Jump to content

Vs.Kfz.31 Leichttraktor Rheinmetall


PrussianOwl
 Share

Should the Vs.Kfz.31 Leichttraktor Rheinmetall be added to the game?  

170 members have voted

  1. 1. Would you like to see this vehicle added to the game?

    • Yes, main tree
      107
    • Yes, as a gift/event/premium
      48
    • No
      15
  2. 2. Where should it be in the tree?

    • Only in a Rank 0
      41
    • At 1.0 or as another Reserve
      86
    • As a 1.0 premium
      29
    • I answered "No" to the first question
      14


The Vs.Kfz.31 Leichttraktor (Light tractor), also known at the time as the Kleintraktor (Small tractor), was a prototype German light tank, of which four distinct versions were made. It was developed and tested in secret at the Soviet-German Kama facility, during the time of the Weimar Republic. This was part of the Leichttraktor, also known as the Kleintraktor, project. The tank was designed *around* 1929 and used through early WW2 as a training vehicle.  In spite of having a 37 mm cannon, it was rejected in favor of the Panzer I, in a competition to make a new light tank for Germany, like the Grosstraktor project at the same time (which went on to inspire the Neubaufahrzeug). This suggestion is about the Rheinmetall one, distinguished from the others, aside from the obvious matter of who made it (Krupp also made at least one Leichttraktor, out of four Leichttraktors made in total), by the fact that it wasn't Rheinmetall's Panzerjaeger version (visible on the blueprints in the image section)  with a smaller turret and a different gun, and the Krupp version which didn't have a sloped upper glacis plate. I think it'd be at home at 1.0 Germany, either as a gift, researchable, or premium. 

 

Images:

Spoiler

2da7d07a26dd956c25206b0fa4bce3b4.jpg.769 8cbc30c5e4318f907088d91332f62d44.jpg.9f9

300px-LeichttraktorProfile.jpg.453c7b0c7

320px-Leichttraktor_Rheinmetall_assemble

images.jpg.0c415242c0fc8eb6dccbe867e282e

leicht.jpg.492175972df22d4c7af981a9f1b00 1659187592_LeichttraktorRheinmetall1930G leichttraktor_vk_31_rheinmetall-72149.jp

tumblr_p8dh3mGiM91w636mro1_400.jpg.474f6

 

Specifications:
Armament: 3.7 cm KwK L/45 main gun (like on the Panzer III B and E, and the Nb.Fz), 1 coaxial Mauser MG 13
Armor: In most places 14 mm of armor and  top glacis place was a heavily angled 14 mm, and the lower glacis was 19 mm. 
Top speed: 35 kph, or ~22 mph on the road
Dimensions: 4.21 m X 2.26 m X 2.27 m
Crew: 3
Weight: 9.65 tonne
Engine: 100hp petrol
Suspension: Leaf spring

 

Why it should be in the game: This is one of those borderline Rank 1/Rank 0 vehicles that work at 1.0, like the FCM.36 and the Ha-Go. I think the gameplay would be different from other German vehicles at Rank 1 with it's sloped frontal glacis and possibly pave the way for a zeroth rank, as well as adding a historically interesting tank from the time when Germany was first rearming itself. This Rheinmetall version would likely be competitive with the T-26 and the M2 Light, and would do fine as another reserve for Germany. 

 

Sources:
https://tanknutdave.com/the-german-leichttraktor-vk-31-light-tank/
https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/europe/history/de-leihttraktor.htm
https://warspot.ru/6290-nemirnyy-traktor This one's in Russian
Also the book at ISBNs 9783879433353 and 3879433356 may have some more information

Edited by PrussianOwl
  • Upvote 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Suggestion Moderator

Open for discussion.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 28/03/2020 at 09:20, eleks12 said:

+1 if we get WW1/Early interwar into the game! :)

This honestly, I'd rather interwar stuff that can't do much (Looking at you A1E1) Be put in rank 0 as well.

medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, Ghostmaxi said:

what gun does the Panzerjäger Rheinmetall have?

I have no idea, but I did find a few pics, so it's one of the four. So I know there's a Rheinmetall normal one (this one), a Panzerjaeger Rheinmetall one, a flat-glacis Krupp one and a later Krupp one that looks more like this one. 

