers the same thing. This should almost never happen. 

[Rumpullpus 3,883]

People fail to realize that multiple connections from 17 grams of high explosives to an exposed area is going to cause damage. A majority of P-47's that survived such hits, crashed landed on the airfield back home due to the damage. The difference being that in game, people are going to follow you until they get lions. Another difference is mouse aim exponentially increases accuracy and exposure time.

 

Now this isn't to say that the DM of the P-47 is incorrect in areas. Such as the fact that its tail can fall completely off from being shot, the B-17 suffers the same thing. This should almost never happen. 

or the fact that the engine catches on fire and never goes out until you have a crispy critter for a pilot...

[Heliosiah 4,718]

or the fact that the engine catches on fire and never goes out until you have a crispy critter for a pilot...

I have almost never had my engine catch on fire. 

[Rumpullpus 3,883]

really?? damn your lucky. mine catches on fire ALL the time and never goes out. just keeps burning forever...

[DEATHSTRIKE 53]

I realise that the p47 was not an indestructible aircraft but the "POINT" i was trying to make was that the p47 in game can only take a handful of >MACHINE GUN ROUNDS< before it just falls apart into a million pieces.  Yes i get that there are a whole lot of different factors to the game, but when i get hit at all the plane takes so much damage it is rediculous.

 

This plane was know to be really hard to bring down its one of the reasons the americans built so many of them the fact that it could take hit after hit and keep flying, nice little piece of trivia it was americas most built fighter of WWII and im pretty sure they wouldnt have kept building to that point if when it recieved no more bullets than i have fingers the plane was crippled and would crash.

 

Like yes i get its not the best plane to have flown in WWII but i know it did four things really well:

1. Going fast in a straight line.

2. Climb at a really high rate.

3. Putting out alot of damage with the 8 50.cal's it sported and the ground loadouts it could take.

4. Taking ALOT of punishment.

 

And thats the whole point im trying to make not its stats in real life down to the exact .000001 of a percent of being accurate, but that at the moment in >GAME< the plane is like a flying a wet cardboard cutout it dies easily, TO EASILY TO EVERYTING, the amount of punishment it can take is pathetic, woefull, depressing and downright dissapointing. It was a plane that was more sturdy than almost any other fighter in the War so why is it that in game it is the complete opposite.

 

Again i would really appreciate it if this would be fixed ASAP.

[DEATHSTRIKE 53]

really?? damn your lucky. mine catches on fire ALL the time and ever goes out. just keeps burning forever...

Point in case the P47 could catch fire but some of the great features was one it was an air cooled engine so it didnt have to worry as much aout engine overheating or catching fire as apposed to liquid cooled and that the fuel tank was self ceiling which again help drasticly to prevent the plane from burning up. And there are so many other planes that can take punishment from alot of rounds machine gun or cannon.

 

• Most notably the Japnese H6k4 bomber i have never seen a plane take so many rounds and still fly no matter what i seem to hit or from what direction i try to take it on it keeps going.
• The British Beaufighter attacker/bomber besides its nearly unparalled ability to dish out damge, climb and dive it can take some insane amount of punishment before it drops unless some very precise shots are placed with a cannon.
• The American B-25 is a rugged and hard to bring down plane.
• The Russian Su-2 and IL-2 are very difficult to bring down to sheer amount of rounds required.
• The Japanese Ki-45 is again similar to the beaufighter deals large amounts of damage very fast climb and dive but also has the ability to take rounds after rounds and not feel them.

 

And with this list of planes that is fine these planes were know to be hard to bring down, but i have never gone past a book, seen a documentery or heard an account that didnt say of how tough, rugged, hard to kill and reliable the P47 was with taking punishment. But in game it takes the slightest amounts of rounds to bring the plane down. The plane was so tough that in some cases it was known to have lived through hundreds of machine gun and cannon rounds from a fight and still make it out and back to base.

The game obviously shows that there are a good number of planes to chose that can take a beating, but the game has missed probably "THE" plane from the war that was the most reliable and tough plane of the war the P47.

[Oshirigami 46]

The other point is that planes that turn good turn even better in the game, while the P-47 isn't any more survivable. It should be unrealistically survivable in arcade to make up for how easy it is to aim in arcade.

