Extended French AA line

[CaID 8,996]

 

 

This topic have for sole purpose to introduce the community the wide selection of french SPAA. a thing that is not well know is France had developped a large selection of SPAA vehicles, if only a few of them saw an active services, there was many of them who was meant for export and saw no order for the foreign country. there is very few who was actually just prototype, most of them was finished product and if they lack of some polishing, they was ready for production and services.

 

let's start like the game is structured, i will present here the SPAA that was either built by the french or saw services in the french army, regardless their origin or redundancy. as long they have enough firepower to take out some plane and have the technology to fit in the armament's BR, i will put it here, do not expect me to consider a modern jeep equiped with 12.7mm as a good Rank 1 SPAA as it would make the game feel like a dumpster for any vehicles. let's keep a good logic and consider vehicles of interwar and early ww2 as good for rank 1 and vehicles from early cold-war as good for rank 3 and above, etc...

 

for the source, i will seldom put them as there is no official suggestion, google it and see for yourself, correct me if i am wrong. i will put some hyperling sometime to show some additional details so you will see there is not just maked-up xxxx and there is some actual fact somewhere.

 

Rank 1

Spoiler

 

unknow vehicles

experimental SPAA proposed to the french army with the Reibel MAC 13.2mm gun. this gun was proposed to the french army but saw no services as it was in competition with the Hotchkiss 13.2mm who was more reliable; the MAC 13.2mm had a double mag who was prompt to jam.

 

Berliet VPM

this little vehicles was a prototype presented in 1928, it was not complete as the cabin and engine needed to be receiving the cover and mostly show the legs that was stabilizing the truck for use as static SPAA position. the legs aren't nessessairy and the truck should be able to shoot without them. the armament a twin 13.2mm have decent AA capacity in low rank and could also be a treat with low rank medium tank at short range.

 

weight: 6200 kg
length: 4.5 m
width: 2.06 m
engine make: Berliet 6-cyl 4085 cc
power: 62 hp (metric)

Speed : est. 44.5 km/h on-road
fuel capacity: 85 l
armament: 2 x 13.2 mm Hotchkiss

 

VPR2

new prototype of SPAA built by Berliet in 1930, the vehicles was mounting the 13.2mm static mount in the single and twin gun version. it also have a lot of ammo storage on the deck and under the deck for long fighting. the test proven the gun was not completely stable and needed to be fixed better to the chassis and the chassis itself needed to be stronger, the single prototype saw service after the test in the french army near toulon.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 4500 kg
length: 4.8 m
width: 1.94 m
height: 2.30 m
wheelbase:
- front: 1.82 m
- aft: 1.75 m
engine make: Berliet 6-cyl 2736 cc
power: 40 hp (metric)

fuel capacity: 120 l
max speed: 53 km/h
endurance: 300 km
max slope: 60%
crew: 4 (driver, loader, gunner, signting system operator)
armament: 2 x 13.2 mm Hotchkiss or 1 x 13.2 mm Hotchkiss
1440 rounds on storage boxes on platform
2500 rounds under platform

 

Berliet VPH

more finished variant of SPAA built again by Berliet. it share the same engine as the VPM but new legs and saw a small production. it was built to be better than the VPR2 with even more ammo and and a stronger chassis. the gun was now permanently mounted and 2 was build and saw some service from 1932. it carry a lot of ammo and have twin 13.2mm gun who can be very effective against plane and a treat against low rank ground target.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 6200 kg
length: 5.07 m
width: 2.10 m
wheelbase (axle-to-axle): 1.90 m
engine make: Berliet 6-cyl 4085 cc
power: 62 hp (metric)
fuel capacity: 80 l
max speed: 44.5 km/h
armament: 2 x 13.2 mm Hotchkiss

 

Citroën-Kégresse P19 AA

proposed for the CHilien army, this SPAA was built by Hotchkiss on a Citroën-Kégresse P19 model 1929, the armament was twin 13.2mm on naval mount and had a lot of ammo stored on hand. the half-track configuration allow a better off-road speed and at the same time allowed a better top speed in his time. the vehicles was proposed in 1932 but saw now production.

 

Characteristics:
weight: est. 2.530 kg
length: 4.70m
width: 1.70m
engine make: Citroen 6-Cyl (Petrol)
power: ??
max speed: 46 kph
armament: 2 x 13.2 mm Hotchkiss

 

Lorraine 28 AA

most of the people cannot identify this vehicles, but it happen to be the Lorraine 28 truck modified to be a SPAA. the Lorraine 28 was used as APC and have a fully close cabin, it totally look like some ice-cream truck. here we see this version with the rear cabin remove to leave place to the twin 13.2mm tripod mount and his ammo load. there is many record of feild modification of the Loraine 28 into SPAA. this one is reported to been done in 1936 in the french Alpe mountain.

 

Characteristics:
weight: est. 4.080 kg
length: 4.84m
width: 2.08m
engine make: 4-Cyl (Petrol) 4710 cc
power: 55 hp
max speed: 65 kph
armament: 2 x 13.2 mm Hotchkiss

 

Unidentified quadmount 13.2mm on truck

once the truck is clearly identified i will place the description with more details. for now it's reported to be a renault truck with a quadmount 13.2mm like those used for the navy.