Panzerjaeger version:

Spoiler

image.jpg.e3ad229c70300923cd449ee80db8a1d82dbc880df6be4649fbc5f6ca145a8c.jpg.5d6

Krupp (flat glacis)

Spoiler

G06pJqxHYLI7lJn1-eOjJY0lN9uyVINCOTHK9E4c

Krupp (modified suspension) 

Spoiler

def1a6e06176558eb96520d5e553832b.jpg.535

And I found a modification on the Rheinmetall one:

Spoiler

320px-Leichttraktor_Rheinmetall_Leichttr1844664450_LeichttraktorRheinmetall1930G

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd love to see it, but as you say, it's comparable to the T-26 and M2 light (I assume you mean M2A2), which are some of the weaker Rank I tanks. Given that the M2A4, the M13/40s and the Panzer IIs are also 1.0 or Reserve, and that the current Pz.35(t) Reserve for Germany has more armour, more speed and the same gun, I can't see this tank working too well in Rank I as it currently is. With the addition and swift removal of several non-meta French tanks, as well as the more debatable Ha-Go (which is arguably better than many vehicles that didn't get hidden), the case for a "Rank 0" of interwar tanks is pretty strong, and this would be ideal for Germany in such a tier. If some of the more powerful 1.0 tanks were moved higher to reflect the fact that many 1.0s and Reserves are significantly worse than them, then this could have a place without a Rank 0, since it's pretty decent and would be fairly competitive. The likelihood of that happening seems relatively low, though, given that the Pz.III E just got dropped to 1.0 and that thing has superior ammunition, speed and armour compared to the existing Pz.III B and Pz.35(t) Reserves, let alone the Leichttraktor. A "Rank 0" wouldn't be all that difficult to make for most nations, excluding Sweden (AFAIK, their major interwar tanks are already in-game as their Reserves), and would be ideal as a place for this cool little tank to shine. 

 

Here's some examples of tanks (not TDs, AAs, etc, of which there are also options) that could form a "Rank 0":

 

USA: Medium Tank M1921/M1922 (Reserve); Light Tank T1E3 (0.3); Light Tanks T1E4, M2A2 & M2A3* (0.7)

USSR: T-40 (Reserve); T-26 M1931 (PS-2)** (0.3); BT-2, T-60 & T-26-4 (0.7)

GER: Pz.I Ausf. B (Reserve); Krupp Leichttraktor (0.3); Rheinmetall Leichttraktor, Pz.I Ausf. C & F(0.7)

GBR: LT Mk.VIA (Reserve); Medium Mk.I & II (0.3); Medium Mk.III, Humber AC Mk.III & LT Mk.VIC (0.7)

JPN: I-Go Ko*** (Reserve); Otsu-Gata Sensha (0.3); Type 97 Te-Ke & Ha-Go Early**** (0.7)

FRA: NC-27 (Reserve); H.35 (0.3); R.35 (SA18) & FCM.36 (0.7)

ITA: L3/38 (Breda M.31)***** (Reserve); Fiat 3000B (aka L5/30) & Fiat 2000 (0.3); Fiat 2000 (1934) (0.7)

CHI: Pz.I Ausf. A (Reserve); Vickers Mk.E Type B (0.7)

 

* M2A3 was an improved M2A2 with thicker armour, probably similar to M2A4's 25.4mm 

** T-26 M1931 was a twin-turreted model, some had the PS-1 or better PS-2 37mm gun in one turret instead of an MG

*** Our in-game I-Go Ko would be replaced by the later I-Go Otsu, while the Ko itself would lose the HEAT round and plummet in BR

**** Some Ha-Gos got rearmed with better guns later, so would be fine at 1.0; our current Ha-Go would be good for 0.7

***** Technically not a tank, but the L3/38's 13.2mm Breda has decent AP, making a decent Reserve option (the 2000 and 3000 are too good IMO). 

 

As you can see, I think this would be one of the best tanks in a potential "Rank 0", although it's not quite up to 1.0 status given the more powerful vehicles already there. I'd really love to play this tank, and even if that means driving it out as a 1.0 or Reserve, where it would be a definite underdog, I'd be happy. Hopefully it makes it into the game at some point, it's an icon of the interwar period and a genuinely decent design. 

