Panzer I Ausf. C : a Panzer I with some bite (kinda...)

[Shepard_FR 546]

 

Hi,

 

The Panzer I series of tanks are not the most thrillings models of German machines that may be proposed into the game.

Indeed, those vehicles (excluding SPGs variants) were equiped with rifle caliber machineguns, never meant to engage hostile armor... Except one Panzer I variant, the Ausf. C.

 

 

While remaining a pocket recon tank, the Panzer I Ausf. C adopted a new design compared to the previous variants : the hull is boxy and thicker, and the turret is a bit larger, with a different shape.

The Ausf. C is also different from any previous or future Panzer I variants with its weapons : while other Panzer Is have dual MG 34 machineguns in their turrets, this one trades one machinegun for a EW 141 7.92x94mm semi-automatic cannon (EW = Einbauwaffe, replacement weapon).

 

The EW 141 uses the same round as the Panzerbüchse 38 or 39 anti-tank rifles : the 7.92x94mm Patronen round.

The cannon could send a 14.6g bullet with a tungsten core at 1160m/s. This could defeat around 25mm of armour angled at 30°, at a range of 100m. Sure, this is not great, but some higher caliber cannons sitting at 1.0 can't even do that (I'm looking at you SA18...).

 

Panzer I Ausf. C :

 

 

Crew : 2 (driver and gunner)
Weight : 8,1 metric tonnes
Dimensions :

- Length : 4,19m

- Width : 1,92m

- Height : 2,01 m
Armement : 1 x 7,92x94 mm EW 141 semi-auto cannon, 1 x 7,92x57 mm MG 34 coaxial machinegun
Gun elevation/depression : -10° to +20°

Optics : TZF 10
Armor :

- Front (hull and turret) : 30mm

- Sides and rear (hull and turret) : 20mm

- Roof (hull and turret) and floor : 10mm
Engine : Maybach HL 45P, 150hp at 3800 rev/min
Max speed : 79 km/h on road

Number built : 40

 

EW 141 cannon :

 

 

Weapon's length : 1670mm

Barrel's length : 1085mm

Weight : 30.2kg

Crew needed to operate : 1

Ammo used : 7.92x94mm Patronen

Ammo weight : 86g

Projectile weight : 14.6g

Muzzle velocity : 1160m/s

Firing modes : semi-auto

Rate of fire : 100 shots/min

 

This tank could be added at 1.0 in the German tech tree (maybe as a new reserve) before the Panzer IIs in the main tech tree.

 

What do you guys think about this ? Thank you for your attention.

 

Sources :

http://www.materielsterrestres39-45.fr/fr/index.php/chars-de-l-axe-allemagne/102-chars-legers/pz-kpfw-i-sd-kfz-101/346-panzerkampfwagen-i-ausf-c-vk-601 (In French)

http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/nazi_germany/Panzer_I.php

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.92×94mm_Patronen

[Princess_Pinch 5,625]

Open for discussion. 

[Shepard_FR 546]

9 minutes ago, Princess_Pinch said:

Open for discussion. 

 

Cheers

[Milocat 4,857]

+1.  This would be an interesting vehicle to see but the main gun would have to act like a machine gun (just hold down the trigger and spray rounds) to be really effective.

 

Still, it's very cool, and it's a Panzer 1 that would actually work in game, so I love it.

[Stuhlfleisch 3,762]

Absolutely, I would love to see this little tank added to the German tech-tree! +1

[Valcour 1,141]

+1  

 

[Ghostmaxi 873]

yes , but what ammo did it use? and what was the penetration AND cince it still is 7.92 mm will it be effected by the Penetration calculation system?

[Josephs_Piano 7,044]

1 hour ago, Ghostmaxi said:

yes , but what ammo did it use? and what was the penetration AND cince it still is 7.92 mm will it be effected by the Penetration calculation system?

 

as per the OP!!

 

Quote

The EW 141 uses the same round as the Panzerbüchse 38 or 39 anti-tank rifles : the 7.92x94mm Patronen round.

 

Technical data for this round is easy to find - start at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.92×94mm_Patronen

[Ghostmaxi 873]

Eh yo I want to know what to fight with :o

[Stuhlfleisch 3,762]

11 hours ago, Ghostmaxi said:

yes , but what ammo did it use? and what was the penetration AND cince it still is 7.92 mm will it be effected by the Penetration calculation system?