 

Ford Stake Bed 1941

often identified as chevrolet 15CWT, this is is fact a ford truck, identified by the door line bellow the window here is another similar Ford truck.it was a heavy duty truck built by USA and liked because of the 6-cylinder engine who offer more tuck than the V-8 engine used on the previous model.

 

Citroën-Kégresse P7T AA

SPAA as it is on the game, often presented as a 1927 development for Chili but i should point out the 13.2mm gun was introduced in the french army in 1929/1930 wich suggest the P7T to be rather an early 30s development more than the late 20s. no order was made.

 

Currently in game and do fair enough against the planes at 1.3, but not a very good choice for fighting ground target.

 

Characteristics:
weight: est. 2.200 kg
length: 4.70m
width: 1.70m
engine make: Citroen 6-Cyl (Petrol)?
power: 38 hp
max speed: 40 kph
armament: 4 x 13.2 mm Hotchkiss mle 1930

 

 

Citroen Type 45

for more firepower, there is this field modification of the Citroen Type 45 with the excellent but rare in the french army, the 20mm CA 1939 Oerlikon auto-cannon. this would allow some extra-penetration over the 13.2mm which allow a better capacity to engage the ground target but not much improvement against the air-target as the 13.2mm usually come in twin and quad mount while this one have a single gun. there would do more damage on single hit but as is is logical, the 13.2mm would usually have more than one hit at once. you have more details on the suggestion fallowing the hyper-link under the name.

 

Characteristics:
weight: est. 4.600 kg
length: 7.04 m
width: 2.33 m

Height : without gun 2.13 m
engine make: Petrol 6-cylinder
power: 73 hp
max speed: 80 kph
armament: 1 x 20 mm Oerlikon CA 1939

 

 

Rank 2

 

Spoiler

 

GMC ACK

prototype built by the vichy french under the supervision of the german in 1941, this picture seem to show a gun but the lack of details couldn't tell for sure if it's a 13.2mm or a 25mm mle 1938, but the test reported a 25mm mle 1938 who have a good AA performance reported to cause twice as much fragmentation than the 20mm according to the German testing it, but had a relatively low penetration with the AP shell of about 41 to 43mm (according to historical source) the mle 1938 have a good firerate but a bit less than the Mle 1939 and also less stability in continuous fire, yet the vehicles, if armed with the 25mm gun, can make it rank in a BR of about 2,0 to 2.7

 

Characteristics:
weight: 3.416 kg
length: 6.50 m
width: 2.28 m
Height : 2.97 m
engine make: GMC 270 6-cylinder
power: 77 hp
max speed: 72 kph
armament: 1 x 25 mm CA 1938 (270 rounds)

 

Citroën Type 23U

a bit like the Citroën Type 45, this vehicles was a field modification carrying a powerful 25mm gun Hotchkiss Mle 1939, this model was having improved firerate over the mle 1938 but no better balistics, mounted on a citroen type 23U truck. the gun had AP shells who's source report penetration was relatively low, about the same as regular 20mm yet they had better post penetration damage due to the larger size. the HE shells had been reported by the german test to deal about the double fragmentation damage over of their 20mm gun. it mean a single bullet would do about twice the damage of the 20mm on a plane wich is a much better AA capacity wich justify the higher BR somewhere around 2.0 to 2.7

 

Characteristics:
weight: 3 350 kg
length: 5 040 mm
width: 1 960 mm

Height : 2 760 mm (cargo version with cover)
engine make: 4-cylinder Diesel 1911cm3
power: 42 hp
max speed: 70 kph
armament: 1 x 25 mm CA mle 1939

 

M16 MGMC

American made SPAA given to the Free French in the lend lease programe. 70 of those halftrack was in service with the french from 1943 and was the main SPAA for the last part of the ww2 for the french forces, it was also used against the infantry as "meat grounder" as they liked to call it (Hachoir a viande). this vehicle is identical to the one used in the USA tree. it would just need a little reskin to be more french like.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 9 000 kg
length: 6.5 m
width: 2.16 m

Height : 2.34 m
engine make: White 160AX, 386 in³ (6,330 cc) 6-cylinder,
power: 128 hp
max speed: 72 kph
armament: 4 x 12.7 mm M2HB

Armour : light

 

Somua MMG AB 140

post ww2 prototype of SPAA on a Somua Half-track chassis of 1940. the prototype never entered into services but the test was run using 4x HS 404 20mm gun in a AB 140 turret. the relatively high mount should allow the cannon to have below horizontal depression and the little armored rear platform allow some elementary protection. a good SPAA for a BR of around 3.0

 

Characteristics:
weight: 6 850 kg (cargo version)
length: 5.30 m
width: 2.17 m

Height : 2.85 m (cargo version)
engine make: 4-cylinder, petrol, 4712 cc
power: 60 hp
max speed: 32 kph
armament: 4 x 20 mm HS 404

Armour : light

GMC CCW 353 Vierling

SPAA truck using the GMC ACKx 353 chassis mounting the German Vierling Flak 38 20mm gun. the concept was started in 1946, test conducted in 1947 and fallowed by a small series of 35 vehicles built and saw services in the french army until at least 1952 where it was last saw. those production may had been mix with the PM512 version. in game it would easily get to BR 2.7 to 3.3