  • Upvote 3
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Zombificus said:

I'd love to see it, but as you say, it's comparable to the T-26 and M2 light (I assume you mean M2A2), which are some of the weaker Rank I tanks. Given that the M2A4, the M13/40s and the Panzer IIs are also 1.0 or Reserve, and that the current Pz.35(t) Reserve for Germany has more armour, more speed and the same gun, I can't see this tank working too well in Rank I as it currently is. With the addition and swift removal of several non-meta French tanks, as well as the more debatable Ha-Go (which is arguably better than many vehicles that didn't get hidden), the case for a "Rank 0" of interwar tanks is pretty strong, and this would be ideal for Germany in such a tier. If some of the more powerful 1.0 tanks were moved higher to reflect the fact that many 1.0s and Reserves are significantly worse than them, then this could have a place without a Rank 0, since it's pretty decent and would be fairly competitive. The likelihood of that happening seems relatively low, though, given that the Pz.III E just got dropped to 1.0 and that thing has superior ammunition, speed and armour compared to the existing Pz.III B and Pz.35(t) Reserves, let alone the Leichttraktor. A "Rank 0" wouldn't be all that difficult to make for most nations, excluding Sweden (AFAIK, their major interwar tanks are already in-game as their Reserves), and would be ideal as a place for this cool little tank to shine. 

 

Here's some examples of tanks (not TDs, AAs, etc, of which there are also options) that could form a "Rank 0":

 

USA: Medium Tank M1921/M1922 (Reserve); Light Tank T1E3 (0.3); Light Tanks T1E4, M2A2 & M2A3* (0.7)

USSR: T-40 (Reserve); T-26 M1931 (PS-2)** (0.3); BT-2, T-60 & T-26-4 (0.7)

GER: Pz.I Ausf. B (Reserve); Krupp Leichttraktor (0.3); Rheinmetall Leichttraktor, Pz.I Ausf. C & F(0.7)

GBR: LT Mk.VIA (Reserve); Medium Mk.I & II (0.3); Medium Mk.III, Humber AC Mk.III & LT Mk.VIC (0.7)

JPN: I-Go Ko*** (Reserve); Otsu-Gata Sensha (0.3); Type 97 Te-Ke & Ha-Go Early**** (0.7)

FRA: NC-27 (Reserve); H.35 (0.3); R.35 (SA18) & FCM.36 (0.7)

ITA: L3/38 (Breda M.31)***** (Reserve); Fiat 3000B (aka L5/30) & Fiat 2000 (0.3); Fiat 2000 (1934) (0.7)

CHI: Pz.I Ausf. A (Reserve); Vickers Mk.E Type B (0.7)

 

* M2A3 was an improved M2A2 with thicker armour, probably similar to M2A4's 25.4mm 

** T-26 M1931 was a twin-turreted model, some had the PS-1 or better PS-2 37mm gun in one turret instead of an MG

*** Our in-game I-Go Ko would be replaced by the later I-Go Otsu, while the Ko itself would lose the HEAT round and plummet in BR

**** Some Ha-Gos got rearmed with better guns later, so would be fine at 1.0; our current Ha-Go would be good for 0.7

***** Technically not a tank, but the L3/38's 13.2mm Breda has decent AP, making a decent Reserve option (the 2000 and 3000 are too good IMO). 

 

As you can see, I think this would be one of the best tanks in a potential "Rank 0", although it's not quite up to 1.0 status given the more powerful vehicles already there. I'd really love to play this tank, and even if that means driving it out as a 1.0 or Reserve, where it would be a definite underdog, I'd be happy. Hopefully it makes it into the game at some point, it's an icon of the interwar period and a genuinely decent design. 

I think that would be a really good idea! And I know of a lot more that could flesh out the zeroth rank. It's funny how even BR 1.0 is a bit compressed. Which BRs 0.0, 0.3 and 0.7 would fix nicely. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Zombificus said:

A "Rank 0" wouldn't be all that difficult to make for most nations, excluding Sweden (AFAIK, their major interwar tanks are already in-game as their Reserves), and would be ideal as a place for this cool little tank to shine.