Using the standard Gaijin calculator and the projectile info given in this suggestion, I got a penetration-value of roughly 33mm. 

[Ghostmaxi 873]

5 hours ago, Stuhlfleisch said:

Using the standard Gaijin calculator and the projectile info given in this suggestion, I got a penetration-value of roughly 33mm. 

thats pretty much **** with 100 r/m

[Stuhlfleisch 3,762]

34 minutes ago, Ghostmaxi said:

thats pretty much **** with 100 r/m

You can still perforate quite a few rank 1.0-2.0 vehicles with that amount of pen. 

[Ghostmaxi 873]

32 minutes ago, Stuhlfleisch said:

You can still perforate quite a few rank 1.0-2.0 vehicles with that amount of pen. 

i dont think 2.0 , the french have often 35 mm or 30 angled the american have lots of angled 25+ and the russans ok

but every shot counts , there is NO spalling , its 7.92 mm and only 100 r/m

Edited July 8, 2019 by Ghostmaxi

[Stuhlfleisch 3,762]

6 minutes ago, Ghostmaxi said:

i dont think 2.0 , the french have often 35 mm or 30 angled the american have lots of angled 25+ and the russans ok

but every shot counts , there is NO spalling , its 7.92 mm and only 100 r/m

Maybe good as 0.7 :P

[Ghostmaxi 873]

23 minutes ago, Stuhlfleisch said:

Maybe good as 0.7 :P

yes

 

[Wolf_89 2,525]

Would be a perfect start on a Light tank/vehicles line for Germany.

Germany can support a Light tank/vehicles line. And i do hope they will get one.

Same for all the other nations that also can support a Light tank/vehicles line.

[eleks12 1,079]

+1 I wanna use this as as a source for my World war 1/Interwar suggestion that i should have ready by the end off the month!

[Shepard_FR 546]

7 minutes ago, eleks12 said:

+1 I wanna use this as as a source for my World war 1/Interwar suggestion that i should have ready by the end off the month!

 

Trees extending to World War 1 ? You already have my support !

[PrussianOwl 442]

+1 support. What's with all the Pz. I threads though? Not complaining honestly

[PrussianOwl 442]

On 08/07/2019 at 14:35, eleks12 said:

+1 I wanna use this as as a source for my World war 1/Interwar suggestion that i should have ready by the end off the month!

Sounds like a winner to me! I've been trying to make that a thing for quite a while

[Admiral_Aruon 2,264]

all for it. a cool little bit of quirky history with an anti-tank MG. certainly not the worst 1.0 we will have seen. 

 

 

On 08/07/2019 at 07:28, Stuhlfleisch said:

Maybe good as 0.7 :P

meanwhile in russia, the GAZ 4M AAA be like:

[cfracas 1,708]

+1

I support this, although I think the easiest German light tank to be introduced in game right now would be the Pz.II ausf G (VK 9.01)... basically Pz.Sfl.Ic with a 20mm + 7.92mm MG armed turret

[Stuhlfleisch 3,762]

8 hours ago, Admiral_Aruon said:

all for it. a cool little bit of quirky history with an anti-tank MG. certainly not the worst 1.0 we will have seen. 

 

 

meanwhile in russia, the GAZ 4M AAA be like:

~snip~

I mean, at least the GAZ 4M AAA has 4x machine-guns

[Zombificus 793]

Definitely want this in the game. It’s small, it’s fast, and it’s got enough AP to be really dangerous if you let it get in a good position. It’s likely to be pretty stable on the move with its gun, so unlike many other tanks it could make full use of its mobility. 

 

I do think its armament is good enough to make it viable, especially considering its speed, but it would be nice if Gaijin would relax their “no Scouts below 2.0” rule and gave the Pz.I C scouting along with the other weaker T1 vehicles. For example, France has AMR ZT-3 and Italy has L3/33, both vehicles that (like Pz.I C) can struggle against the strongest opponents and would do much better if they could score points by scouting as well. 

[Admiral_Aruon 2,264]

for some info on the 7.92x94mm Patronen round used by the Pz I ausf. C, part of the SS-41 Czech/German/SS anti-tank rifle video done by Ian McCollum (AKA Gun Jesus) of Forgotten weapons includes some additional info on the specifics of the round (start at 2:05 if you just want the section on the bullet) in addition to actually having one on the presentation desk. and that's aside from the interesting info on the gun itself it may have different characteristics from the tank-mounted EW 141 cannon though but still interesting.