 

Characteristics:
weight: est 5 508 kg (empty truck + gun)
length: 6.86 m
width: 2.24 m

Height : 2.36 m
engine make: GMC 270 straight-6
power: 91.5 hp
max speed: 72 kph
armament: 4 x 2,0cm Flak 38

 

GMC CCKW PM512

this vehicles  built in 1947 was using the french PM 512 turret armed with 4x German 20mm Flak 38 gun left after WW2 in wide number. this vehicles built in a small series of at least 3 unites, was unnoticed but appeared in the 14 July parade of 1951 then one appeared in AA exposition of 1952, after what they seem to been decommissioned and desapeared from the french services. in game it shall have about the same BR as the CCW version

 

Characteristics:
weight: est 5 508 kg (empty truck + gun)
length: 6.86 m
width: 2.24 m

Height : 2.36 m
engine make: GMC 270 straight-6
power: 91.5 hp
max speed: 72 kph
armament: 4 x 2,0cm Flak 38

 

Rank 3

Spoiler

 

 

AMX VCI Maxon M55

a first SPAA built on AMX 13 VCI chassi. mounting the Maxon M55 turret with the quad 12.7mm this could seem to be a downgrade in the BR compare to the 20mm but it seem the AMX-13 are moved to rank 3, probably due to time line restriction so this one could be move in rank 3 with a relatively low BR of about 2.7. but it's a very good vehicles with more armour and more mobility than the M16 from the american tree. only one seem to had been built or converted.

 

Characteristics:
weight: est 15 000 kg
length: 5.7 m
width: 2.67 m

Height : 2.41 m
engine make: SOFAM Model 8Gxb 8-cyl. water-cooled petrol
power: 250 hp
max speed: 60 kph
armament: 4 x 12,7mm M2HB

Armour : light

 

Panhard M3 T20 VCA

Air defense variant of the Panhard M3 mounting a T20 turret. the 20m HS 820 gun (later renamed Oerlikon KAD) was having a elevation of -10/+60. the fully retative turret and the great mobility will make this vehicles a nice vehicles to play. it will be a real equivalent to the Italian R3 in all aspect (same turret, lightly less speed, light armour, amphibious). this vehicle will do nicely at a BR equivalent (if not identical)

 

Characteristics:
weight: 6 100 kg
length: 4.45 m
width: 2.40 m

Height : 2.00 m
engine make: Panhard Model 4HD four-cylinder air-cooled petrol
power: 90 hp
max speed: 90 kph
armament: 1 x 20 mm HS 820 (650 rounds)

armour : very light

Amphibious : Yes

 

AMX VCI M56

up-armed version of the AMX VCI who saw service in the french army as IFV rather than a APC like the original AMX VCI was supposed to be. this version, armed with a 20mm auto-canon have a pretty high elevation to engage low flying aircraft and helicopter. this model is similar to the DNC-1 used by mexico since the 90s.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: est 15 000 kg
length: 5.7 m
width: 2.67 m

Height : 2.41 m
engine make: SOFAM Model 8Gxb 8-cyl. water-cooled petrol
power: 250 hp
max speed: 60 kph
armament: 1 x 20mm RH 202

Armour : light

 

AMX 13 bitube 20mm

Version of the AMX 13 mounting a turret similar to the Panhard AML S530. this version was a perfectly working vehicles of 1971 offer in the international market but found no success. It carries twin M621 20 mm auto-cannon, with 260 rounds belt for each gun. his elevation of +70° and a depression of −10° will make it a good SPAA but have a weakness of 20° conic dead angle that would make it vulnerable to stiff diving planes (those who lunch rocket and fly away before getting close)

 

Characteristics:
weight: est 14 500 kg
length: 5.7 m
width: 2.67 m

Height : 2.35 m
engine make: SOFAM Model 8Gxb 8-cyl. water-cooled petrol
power: 250 hp
max speed: 60 kph
armament: 2 x 20 mm M621

armour : light

 

Panhard AML S530

SPAA version of the Panhard AML mounting the S530 turret armed with the M621 gun. the turret will allow a good elevation and depression. this extremly mobile vehicles was offer in international market where it was ordered by Venuzuela. this version have a relatively light ammo load as the both gun have 260 round in belt and another 600 rounds are stored, it mean about a single reload possible. the 260 round belt will be long to use anyway.

 

Characteristics:
weight: est 5 500 kg
length: 3.79 m
width: 1.97 m

Height : 2.07 m
engine make: Panhard 1.99 l (121 in³) Model 4 HD flat 4-cylinder air-cooled petrol
power: 90 hp
max speed: 60 kph
armament: 2 x 20 mm M621 (1140 rounds)

armour : very light

 

ERC 20 Kriss

SPAA version of the ERC. this was proposed as export vehicles on the international market and only 4 was been bought by Gabonese army for escort vehicles for the president himself. it was armed with the M621 autocannon with only 560 round carried. the protection is relatively low but the mobility is quit interresting.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 8 000 kg
length: 5.1 m
width: 2.49 m

Height : 2.5 m
engine make: Peugeot V6 petrol
power: 155 hp
max speed: 95 kph
armament: 2 x 20 mm M621 (560 rounds)

armour : very light

AMphibious : yes

 