 

USA: Medium Tank M1921/M1922 (Reserve); Light Tank T1E3 (0.3); Light Tanks T1E4, M2A2 & M2A3* (0.7)

USSR: T-40 (Reserve); T-26 M1931 (PS-2)** (0.3); BT-2, T-60 & T-26-4 (0.7)

GER: Pz.I Ausf. B (Reserve); Krupp Leichttraktor (0.3); Rheinmetall Leichttraktor, Pz.I Ausf. C & F(0.7)

GBR: LT Mk.VIA (Reserve); Medium Mk.I & II (0.3); Medium Mk.III, Humber AC Mk.III & LT Mk.VIC (0.7)

JPN: I-Go Ko*** (Reserve); Otsu-Gata Sensha (0.3); Type 97 Te-Ke & Ha-Go Early**** (0.7)

FRA: NC-27 (Reserve); H.35 (0.3); R.35 (SA18) & FCM.36 (0.7)

ITA: L3/38 (Breda M.31)***** (Reserve); Fiat 3000B (aka L5/30) & Fiat 2000 (0.3); Fiat 2000 (1934) (0.7)

CHI: Pz.I Ausf. A (Reserve); Vickers Mk.E Type B (0.7)

Rank 0 for Sweden to add to the list:

Strv m/21-29 (was testfitted with a 37mm Puteaux gun), Strv m/37, Landsverk L-5

 

Other possible options for a rank 0 could also be a L-60 or Strv fm/31, though those might be better as 1.0 tanks.

 

Strv m/21-29

Spoiler

strv_m21-18.JPG

Strv m/37

Spoiler

strv_m37-11.JPG

Landsverk L-5

Spoiler

1112125_original.jpg

Stridsvagn_L-5.jpg

L-60

Spoiler

na5n39ki71f01.jpg

Strv fm/31

Spoiler

strv_fm31-4.JPG

strv_fm31-1.JPG

 

 

What, you didn't think Strv m/31 was the first Swedish tank, did you? The first tank in Swedish service was Strv m/21 in the early 20's and the first Swedish built tank was the Landsverk L-5 in the late 20's, early 30's. It kind of hurts how little people know about Swedish tank development. There's a fair few armoured cars for it aswell, such as Pbil fm/29, aka the ugly toad.

 

pbil_m29-1.JPG

Edited by Stridswombat
  • Upvote 2
medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

These vehicles will make the br1 french look OP. Also consider the stats of those armored (?) units as same as I-go ko or ka-mi which nobody can get 1 kill in them tin cans. However, they can be a fine addition for Gaijin's new game ''Enlisted''.

Edited by DemonCorps
typo
medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There could be a BR 0.3 and BR 0.7 introduced. Some tanks even now are to weak for BR 1.0 (like the M2A2)

And then we could fill up these lower BRs with armored cars, motorbikes with sidecars, unarmored jeeps with machineguns, and several pre-1930 tankettes.

And don't forget, Germany conquered most of Europe while their most numerous tank was the Panzer 1. So those small interwar and early-war tanks played a significant role, and were produced in large quantities.

Edited by Praevasc
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 2 months later...
  • Technical Moderator

Yes please, especially with the experimental 1933 suspension, this would be an excellent rank I, BR 1.0-1.3 premium or event vehicle! +1 :yes_yes_yes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

+1

The nostalgia trip from WOTB and WOT would be nice!

Frankly, unless they just made Rank 0 unable to be uptiered, it might deserve its own game mode...

"Interwar Battles"?

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

21 hours ago, Blofeld_Returns said:

+1

The nostalgia trip from WOTB and WOT would be nice!

Frankly, unless they just made Rank 0 unable to be uptiered, it might deserve its own game mode...

"Interwar Battles"?

yea

medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 8 months later...
On 02/02/2021 at 15:10, Blofeld_Returns said:

+1

The nostalgia trip from WOTB and WOT would be nice!

Frankly, unless they just made Rank 0 unable to be uptiered, it might deserve its own game mode...

"Interwar Battles"?

If it were me I'd keep them within the same BR framework, but put them far enough in BR below what's now considered reserve that you'd have to try to uptier them. But the Leichttraktor I think would be best .3 or .7 in BR below the Panzer III ausf. B which is at 1.0

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 23/10/2021 at 01:40, PrussianOwl said:

If it were me I'd keep them within the same BR framework, but put them far enough in BR below what's now considered reserve that you'd have to try to uptier them. But the Leichttraktor I think would be best .3 or .7 in BR below the Panzer III ausf. B which is at 1.0

 

BR 0.0 would be reserved for the Bob Semple tank?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 7 months later...

+1   I love those odd interwar tank designs.  Not sure how well it fits in with the current game but I would still love to see it.

 

medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...