Mitsubishi F-4EJ Kai Super Phantom

[David Bowie 1,554]

Summary of arguments and rebuttals

 

Picture of the JDAM on the F-4EJ Kai?
it is just for display.

 

Is the ADTW's F-4EJ's new antenna is GPS antenna?
It's been installed since 1988, so that is not a GPS antenna.

 

A picture of the F-4EJ Kai with the XGCS-2?
Just performing aerodynamics and separation tests with dummy bomb, not real bomb.

 

F-4EJ Kai's GCS-1?
No ground attack ability due to seeker's performance

 

F-4EJ Kai's AGM-62 or AGM-65?
When producing the F-4EJ, all equipment was removed, and no functions were added even in EJ Kai.

[Miki_Hoshii 2,449]

As most of you already know, yesterday my F-4EJ Kai suggestion was passed to the development team. Well, now theres another announcement.

 

 

Found here: 

http://www.dmm.com/lp/game/warthunder/f-4ej_kai_html/=/navi=none/

 

[CokeSpray 7,274]

Looks like paying for Over Night Delivery for the messenger pigeon services paid off this time... Huzzah!

[Phaere 227]

AAM-3's seem a bit too advanced to include in the current meta being an all-aspect missile that can pull around 35G's. The AH-1Z Viper in-game uses the AIM-9L which these missiles are based off, but either way these would be the hands down most powerful air to air missile armed on a jet currently in-game.

 

If they plan on moving into the 4th generation of Jet Fighters (F-2A, F-15J, and other nations contemporaries) than sure, but with current top tier these would be quite over powered.

 

Nice to finally be getting the F-4E though.

Edited December 31, 2019 by Phaere

[wulfalier 2,470]

F-4EJ revised is that the Kai version?

[Miki_Hoshii 2,449]

50 minutes ago, wulfalier said:

F-4EJ revised is that the Kai version?

Yes, Revised is Kai.

[Fireraid233 4,274]

We will have to see and hope other nations will get something similar hopfully BRs increased a lot as well. Assuming F4EJ kai is added alone it could be another T2 powercreep.

[Phaere 227]

53 minutes ago, Fireraid233 said:

We will have to see and hope other nations will get something similar hopfully BRs increased a lot as well. Assuming F4EJ kai is added alone it could be another T2 powercreep.

 

Depends if it gets AAM-3's or not. If it does then it'll be pretty damn OP and massively powercreep everything. If no AAM-3's than it'll only be slightly better than the F-4C but still a bit worse than the FGR.2 in terms of flight performance (at least at the altitudes top tier jet battles tend to be fought at).

Edited January 1, 2020 by Phaere

[Warlock_Leader 292]

According to the translation, everything is intended to be included with the F-4EJ Kai.

 

With that being said... my guess would be 2.01 Patch with Gen 4 Aircraft with the introduction of Rank 7 Aviation.

[CotorShas 427]

5 hours ago, Phaere said:

 

Depends if it gets AAM-3's or not. If it does then it'll be pretty damn OP and massively powercreep everything. If no AAM-3's than it'll only be slightly better than the F-4C but still a bit worse than the FGR.2 in terms of flight performance (at least at the altitudes top tier jet battles tend to be fought at).

Well internal gun would reduce a lot of drag. 

[Optical_Ilyushin 5,554]

2 hours ago, CotorShas said:

Well internal gun would reduce a lot of drag. 

 

AFAIK, current F-4 gunpods don't produce drag in WT.

 

8 hours ago, Phaere said:

 

Depends if it gets AAM-3's or not. If it does then it'll be pretty damn OP and massively powercreep everything. If no AAM-3's than it'll only be slightly better than the F-4C but still a bit worse than the FGR.2 in terms of flight performance (at least at the altitudes top tier jet battles tend to be fought at).

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by Optical_Ilyushin

[コタリ 2,733]

I just wish they would finish with the T-2s loadouts to give it stuff like Zuni's. If anything they could do some minor changes and make it into an F-1 and give it AIM-9Ls to bring it up to 21SMT performance. I really am curious to see if we are ever going to see the F-1 since we just blew right past it, past the EJ, and straight to the EJ Kai.

 

Also it mentions Japan's FX program. Is Japan still looking at the YF-23 for their pure air superiority fighter? Would be cool to see the YF-23 pass the prototype stage and eventually make it in game.

Edited January 1, 2020 by AnimeThighs

[Phaere 227]

5 hours ago, Optical_Ilyushin said:

 

 

Yes, I've read the article. Just because they say they're going to do some research and what not for Gaijin doesn't mean we'll get it immediately (or at all, Type 74 w/ dozer blade for example).

[Fa11enPhoenix 1,405]

I'm not against Japan getting the F-4, however the AAM-3 is a step beyond... unless the Aim-9L is made available to other nations at the same time then its just another flavour of the month seal club waiting got happen... this would also necessitate vehicles that actually used the 9L being added... so far there aren't that many.