 

AMX 13 S 232

Quadritube version of the AMX 13 mounting the S 232 built during the early stage of the development of the AMX-13. the AMX-13 was design fallowing the requirement to have multiple version including SPAA with 4x guns. this version was presented as prototype and given satisfaction, a second prototype was built in 1951 to carry more test around toulon as tank support, fallowing the tank regiments. at the end no order was made for this variant due to the the need of better guns. note the chassis is the one of the AMX 12.5t (prototype of the AMX 13)

 

Characteristics:
weight: est 12 500 kg
length: 5.7 m
width: 2.67 m

Height : 2.35 m
engine make: SOFAM Model 8Gxb 8-cyl. water-cooled petrol
power: 250 hp
max speed: 60 kph
armament: 4 x 20 mm (probably Flak 38)

armour : light

 

 

VAB T20/13

the VAB T20/13 is a VAB armed with the TC20 turret. this APC/IFV is widely used french vehicles since 1977 and saw many variant hosting different turret for more specialized use. this one is armed with the 20mm F2 auto-cannon with high elevation rate for IFV use and close-air-support against the helicopter. the turret also have a coax LMG and smoke discharger. the vehicles have a great mobility but little protection. this vehicles is at the limit to be more fit as light-tank with AA capacity than a SPAA itself.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 13 250 kg
length: 5.94 m
width: 2.49 m

Height : 2.53 m
engine make: MIDS Turbo Diesel 06-20-45
power: 220 hp
max speed: 90 kph
armament: 1 x 20mm CN MIT 20 F2

                  1 x LMG

 

 

AMX 10P

Successor of the AMX VCI, the AMX 10P is a APC/IFV vehicles who have close-air-support capacity against helicopter. armed with remote turret who have a 20mm F2 auto-cannon and a 7.62 AA-52 machine-gun and smoke discharger. the vehicle was produced at over 1,000 tanks since 1973. it offer protection against 14mm HMG and good mobility. those vehicles are now going to be replaced by new APC in the french army. this vehicles is at the limite to be more a Light tank with AA capacity than a SPAA

 

Characteristics:
weight: 14 200 kg
length: 5.85 m
width: 2.78 m

Height : 2.57 m
engine make: Hispano-Suiza HS-115
power: 260 hp
max speed: 65 kph
armament: 1 x 20mm CN MIT 20 F2 (800 rounds)

                  1 x LMG

 

 

GMC CCKW 353 Bofors 40mm

to be honest, i dislike this one, but it have his place noneless. it was a WW2 gun truck used by the french after receiving it from the American during the liberation of france in the late WW2. we can see above the french uniform and the Carabin M1 hanging on the truck's dash, it's very representative of the french using the American Equipement to carry the fight with something that wasn't as obsolete as the old early war equipment.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 8 500 kg
length: 6.86 m
width: 2.24 m

Height : 2.36 m
engine make: GMC 270 straight-6
power: 91.5 hp
max speed: 64 kph
armament: 1 x 40mm Bofors L60

 

GMC CCKW 353 1947

due to the lack of SPAA, the french army in indochina, had modified a few GMC CCKW 353 mounting the 40mm Bofors cannon and giving them a relatively small protection. an additional 12.7mm was sometime found on the fron cabin. this feild modification was not really standard and i saw some without the 12.7mm. at least 3 was modified like this and used in indochina as IFV against the ambush.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 8 500 kg
length: 6.86 m
width: 2.24 m

Height : 2.36 m
engine make: GMC 270 straight-6
power: 91.5 hp
max speed: 64 kph
armament: 1 x 40mm Bofors L60

protection : Very light

 

LVT-4 Bofors

Field modification made by the french in Indochina. this LVT A 4 was an exelent IFV for the wetland of Indochina and allow a exelent mobility in the swamp, river and rice feild. the french had mounted the 40mm Bofors L/60 gun as main armament in a new turret, this allow a impresive firepower in a relatively well protected APC. this modification was seen in the late 40s and early 50s. at least 3 was done. relatively large, slow and lightly protected, this will do a good SPAA despite his weakness as it will do better than the actual rank 3 SPAA

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 16 500 kg
length: 7.95 m
width: 3.25 m

Height : 2.49 m
engine make: Continental W-670-9A; 7 cylinder, 4 stroke, air-cooled gasoline radial aircraft engine
power: 250 hp
max speed: 32 kph
armament: 1 x 40mm Bofors L/60

protection : Very light

Amphibious : Yes

 

Panhard VBL cannon

this light vehicles was designed by panhard and was a up-gunned prototype of the VBL. the new turret armed with the Rh-202 was having quit decent penetration and close-air-support capacity, the vehicles never pass the stage of prototype. only a few picture can be found.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 4 000 kg
length: 3.80 m
width: 2.02 m

Height : 1.70 m
engine make: Peugeot XD3T turbo-diesel
power: 95 hp
max speed: 95 kph
armament: 1x 20mm Rheinmetall Mk 20 Rh-202

protection : Very light

 

 

Rank 4

Spoiler

 

ACMAT VLRA 641 VCP

i got to admit, i was first thinking this was a feild modification made with russian gun and trucks so much it's different than modern european SPAA. but it is really a french production vehicles that deserve our attention. this gun truck is armed with the twin 20mm Oerlikon KAB (same gun as the italian R3) the truck was entering service in the early 60s and saw a mass production and presented as a robust multi-usage offroad truck. as for 2018, the last of them are going to be withdraw from active serce, this version is a perfect SPAA. a bit vulnerable but the gun would be deadly against ground and air-target.