 

In some cases planes should be balanced around how they are "perceived" instead of how they really are, as the P-47 can't turn which its its character but it never had to fight UFOs historically, as far as I'm aware.

[DeRaptir 294]

 it never had to fight UFOs historically, as far as I'm aware.

 

The government still hasn't told you?

[Grampa_ 218]

People fail to realize that multiple connections from 17 grams of high explosives to an exposed area is going to cause damage. A majority of P-47's that survived such hits, crashed landed on the airfield back home due to the damage. The difference being that in game, people are going to follow you until they get lions. Another difference is mouse aim exponentially increases accuracy and exposure time.

 

Now this isn't to say that the DM of the P-47 is incorrect in areas. Such as the fact that its tail can fall completely off from being shot, the B-17 suffers the same thing. This should almost never happen. 

The Luftwaffe studying the B-17 took an average of 20 20mm cannon rounds to bring it down, but they also determined the average pilot got hits of 2% so that 1,000 rounds had to be fired at it.  Larger cannon s would require less hits, but the 2% rule would still apply.

 

If the large B-17 4 engine Bomber needed an average of 20 cannon rounds to bring down then how many would it take to bring down?  

[Volksjaeger 944]

horse shit, it sucks balls, whoever was responsible for this bs fm, needs to be fire NOW!

[SunsetShimmers 7,929]

The Luftwaffe studying the B-17 took an average of 20 20mm cannon rounds to bring it down, but they also determined the average pilot got hits of 2% so that 1,000 rounds had to be fired at it.  Larger cannon s would require less hits, but the 2% rule would still apply.

 

If the large B-17 4 engine Bomber needed an average of 20 cannon rounds to bring down then how many would it take to bring down?  

 

No, the Luftwaffe study said the B-17 took an average of 25x 20mm hits, while other 4 engine bomber types took an average of 18x to 20x 20mm hits to down.

[Heliosiah 4,718]

No, the Luftwaffe study said the B-17 took an average of 25x 20mm hits, while other 4 engine bomber types took an average of 18x to 20x 20mm hits to down.

More than 20 for an MG FF, about 20 for an MG 151. Even less when the Rheinmetall Borsigs 30mm was added.

[SunsetShimmers 7,929]

More than 20 for an MG FF, about 20 for an MG 151. Even less when the Rheinmetall Borsigs 30mm was added.

 

Only 4-5x 30mm MK 108 hits were needed.

[Rumpullpus 3,883]

here's a good document comparing the performance of the P47 to a captured FW-190. evidently the 190 was captured is fairly good condition and is interesting that the two aircraft were so close to each other performance wise.

 

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/p-47/P-47_versus_FW-190.pdf

[DSRT888 1,603]

So how is the FM going? 

 

Not rushing just curious. 

[Cacti 218]

here's a good document comparing the performance of the P47 to a captured FW-190. evidently the 190 was captured is fairly good condition and is interesting that the two aircraft were so close to each other performance wise.

 

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/p-47/P-47_versus_FW-190.pdf

and yet it is outclassed by the 190 in every way imaginable, including durability which was as everybody outside of mother russia knows was the hallmark of the p47

[Barrikad8 353]

Sorry, wrong thread. :facepalm:

Edited February 25, 2014 by ALTON8

[Cpt_Branko 9,698]

and yet it is outclassed by the 190 in every way imaginable, including durability which was as everybody outside of mother russia knows was the hallmark of the p47

 

The Russians certainly did know about it. They had about 100-150 P-47Ds roughly, which they deemed unsuitable for frontline aviation due to lackluster maneuverability and performance below 6km. It was however useful to see how US turbochargers worked and from an engineering point of view they appreciated the quality.

 

While P-47 isn't an aircraft I "click with" ingame (and neither is the FW-190, so far), it's certainly not bad. Durability is so/so, the plane is a bit overly vulnerable to rifle caliber, maybe. Cannons bringing it down in short order is to be expected. Perhaps other planes skewer the perception, compared to some, the P-47 is indeed fragile.

 

Having a tough radial engine doesn't really matter, for instance, if an inline doesn't get disabled in a realistic fashion after a few machinegun hits or a cannon hit in the engine compartment.

Edited February 25, 2014 by Cpt_Branko