 

Tbh I think I'd rather have seen an F-104J, its basically an F-104G so the same model could filter into the German, Italian and Chinese trees... that way everyone bar France and Sweden are finally at Mach 2. 

[Smin1080p_WT 60,444]

Just to point out, everything stated in the post by DMM is thing they intend to research. Its not 100% conformation that all of it will come at once, or in the next patch. Best to wait for dev blogs. 

[RanchSauce39 397]

19 hours ago, Phaere said:

 

Depends if it gets AAM-3's or not. If it does then it'll be pretty damn OP and massively powercreep everything. If no AAM-3's than it'll only be slightly better than the F-4C but still a bit worse than the FGR.2 in terms of flight performance (at least at the altitudes top tier jet battles tend to be fought at).

 

Even without AAM-3, the F4EJ Kai wouldn't just be "slightly" better than F4C. The Kai has a much superior radar ( AN/APG66 as used on F16A) which a fully digital pulse Doppler radar also utilizing the Medium PRF waveform, coupled with Doppler beam sharpening for an 8:1  improved A/G mapping  resolution  for range and azimuth coverage, and a 4:1  ratio Expand mode ( essentially a zoom in) , along with GMTI capability to detect moving vehicles. It also has an IFF system so it can tell apart friend from foe on radar.

 

Aside from relatively modern radar, it also has AN/ALE 40 counter measure system ( both flare and chaff) so it can easily spoof any  current missiles, option for carrying external ECM pod ( AN/AlQ 131 which is relatively modern system) to jam radars, and a modern RWR capable of displaying alpha numeric symbology. ( same one as F15)

 

the Air frame is modified with automatic leading edge wing slats which will make it superior in maneuverability to either F4C or FGR2.

 

In conclusion , missiles alone aren't everything. Even without AAM-3  due to all the other factors taken into consideration this would still be hands down the next meta powercreep  ( just not as drastic without all aspect missiles) aircraft assuming no new contemporaries from other nations are added.

 

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by RanchSauce39

[llSolitairell@psn 5,730]

9 minutes ago, RanchSauce39 said:

 

Even without AAM-3, the F4EJ Kai wouldn't just be "slightly" better than F4C. The Kai has a much superior radar ( AN/APG66 as used on F16A) which a fully digital pulse Doppler radar also utilizing the Medium PRF waveform, coupled with Doppler beam sharpening for an 8:1  improved A/G mapping  resolution  for range and azimuth coverage, and a 4:1  ratio Expand mode ( essentially a zoom in) , along with GMTI capability to detect moving vehicles.

 

That can mean everything or nothing in WT

9 minutes ago, RanchSauce39 said:

It also has an IFF system so it can tell apart friend from foe on radar.

 

So can the Javelin iirc

9 minutes ago, RanchSauce39 said:

Aside from relatively modern radar, it also has AN/ALE 40 counter measure system ( both flare and chaff) so it can easily spoof any  current missiles, option for carrying external ECM pod ( AN/AlQ 131 which is relatively modern system) to jam radars, and a modern RWR capable of displaying alpha numeric symbology. ( same one as F15)

 

Flares and Chaff is where the game is heading

9 minutes ago, RanchSauce39 said:

 

the Air frame is modified with automatic leading edge wing slats which will make it a superior in maneuverability to either F4C or FGR2.

 

neat

 

9 minutes ago, RanchSauce39 said:

Even without AAM-3 this would still be hands down the next meta powercreep  ( just not as drastic without all aspect missiles) aircraft assuming no new contemporaries from other nations are added.

 

T-2 round 2

 

Besides; Creep and the ensuing Hype around it keeps the game going and gaijin has to sell JASDF Sabres somehow

Not that I think Japan will get an F-4E before U.S with AGM-65s

[RanchSauce39 397]

8 minutes ago, *RAazzy91 said:

 

That can mean everything or nothing in WT

 

So can the Javelin iirc

 

Flares and Chaff is where the game is heading

 

neat

 

 

T-2 round 2

 

Besides; Creep and the ensuing Hype around it keeps the game going and gaijin has to sell JASDF Sabres somehow

Not that I think Japan will get an F-4E before U.S with AGM-65s

 

 

If you are going to try to refute an argument due so with substance, not just for the sake of a empty  response.

 

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by RanchSauce39

[llSolitairell@psn 5,730]

12 minutes ago, RanchSauce39 said:

 

 

If you are going to try to refute an argument due so with substance, not just for the sake of a empty  response.

 

 

 

Not everything is an arguement.

[CotorShas 427]

19 hours ago, Optical_Ilyushin said:

 

AFAIK, current F-4 gunpods don't produce drag in WT.