 

Characteristics:
weight: about 3 000 kg
length: 6.3 m
width: 2.10 m

Height : 2.56 m
engine make: 6-cylinder
power: 145 hp
max speed: 95 kph
armament: 2 x 20 mm Oerlikon KAD automatic cannon

armour : next to none

 

AMX 13 DCA 40

If you didn't had fun with this little fallow, you didn't play it right. this was a french prototype of SPAA on the AMX-13 chassis. there was no production but the prototype proven good. the vehicles was armed with the 40mm L/70 bofors gun who have a better firerate, velocity and penetration than the L/60 while firing the same ammo. it was for my onw opignon an exelent choice for rank 4 SPAA

 

Characteristics:
weight: est 14 500 kg
length: 5.7 m
width: 2.67 m

Height : 2.35 m
engine make: SOFAM Model 8Gxb 8-cyl. water-cooled petrol
power: 250 hp
max speed: 60 kph
armament: 1 x 40 mm Borfor L/70

armour : light

 

AMX 10 TTB

 

SPAA tank offer in international market from the early 80s as close air-support vehicles. the tank was built on the AMX 10P chassis and mounted a new turret with the 40mm L/70 gun. this tank was getting no success as the AA missile was taking all the attention as SPAA and in the early 90s, the vehicles was remove from the offer.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: est 14 200 kg
length: 5.778 m
width: 2.78 m

Height : 1.87 m
engine make: Hispano-Suiza Model 115-2 eight-cylinder liquid-cooled diesel
power: 276 hp
max speed: 65 kph
armament: 1 x 40 mm Borfor L/70

armour : light

 

AMX 13 DCA prototype

the prototype of the AMX 13 DCA using the 30mm was in dirrect competition with the 40mm version. this highly maneuvrable vehicles had been more efficient tracking and engaging the flying target as the 30mm gun have a much better firerate than the 40mm gun. there was a production of the AMX-13 DCA (30) but with radar. the prototype have no radar wich deserve his own place if need a gap filler.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 17 200 kg
length: 5.7 m
width: 2.67 m

Height : 2.35 m
engine make: SOFAM Model 8Gxb 8-cyl. water-cooled petrol
power: 250 hp
max speed: 60 kph
armament: 2 x 30 mm HS-831A autocannons

armour : light

 

Rank 5

Spoiler

 

 

Panhard M3 VDA

SPAA variant of the Panhard M3 chassis, mounting the Hispano-Suiza 820 SL 20mm autocannon in a one-man turret. the turret have an elevation of +85 and -5 wich allow a good AA capacity but not so good against ground target. the turret is also equiped with rador that can track up to 4 target at the same time on 8km. it have 650 rounds stored and offer little protection. this would be a little starter for rank 5 as the vehicles is equiped with a radar but have little firepower.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 7 000 kg
length: 4.45 m
width: 2.4 m

Height : 2 m
engine make: Panhard Model 4HD four-cylinder air-cooled petrol
power: 90 hp
max speed: 90 kph
armament: 2 x 20 mm Hispano-Suiza 820 SL

armour : light

Radar : ESD RA-20, 8km range

 

GIat VAB VADAR

the VAD Vadar was a prototype of SPAA built on the VAB chassi to propose the close-air-support for the french army against helicopter and low flying aircraft. the vehicles remained prototype as the french army show more interrest to the Missile base AA vehicles already in the mid 80s. it was armed with a pair of 20mm F2 auto-cannon and had a radar in SAMM GTS turret.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 13 800 kg
length: 5.98 m
width: 2.49 m

Height : 2.06 m m
engine make: Renault MIDR 062045
power: 320 hp
max speed: 110 kph
armament: 2 × 20mm F2 cannon (500rnds per guns)

armour : light

Radar : EMD 20

Smoke grenage : 4x

AMphibious : Yes

 

 

AMX 13 DCA (30)

First SPAA version to saw a real service using a radar in the french army. the AMX-13 DCA 30 was built in a small series of 60 vehicles and was using the 30mm gun in the same turret as the AMX-30 DCA use. the turret was mounting a radar at the end, either the Oeil Noir or Oeil Vert radar who could be a modification up-grade of the same vehicles as it would not brinf much new ellement to have them both.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 17 200 kg
length: 5.7 m
width: 2.67 m

Height : 2.35 m
engine make: SOFAM Model 8Gxb 8-cyl. water-cooled petrol
power: 250 hp
max speed: 60 kph
armament: 2x 30mm HS-831A autocannons (600 rounds)

armour : light

Radar : Oeil noir or Oeil Vert

 

AMX 30 DCA

larger SPAA than the AMX 13 DCA, the AMX-30 DCA used the AMX-30 chassis naturally. it saw a small production of over 50 vehicles and carry more ammo than the AMX-13. if the turret is the same, the chassis of the AMX-30 offer a better speed and protection. on the downside, it is a much larger target than the AMX-13, yet the protection will make it up for it.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 36 000 kg
length: 9.48 m (tank version including the gun)
width: 3.1 m

