aircraft [Premium] Danish Brigade Saab B 17C

[Sternjaeger84 1,075]

[Premium] Danforce Saab B 17C

 

 

 

Hello dear pilots of War Thunder. Today, a suggestion for a low tier premium plane for Sweden.

 

History:

As Denmark capitulated in 1940, a group of mens leaded by Colonel Helge Bennike managed to escape to Sweden. Getting bigger and bigger years after years, a Danish army was formed, trained and equipped by Sweden, in order to participate to the future liberation of Denmark. It was known as the Danish Brigade in Sweden, just Danish Brigade or also Danforce. The existence of this military unit was highly confidential because of the Swedish neutrality. By the way, it was also planned that this armed Danish force was also assisted by a Danish squadron, supplied with Saab B 17Cs and flying as a part of the Swedish Air Force. It was formed in 1944 and was based at Satenas. Painted under Swedish colours, the planes were repainted the May 5th 1945 under Danish colours with a Danish war flag on the tail.

 

Spoiler

⏏️ The Danish Brigade flag, as seen on the tail, could be added as a decal

 

The same day (May 5th), the German occupation forces in Denmark surrendered, and there were only light skirmishes during the recapture. Sadly, three Danish soldiers died from German snipers. The squadron wasn't involved.

 

Fun fact:

The C variant is equipped with an Italian engine which was acquired with an order of Italian fighters Reggiane Re.2000. 77 B 17Cs were built, but sadly they were decommissioned in because of the lack of spare parts.

Photos:

Spoiler

⏏️ The planes of the squadron after they have been repainted, May 5th 1945

⏏️ The Danish Brigade livery, with the flag on the tail

 

Characteristics:

Spoiler

Engine characteristics:

Engine: 1 × Piaggio P.XI.bis RC-40D

Power: 1040 hp

Type: Radial engine

 

All the other characteristics are the same than ingame B 17s, except the C variant doesn't have nose spinner because of the Italian engine and propeller. The C's nose just looks longer.. maybe the Italian engine is bigger?

 

In War Thunder:

• Versatile low tiers bomber
• Will complete the Swedish 1.7-2.3 line-up
• Will assist 1.7-2.3 Swedish tanks for air support
• C variant not ingame and not planned

 

Why as a premium:

• Operated by the secret Danish squadron, as premium foreign operated planes in other trees
• An affordable premium if buyable with GEs
• Or could make a sympathic event plane for a event (Danish themed?)
• A way to honour Danish pilots of WW2 and to give a little toy to Danish players in the game
• Allow new players to grind the Swedish air tech tree

 

Miscellaneous:

Spoiler

Be sure to check & vote for those awesome suggestions to enhance the Swedish experience in War Thunder:

• More Swedish decals & liveries

• Swedish J 26 (early) as a standard plane

 

 

Sources:

The Russian Wikipedia article which is very complete, check it here

WINGS PALETTE

http://www.rathbonemuseum.com/DENMARK/DKPhotos/DKPhotos.html

Edited December 29, 2019 by Sternjager

[ItssLuBu 1,801]

Approved and open for discussion. 

[Sternjaeger84 1,075]

24 minutes ago, ItssLuBu said:

Approved and open for discussion. 

Thanks!

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

Wait, Sweden was conspiring to go to war with the Nazis over Denmark?  That's news to me.

[Sternjaeger84 1,075]

7 hours ago, Z3r0_ said:

Wait, Sweden was conspiring to go to war with the Nazis over Denmark?  That's news to me.

They just equipped a Danish army.

[Milocat 4,854]

I support this!  +1, would be fun to have a Danish vehicle in the game.

[DrDrakenlans 50]

On 21/12/2019 at 04:46, Sternjager said:

[Premium] Danforce Saab B 17C

⏏️ The surviving Danish B 17C at the Denmark’s Technical & Aviation museum (source www.flying-tigers.co.uk)

 

The aircraft at the Danish Science Museum ins a B 17A that (ex. AVIA target tug SE-BWC), that was donated to Denmark in the 70s.
It's also worth mentioning that no aircraft ever flew in those markings, as they were reserved for combat operations only, and hastily applied at the last minute. After the unit was ordered to stand down (and somewhat reluctantly ordered to return home by train), the markings were washed off and the aircraft returned to their original units.
Normal flight ops by the Danish Brigade over Swedish territory were only carried out in regular, Swedish markings.

Quote

The C variant is equipped with an Italian engine which was acquired with an order of Italian fighters Reggiane Re.2000. 77 B 17Cs were built, but sadly they were decommissioned in because of the lack of spare parts.

No, there were B 17C in use well into the 50s, as target tugs and transports. Only in fewer numbers than the other versions. Unfortunately, none is in existence today. There were some that remained in use by technical schools into the 60s, and one that ended up in Ethiopia as spare parts, but as far as we know, they are all long since scrapped.

