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Finnish Unique T-50, "T-50 110 Niki"


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  1. 1. Yes or No

    • Yes
      60
    • No
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  2. 2. Br

    • 2.3
      4
    • 2.7 (Normal Soviet T-50)
      45
    • 3.0
      11
    • Other
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      1
  3. 3. Nation

    • Sweden
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    • Russia
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      1


Flag_of_Finland.svg1280px-T-50_Finnish_service_1944_photo_1

 For some reason there is a German stick grenade flying, on the second pic, right above the T-50 turret.

 

T-50 is an Soviet light tank, it was a very rare one at that. Soviet Union planned to build no less than 14,000 of T-50's but they decided not to as it was nowhere near as good as the T-34, and yet the price of one T-50 was about the same as a T-34, thus it was cancelled and T-34's were spammed.

 

The official name of this tank is unkown (in Finnish service), however there are multiple ones you can use, either just T-50, or T-50 110 (110 is the Finnish designation for a T-50 tank), or T-50 110 "Niki" (Niki is the name of the Finnish T-50, given by the crew). Or last, the T-50 110 "Pikku-Sotka", Pikku-Sotka being the name given to it because it looked like a baby T-34 to Finnish soldiers, and "Sotka" being the name for a normal T-34 tank given by Finnish troops.

 

I am suggesting this as a squadron, event or premium vehicle for Swedish tree, as Sweden does not have many very unique tanks in the lower tier premiums. + Soviets already have a T-50.

And the reasoning behind this being a premium, well simply put. in total 69 were ever made and of those Finland operated 1 and was the sole operator of T-50 alongside Soviet Union.

 

The uparmored part of Finnish T-50 is the addition of 14mm armour plates to the turret side and the upper glacis. In total 0.7 tons of armour was added. Affecting the speed quite a lot, getting it down to 37.5kmh max.

 

Story of the Finnish T-50

in July of 1941, advancing Finnish troops saw a T-50 for the first time. Later that same year they were successful in capturing one of these ultra-rare tanks near Äänislinna or in Russian Petrozavodsk (Петрозаводск), The captured one was one of the fifty tanks made in Voroshilov Factory number 174 in St Petersburg, The tank was repaired and put into Finnish service with a registry number R-110 in February of 1942. It was funnily enough assinged to a Heavy Tank Company. But was quickly transferred to the 3rd Tank Company of Tank Brigade in March 1942, It was later used as a command tank in the same company. Maintaining this unique tank proved to be difficult but regardless it staid in service until 25th of june 1944. 

The T-50 "Niki" took part in the famous counter attack by Finnish heavy (medium) tanks from Juustila to Portinhoikka during Tali-ihantala battles. During this counter-attack the tank suffered a serious malfunction in its engine, which the repair shops of the Tank Brigade could not repair, next day it was sent to the central repair facility in Varkaus and was apparently never repaired. Even though it was not in operational condition since June 1944, it remained in Finnish Army reserve until 1955, and to this day the T-50 "Niki" sits in the Finnish tank museum in Parola waiting to be repaired. The End.

 

Fun fact, Parola tank museum holds the only Finnish M4 Sherman.

Also another Fun fact: Parola museum has the first or second (however you want to look at it) surviving T-50 in the whole world alongside the Kubinka Tank Museum.

Third Fun Fact: Parola museum has the only known surviving BA-10 armoured car in the whole world. It being the BA-10M "PS 27-12"

 

Stats of the Finnish T-50 (NOTE: the +14mm armor is only for the uparmored Finnish T-50 not for base Soviet T-50)

8035c1413fdd0cad9c47555b681a110d.png

 

 

Example, here you can very well see the bolted on plate.

T-50_Parola_131.jpg

 

And from up down

T-50_Parola_167.jpg

 

Camouflages options:

Spoiler

 

Plain green - as in pictures by legion-afo

 

Camouflage summer? - first picture by Sa-kuva, you can see the pattern but not the colours, so here below is a reliable picture of the camo

listaus__G3483828_1.jpg

 

Camouflage winter - first picture is a historical picture of the Winter camo without colour, and below it is a reliable coloured picture of it.

801e881c2441e6a33a28981a692dc405.jpg

T50-Niki_Finland.png

 

 

 

Sources:

https://www.jaegerplatoon.net/TANKS5.htm

http://legion-afv.narod.ru/T-50_Parola.html

https://www.doria.fi/bitstream/handle/10024/74434/SM386.pdf?sequence=1

Soviet Tanks and Combat Vehicles of World War Two by Steven J. Zaloga and James Grandsen

http://sa-kuva.fi/

Edited by FinlandSupreme
  • Upvote 7
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5 minutes ago, Wolf_89 said:

More Finnish vehicles are always a +. As long as they gets added to the Swedish/Nordic tree.

Maybe in a sub folder in the Swedish trees? Same with Danish and Norwegian vehicles :) 

It could be like how you unlock Heli tree, you reach example, tier 3. You unlock the extra nation, example. Sweden tier 3 --> Finland, Denmark and Norway trees. You could combine those 3 into one single extra nation, and you could use all 4 nations vehicles in same lineup.

Tho it would be kinda hard to do with Finland as most of our cold war equipment is from Soviet Union. We will have to see what they do with West and East Germany.

Edited by FinskiySovetski
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  • 2 weeks later...

+1 Sweden. The BA-10 armoured car mentioned in the OP would be worth a post on its own. I believe I saw a mention somewhere that Sweden got some hands on some samples of those from Finns during the war. But never used them, they were either sent back or scrapped.

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  • 6 months later...