Height : 2.28 m
engine make: Hispano-Suiza HS-110 multi-fuel
power: 680 hp
max speed: 64 kph
armament: 2x 30mm HS-831A autocannons (1200 rounds)

armour : good

Radar : Oeil noir or Oeil Vert

 

AMX 10 RAA

ugly but decent, the AMX 10 RAA was a SPAA based on the AMX 10 RC. equiped with the Oeil Noir and later the Oeil Vert radard system, the AMX 10 RAA was offered for export but found no success. armed with the 30mm auto-cannon, this fallow would do a good alternative to the AMX-13 or AMX 30 DCA

 

Characteristics:
weight: 6 500 kg
length: 6.358 m
width: 2.86 m

Height : 2.86? m
engine make: Beaudoin 6F11 SRX
power: 280 hp
max speed: 85 kph
armament: 2x 30mm HS-831A autocannons (1200 rounds)

armour : light

Radar : Oeil noir or Oeil Vert

 

 

Rank 6

Spoiler

 

Peugeot P4 Aspic IIRC

SAM build on a Peugeot P4 pick-up with the Aspic mount. the vehicles is equiped with 4x ready to lunch Mistral Ground-To-Air missile and an additional 4 missiles are stored in the rear bed. those missile, while been small, it have a great speed. The basic element of the complex - fire control system, which includes: optical TV detection system "ARES", infrared camera, computer and automatic target tracking system.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 3 200 kg
length: 4.20 m
width: 1.7 m
engine make: 2.5 L XD3 diesel I4
power: 70 hp
max speed: 118 kph
armament: 4x (ready) Mistral surface to air missiles (4x additional missiles stored)

 

Renault Multi Purpose Combat Vehicle

lastest SAM to enter in the french services with the first vehicles in operation since 2016. it feature the Mistral-2 SAM with electro-optical sensors and a light calliber machine-gun. additional 4 missiles are stored inside the truck. the high mobility and the light protection will make this vehicle a interresting improvement over the Peugeot P4.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 13 000 kg
length: 3,54 m
width: 2,36 m

Height : 2,13 m (without the turret)
engine make: diesel
power: ?
max speed: 110 kph
armament: 4x (ready) Mistral 2 surface to air missiles (4x additional missiles stored)

                  1x LMG (various gun possible)

armour : light

 

VAB SANTAL

SAM vehicles developed in 1987 and using the French VAB APC/IFV chassis. the system was using the Friendly/foe sight detection, pulse-Doppler radar detection and tracking of air targets "Rodeo-2". the turret could be mounted on various vehicles and used 6 ready to lunch Mistral missiles, additional missile could be stored inside the vehicle (probably 6 more). the chassis feature light protection and high mobility. the turret also feature grenade luncher for smoke screen.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 13 800 kg
length: 5.98 m
width: 2.49 m

Height : 2.06 m (withot turret)
engine make: Renault MIDR 062045
power: 320
max speed: 110 kph
armament: 6x Mistral SAM ready to launch (more stored)

armour : light

Radar : pulse-Doppler radar

Amphibious : Yes

 

Thales RAPIDFIRE

not much details on this one, it is a SPAA built on the back of a truck built by Thales and armed with the 40mm auto-cannon build by nexter, it's the same gun as the ERBC Jaguar. this CTA CT40 40 mm cannon have a good rater of fire of 180-200 rounds minutes with a continuous feed. we can see smoke dischargers and a close turret who have some protection. but i lack of details about the vehicles itself. the good shells of the armament allow it to be in high rank but only if there is also a radar which is possible on this vehicles.

 

Rank 7

Spoiler

 

VAB 6x6 VDAA TA20 

Proposed variant to the internation market with the 20mm gun (also available in 23mm or 25mm gun version) and mistral missiles in triple pod. the vehicles saw some export but without the missiles pod,. additional missiles could be loaded inside the vehicle.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 13 800 kg
length: 5.98 m
width: 2.49 m

Height : 2.06 m (withot turret)
engine make: Renault MIDR 062045
power: 320
max speed: 110 kph
armament:  2 x 20 mm M.621

                  6x Mistral SAM ready to launch (more stored)

armour : light

Radar : pulse-Doppler radar

Amphibious : Yes

 

AMX-30R (Roland)

SAM conversion of the AMX-30 MBT. it was having a tall hull and equiped with the Roland SAM system. the vehicles was ordered into production and saw service in france from 1977 and over 180 tanks was built in this specification.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 34 000 kg
length: 9.48 m (tank version including the gun)
width: 3.1 m
engine make: Hispano-Suiza HS-110 multi-fuel
power: 720
max speed: 64 kph
armament: 10x Roland SAM (2 ready to lunch)

armour : light

Radar : Roland Exploration

 

 

P4R Crotale

 

SAM sistem using the P4R chassi and carrying the Crotal missiles.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 14 950 kg
length: 6,22 m
width: 2,72
Height : 3,41 m
engine make: ^
power: ^
max speed: 70 kph
armament: 4x Crotal R440 ready t0 use

armour : light

Radar : yes

 

AMX 30 Shahine

 

 

 

 

Flakpanzer Leclerc

 

 

 

 

Not fit for the game....