 

They do produce drag it's just that that drag is currently bundled into the FM instead of as extra parasite drag

[MSGKI_HARA_UOOH 2,828]

18 hours ago, Phaere said:

 

Yes, I've read the article. Just because they say they're going to do some research and what not for Gaijin doesn't mean we'll get it immediately (or at all, Type 74 w/ dozer blade for example).

 

Ah yes, i still remember how gaijin fuched us over by not putting the 74G in the tree and Dozer in premium.

i still remember they think its a waste of effort. Thx gaijin.

[Miki_Hoshii 2,449]

20 hours ago, RanchSauce39 said:

 

 

the Air frame is modified with automatic leading edge wing slats which will make it superior in maneuverability to either F4C or FGR2.

 

 

 

 

The F-4EJ Kai program considered the implementation of leading edge slats, but this wasnt followed through. You can see in photograghs it still retains the leading edge flaps. A US F-4E would be more agile.

[Iron_physik 3,485]

people srsly need to calm down here.

 

all that was said is that DMM started historical research on this F-4.. its not a confirmation that it will come to the game anytime soon.

it takes about 5-7 months to finish a 3D model, and around 1-2 months to find enough data to model it depending on what vehicle that is.

and then the FM creation and implementation of the 3D model also takes some time

 

by then other nations also got stronger planes to compete with the F-4EJ easily.

[コタリ 2,733]

On 11/01/2020 at 10:10, Iron_physik said:

people srsly need to calm down here.

 

all that was said is that DMM started historical research on this F-4.. its not a confirmation that it will come to the game anytime soon.

it takes about 5-7 months to finish a 3D model, and around 1-2 months to find enough data to model it depending on what vehicle that is.

and then the FM creation and implementation of the 3D model also takes some time

 

by then other nations also got stronger planes to compete with the F-4EJ easily.

But they are doing this research under the banner of war thunder meaning that is confirmed that will be coming in the near future. On top of that we already have a base 3D model for Gaijin to work off of and pretty much every project that DMM has announced came within the next patch. Chances are Gaijin has already been working on the 3D model for a while now. They obviously have enough info that they are confident to make an announcement about it coming without having to worry about hitting a brick wall with info. While there may be evidence that it might not come next patch, previous projects from DMM suggest the opposite so we won't know till it gets here.

 

Maybe people are just excited because

1) We got a big announcement outside of devblog season

2) Japan might be getting the leading edge aircraft and will no longer be stuck with a trainer aircraft with half it's possible armaments missing and a 20k repair cost.

 

I'm sure with your top nation you are plenty used to having the biggest and best stuff, but Japan is getting a half a drop of content every patch so hype is all we got. Go somewhere else if you don't like it.

[Iron_physik 3,485]

12 hours ago, AnimeThighs said:

But they are doing this research under the banner of war thunder meaning that is confirmed that will be coming in the near future. On top of that we already have a base 3D model for Gaijin to work off of and pretty much every project that DMM has announced came within the next patch. Chances are Gaijin has already been working on the 3D model for a while now. They obviously have enough info that they are confident to make an announcement about it coming without having to worry about hitting a brick wall with info. While there may be evidence that it might not come next patch, previous projects from DMM suggest the opposite so we won't know till it gets here.

 

Maybe people are just excited because

1) We got a big announcement outside of devblog season

2) Japan might be getting the leading edge aircraft and will no longer be stuck with a trainer aircraft with half it's possible armaments missing and a 20k repair cost.

 

I'm sure with your top nation you are plenty used to having the biggest and best stuff, but Japan is getting a half a drop of content every patch so hype is all we got. Go somewhere else if you don't like it.

where was said it wil be coming?

 

nowhere.

you even have replies from gaijin staff that this announcement is only to test the feasability of this plane in WT:

On 01/01/2020 at 19:53, Smin1080p said:

Just to point out, everything stated in the post by DMM is thing they intend to research. Its not 100% conformation that all of it will come at once, or in the next patch. 

 

there is more such statements from Smin in the 1.97 rumor roundup thread

[コタリ 2,733]

1 minute ago, Iron_physik said:

where was said it wil be coming?

 

nowhere.

you even have replies from gaijin staff that this announcement is only to test the feasability of this plane in WT:

will begin planning for introduction into the Japan Tech Tree.

2 minutes ago, Iron_physik said:

On 01/01/2020 at 10:53, Smin1080p said:

Just to point out, everything stated in the post by DMM is thing they intend to research. Its not 100% conformation that all of it will come at once, or in the next patch. 

 

there is more such statements from Smin in the 1.97 rumor roundup thread

This is just Smin saying that when the EJ Kai releases it might not come with features like an ECM pod or smart bomb guidance since those would both be new features. He never denies the addition of the F-4EJ Kai at all, just that we might not get all of that stuff in the same patch.