[Sternjaeger84 1,075]

21 hours ago, DrLimerep said:

The aircraft at the Danish Science Museum ins a B 17A that (ex. AVIA target tug SE-BWC), that was donated to Denmark in the 70s.

Corrected.

 

21 hours ago, DrLimerep said:

It's also worth mentioning that no aircraft ever flew in those markings, as they were reserved for combat operations only, and hastily applied at the last minute. After the unit was ordered to stand down (and somewhat reluctantly ordered to return home by train), the markings were washed off and the aircraft returned to their original units.
Normal flight ops by the Danish Brigade over Swedish territory were only carried out in regular, Swedish markings.

Yes, as it's written. But they've been painted under Danish colours. War thunder has a lot of planes that has never took off.

 

21 hours ago, DrLimerep said:

No, there were B 17C in use well into the 50s, as target tugs and transports. Only in fewer numbers than the other versions. Unfortunately, none is in existence today. There were some that remained in use by technical schools into the 60s, and one that ended up in Ethiopia as spare parts, but as far as we know, they are all long since scrapped.

Source(s)?

[DrDrakenlans 50]

Correction: I reviewed the aircraft history and realized my memory was incorrect, regarding dates. The last B 17C were decommissioned in 1947. My bad!

42 minutes ago, Sternjager said:

Source(s)?

Depends on how picky you are. I suggest starting with SAAB 17 by Widefeldt and Hall (Air Historic Research, 1997). It's in Swedish, but has an extensive English summary.
For the history of individual aircraft, the Swedish Aviation Historical Society maintains a list on their forum. It's the most up-to-date catalog of SAAB 17 available, and incorporates current research. 
The exact identity of the examples of B 17C (3 aircraft, according to Widefeldt) that allegedly went to Ethiopia is disputed, as they were likely scrapped aircraft that were sold as parts by a 3rd party. 

The preserved examples of the B 17 are known and well documented. They are:

• 17005 (S 17B) on display at Flygvapenmuseum (SwAF Museum) in Linköping.
• 17239 (B 17A). Operated by SAAB and the SwAF Historic Flight, based in Linköping.
• 17320 (B 17A). On display at Danmarks Tekniske Museum, Elsinore.

Two additional B 17A were recovered from Ethiopia by a South African collector in the late 90s, with the intent to restore both aircraft. Eventually they were sold on to another collector in Latvia, who intended to finish the restorations. The exact status of these aircraft is unclear. Some photos turned up around the time of recovery, and again about 12 years ago, following their arrival in Latvia. But since then there has been little trace of them. These aircraft are:

• 17273.
• 17365.

The part about technical schools using decommissioned C airframes is correct though. They regularly used the most modern material that they were able to acquire, and then threw it away once something better came along. There were B 17Cs used in Västerås, as well at Kungliga Tekniska Högskolan, and a few more schools, including some military institutions. Typically, those deals were done with a handshake and little documentation. Some were acquired as parts through private scrap yard firms. So, keeping track of airframe numbers etc. of those aircraft is a matter of chasing down photo evidence, or hoping to find a note in some archive. But, the fact that no C airframes remain is undisputed.

[Sternjaeger84 1,075]

3 hours ago, DrLimerep said:

I reviewed the aircraft history and realized my memory was incorrect, regarding dates. The last B 17C were decommissioned in 1947. My bad!

As I've founded the decomission date in a book, I was surprised that this was false, as the Italian spare parts would have been difficult to find.

 

Btw, very interesting, thanks for your additionnal datas.

[DrDrakenlans 50]

You're welcome!
After the J 20 was decommissioned in 1945, and two wings converting to other aircraft types, there was actually a surplus of parts for a short period. But, like you said, they were living on borrowed time.

There has always been something of a curse regarding information on Swedish aircraft, especially from non-Swedish sources. Stemming from old data, poor translations, hearsay and misinterpretations. It's gotten increasingly better with time but you still see the occasional error pop up.

[Sternjaeger84 1,075]

15 hours ago, DrLimerep said:

After the J 20 was decommissioned in 1945, and two wings converting to other aircraft types, there was actually a surplus of parts for a short period.

Ah, the parts were compatibles with the B17C?

15 hours ago, DrLimerep said:

There has always been something of a curse regarding information on Swedish aircraft, especially from non-Swedish sources. Stemming from old data, poor translations, hearsay and misinterpretations. It's gotten increasingly better with time but you still see the occasional error pop up.

Effectively..

[Solarmod 1,203]

Seems neat. Supported.

[DrDrakenlans 50]

3 hours ago, Sternjager said:

Ah, the parts were compatibles with the B17C?

Basically the same engine. And anything behind the firewall was the same as on other B 17s. Since the fleet of the C version shrunk after 1945, as the B 17A began to replace them, there was a also a surplus of spare engines from those.