Spoiler

 

Autocanon de 75mm Mle1913/34

rather heavy for the SPAA but that was his main role so that would do nicely in this line even if it could be more pratical to used it as SPG. that Heavy self-propelled AA gun was one of the few SPAA who was actually in service at the start of WW2 with over 200 in used in 1940, they had some AT capacity as well as it was repported during the battle of Saint-Folquin bridge on 24th May 1940, two of them engaged the german in dirrect fire and destroying 3x Stug III. yet the elevation or rather the depression will make it difficult to engage the enemy on the ground. the turret rotate at 237° wich mean more than half of a full circle. it use the AA version of the 75mm Mle 1887 gun and share the same ammo including APHE shells who have more penetration than the one used on the B1bis or SAu.40. there is a problem, the truck itself do not carry ammo as the ammo was carry in another vehicles. and another problem, the driver and commander sit are on the front of the gunsheild itself and rotate with the gun, that mean the gun need to face forward to move around.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 5.884 kg
length: 4.80m
width: 1.84m

Height : 1.90m
engine make: Petrol 6-cylinder
power: 73 hp
max speed: 32 kph
armament: 1 x 75mm L/36 Modèle 1913/34 Gun

 

Refused because of the absence of ammo carried on the vehicles itself...

Refused because of the driver sit moving with the turret making it hard to be realistic with the game mechanic...

 

Citroën-Kégresse P19 Hotchkiss AAMG

not going too deep in this case, it was just a P19 with a old hotchkiss LMG.

 

Refuse because of the too little firepower...

 

AMX 30 Javelot

experimental designe of SPAA using unguided rocket in salvo of 8 as SPAA. the program of 100M was founded by USA and was developed in france. the concept was abandonned in 1973 without prototype built.

 

refused because Unbuilt concept...

 

Panhard ERC 25

SPAA variant of the Panahard ERC with a 25mm M242 chaingun. this vehicle was proposed for international export be saw no sucess. at the oposite of other SPAA, this one have a LMG as coax and was rather a AFV with anti-helicopter capacity. his gun give him a good anti-tank capacity but the tracking of airplanes will not be so easy depite to be good at it.

 

Characteristics:
weight: 6 500 kg
length: 5.7 m
width: 2.67 m

Height : 2.35 m
engine make: Peugeot V6 petrol
power: 155 hp
max speed: over 100 kph
armament: 1 x 25 mm M242 (200 rounds)

                  1 x 7,62mm LMG (1000 rounds)

armour : light

Amphibious : yes

 

Refused because, it's more a Light tank with AA capacity than an AA vehicles.

 

 

EBRC jaguar

elcelent vehicles, coming into service soon, as replacement for the AMX-10RC and other Armoured car in the french army. good 40mm auto-cannon with high elevation to engage helicopter, good armour, good obtic, good ATGM in the side of the turret.

Refused because, it's more a Light tank with AA capacity than an AA vehicles.

 

AMC 10 RCR T40

this was a demonstrator of for the new T40 turret for the next generation of recon vehicles. it was mounted on the AMX-10RCR chassis, offering a good protection and good mobility, the turret is equiped with the 40mm auto-cannon as main armament, who could have a high elevation to engage helicopter. the turret also have two ATGM in retractable pod in the rear.

 

Refused because, it's more a Light tank with AA capacity than an AA vehicles.

 

 

Work in progress.....

Edited October 3, 2020 by CaID

[TheFuzzieOne 3,355]

Unfortunately the Leclerc SPAA is also not fit, in that it never existed. The image if a photo mockup, I am led to believe. A pity, because it looks freaking cool.

[Cedjoe 5,482]

2 minutes ago, TheFuzzieOne said:

Unfortunately the Leclerc SPAA is also not fit, in that it never existed. The image if a photo mockup, I am led to believe. A pity, because it looks freaking cool.

I’ve heard that many times, but I’ve never seen a serious source stating it either did or did not exist...

[WayOfTheWolk 1,573]

Just now, Cedjoe said:

I’ve heard that many times, but I’ve never seen a serious source stating it either did or did not exist...

I have to check one of my books but I do recall hearing somewhere that it was just a photo montage created by GIAT.

[Cedjoe 5,482]

That’s a nice list, maybe you can try adding some other types of vehicles such as the VAB T20/13 and other single 20mm vehicles (as things like the R3 are in game), AMX-10 RAA, the VAB&ERC-90 Santal, any of the many prototypes that carried Mistrals, VLRA Mistral, Crotale platforms, the VAB VDAA with mistral mounts, etc... Maybe even the AMX-30 Javelot 

10 minutes ago, WayOfTheWolk said:

I have to check one of my books but I do recall hearing somewhere that it was just a photo montage created by GIAT.

It might be, but if it’s from the 90s, I have to say it is well made. 
 

The P4 with Mistrals is named Aspic IIRC

 

edit : added some vehicles to the list

Edited September 29, 2020 by Cedjoe

[Cedjoe 5,482]

You can also add the M16 MGMC which is one of the rare 100% copy paste SPAA that could be added to the French Tech Tree.

[Valcour 1,141]

I see this CCKW has a larger crew than found in game.