There's no way those stats are accurate. 0.7t of weight isn't going to drop a vehicles top speed from 64 to 35km/h. Not when it has over 20hp/t still. Secondly why would it have 37mm of armour when the one we have in the game has 40mm? If that's its base armour scheme in the game, then the uparmoured version would be the same aswell. Lastly I've read the armour protection was brought up to 57mm with the extra armour plates. If we go with it having 40mm like in the game, then that would be extra 17mm of appliquè armour, not 14mm.

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On 22/03/2021 at 07:43, Stridswombat said:

There's no way those stats are accurate. 0.7t of weight isn't going to drop a vehicles top speed from 64 to 35km/h. Not when it has over 20hp/t still. Secondly why would it have 37mm of armour when the one we have in the game has 40mm? If that's its base armour scheme in the game, then the uparmoured version would be the same aswell. Lastly I've read the armour protection was brought up to 57mm with the extra armour plates. If we go with it having 40mm like in the game, then that would be extra 17mm of appliquè armour, not 14mm.

Ingame we have the prototype tank modeled, not the actual production with 37mm armour.

 

The Finnish T-50 is a production T-50 with 37mm armour + Finnish addon 14mm armour, totaling 51mm. IDK where u red the 57mm thing, but its incorrect. I went to Parola to measure Patria AMV armour, and did T-50 as well and the plate is 14mm.

 

The speed was tested on road and is 35 km/h, however the speed war thunder uses is also incorrect yet again.

Edited by JamesJLahey
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On 23/03/2021 at 16:42, JamesJLahey said:

Ingame we have the prototype tank modeled, not the actual production with 37mm armour.

 

The Finnish T-50 is a production T-50 with 37mm armour + Finnish addon 14mm armour, totaling 51mm. IDK where u red the 57mm thing, but its incorrect. I went to Parola to measure Patria AMV armour, and did T-50 as well and the plate is 14mm.

 

The speed was tested on road and is 35 km/h, however the speed war thunder uses is also incorrect yet again.

Why are they using a prototype T-50 in the game? That seems pretty daft. Especially considering how mobile it is since it apparently has thicker armour. What should its actual top speed be in that case? As for the armour thickness, I can't remember where but I read somewhere that it was supposed to be 57mm max with the appliqué applied.

EDIT: So the original top speed is 52km/h? That still seems like a large drop from 52 to 37km/h just from 0.7t of weight, especially considering it still has over 20hp/t as mentioned. That number must be low even if the in-game top speed is wrong. Do you know what the cupola thickness might be btw? I'm guessing it's 37mm like the rest of the armour in that case.

Edited by Stridswombat
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7 hours ago, Stridswombat said:

Why are they using a prototype T-50 in the game? That seems pretty daft. Especially considering how mobile it is since it apparently has thicker armour. What should its actual top speed be in that case? As for the armour thickness, I can't remember where but I read somewhere that it was supposed to be 57mm max with the appliqué applied.

EDIT: So the original top speed is 52km/h? That still seems like a large drop from 52 to 37km/h just from 0.7t of weight, especially considering it still has over 20hp/t as mentioned. That number must be low even if the in-game top speed is wrong. Do you know what the cupola thickness might be btw? I'm guessing it's 37mm like the rest of the armour in that case.

I have no clue about the other thicknesses excluding addon armor.

http://legion-afv.narod.ru/T-50_Parola.html however this place should answer at least some questions.

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  • 2 years later...

I think it could be reasonable at 3.0 BR due to the armor. Around there the gun would be weak, but making it a rank III premium tank could make it worth it, since Sweden doesn't yet have any rank III premium vehicles and that's the only rank where they don't have a single light tank.

I found the top speed really strange. Like you can see, the power to weight ratio is still very good, despite added weight from the additional armor and off road speed is still same as for T-34. There has to be something wrrong with that road speed number. I thought of few options:

1) Someone simply had bad handwriting, turning 47.5 to 37.5.

2) There was already something wrong with the engine or transmission, that they couldn't fix. This was the only T-50 captured by Finnish in any condition, so they would have lacked parts to fix it. The engine shared something like 70% of parts with T-34's V-2 engine, but rest were almost unique to T-50. In game it does 35km/h on 3rd gear, so maybe they couldn't use the 4th? It could be within margin of error.

3) The top speed wasn't measured with same standards as Soviets did it.
A) The engine temperature got too high to even bother.
B) They didn't test it on a paved road like Soviets did. Surprisingly tanks of that time lacked 10-20km/h on dirt road compared to their top speed on paved road.
 

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+1, Very interesting varient for the Finnish sub tree. 

On 12/06/2023 at 19:00, Teh0 said:

I think it could be reasonable at 3.0 BR due to the armor. Around there the gun would be weak, but making it a rank III premium tank could make it worth it, since Sweden doesn't yet have any rank III premium vehicles and that's the only rank where they don't have a single light tank.

I found the top speed really strange. Like you can see, the power to weight ratio is still very good, despite added weight from the additional armor and off road speed is still same as for T-34. There has to be something wrrong with that road speed number. I thought of few options:

1) Someone simply had bad handwriting, turning 47.5 to 37.5.

2) There was already something wrong with the engine or transmission, that they couldn't fix. This was the only T-50 captured by Finnish in any condition, so they would have lacked parts to fix it. The engine shared something like 70% of parts with T-34's V-2 engine, but rest were almost unique to T-50. In game it does 35km/h on 3rd gear, so maybe they couldn't use the 4th? It could be within margin of error.

3) The top speed wasn't measured with same standards as Soviets did it.
A) The engine temperature got too high to even bother.
B) They didn't test it on a paved road like Soviets did. Surprisingly tanks of that time lacked 10-20km/h on dirt road compared to their top speed on paved road.
 

I agree.

 

The Soviets also up armoured the T-50 them self! 

 

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