 

[nxdefiant001 1,397]

Here's a few more suggestions for ranks 6 and 7

(well maybe not the ACMAT)

 

VAB ESD TA20 w/ Mistral pods (can be removed)

Spoiler

 

Roland M3S

Spoiler

 

M35 Crotale

Spoiler

 

Renault Sherpa MPCV (can also be used as an ATGM platform)

Spoiler

 

ACMAT VLRA 641 VCP  (Oerlikon bitube)

Spoiler

 

Thales RAPIDFIRE

Spoiler

 

 

 

Bonus : Gaijin fix the goddamn Roland

Spoiler

 

[CaID 8,996]

1 hour ago, Cedjoe said:

You can also add the M16 MGMC which is one of the rare 100% copy paste SPAA that could be added to the French Tech Tree.

I didn't forgot it. Its just i went through a list i had done somewhere else and the m16 was not needed in this one so it was in a section on the side. I was barely starting the rank 6 when i had to stop for today.

 

1 hour ago, Cedjoe said:

That’s a nice list, maybe you can try adding some other types of vehicles such as the VAB T20/13 and other single 20mm vehicles (as things like the R3 are in game), AMX-10 RAA, the VAB&ERC-90 Santal, any of the many prototypes that carried Mistrals, VLRA Mistral, Crotale platforms, the VAB VDAA with mistral mounts, etc... Maybe even the AMX-30 Javelot 

It might be, but if it’s from the 90s, I have to say it is well made. 
 

The P4 with Mistrals is named Aspic IIRC

 

edit : added some vehicles to the list

Good to know. Yeah it is a priminary list and got to add plenty IFV and AFV who have AA capacity. But some, like the new jaguar armoured car are more fit as light tank/recon even if it does have aa capacity against helicopter

1 minute ago, nxdefiant001 said:

Here's a few more suggestions for ranks 6 and 7

(well maybe not the ACMAT)

 

VAB ESD TA20 w/ Mistral pods (can be removed)

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Roland M3S

  Reveal hidden contents

 

M35 Crotale

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Renault Sherpa MPCV (can also be used as an ATGM platform)

  Reveal hidden contents

 

ACMAT VLRA 641 VCP  (Oerlikon bitube)

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Thales RAPIDFIRE

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

Bonus : Gaijin fix the goddamn Roland

  Reveal hidden contents

 

All of them will be added in my next update tomorrow. Some i had not even know. Good work. SPAA are sometime so negligated and France still miss rank 2 SPAA and the rank 3 s***k and could use and alternative. I got an hanful of alternative for rank 3 and rank 2

[CaID 8,996]

1 hour ago, TheFuzzieOne said:

Unfortunately the Leclerc SPAA is also not fit, in that it never existed. The image if a photo mockup, I am led to believe. A pity, because it looks freaking cool.

If it's the case i will move it to the last section just bellow "not fit for the game" or create a new section as "possible addition" if we have condradictory info

[CaID 8,996]

46 minutes ago, Valcour said:

I see this CCKW has a larger crew than found in game.

 

Was is not 5 men crew? How Many it is in game? Anyway, 1more or less man when a plan make rain 12.7 or 20mm ballet or lunch a single rocket that do not need to hit you... I do not think it would make it much better.

 

The armored version would at least make it resiste to racket blast that miss you. I plan to suggest it soon. I got a brand new articles about it in the last issue of Vehicules Militaire magazine that explain the standarization of the APC the was needed in the early coldwar French conflict in indochina and Algeria.

[FouManchou 2,463]

1 hour ago, CaID said:

Was is not 5 men crew? How Many it is in game? Anyway, 1more or less man when a plan make rain 12.7 or 20mm ballet or lunch a single rocket that do not need to hit you... I do not think it would make it much better.

 

The armored version would at least make it resiste to racket blast that miss you. I plan to suggest it soon. I got a brand new articles about it in the last issue of Vehicules Militaire magazine that explain the standarization of the APC the was needed in the early coldwar French conflict in indochina and Algeria.

In game you have 3 crewmen. Even one more would mean a whole lot more survivability especially vs tanks but also vs aircraft.

[Cedjoe 5,482]

6 hours ago, CaID said:

I didn't forgot it. Its just i went through a list i had done somewhere else and the m16 was not needed in this one so it was in a section on the side. I was barely starting the rank 6 when i had to stop for today.

Sure I was just listing everything I could think of 

[nxdefiant001 1,397]

In case modellling a M270 MLRS chassis is too complicated for Gaijin, here's the american international armoured box with Crotale (image from Thales (France), Crotale is NOT for the US tree)

Spoiler

source : http://radars-darricau.fr/livre/2-PDF/histoire.pdf

Edited September 30, 2020 by nxdefiant001
added source

[Foxtrot39 208]

18 hours ago, Cedjoe said:

I’ve heard that many times, but I’ve never seen a serious source stating it either did or did not exist...

Search the book the image is from, disclaimer of it being a photo montage is on the same page

[PlanyKaanere 722]

Here's another idea: AMX VCI with TA-20 turret (same as the M3 VDA)

 

 

 

[CaID 8,996]

little up-date adding some vehicles in rank 6/7 along with the M16 MGMC. more will come soon. including @PlanyKaanere and @nxdefiant001 minilist. there is some good vehicles to add. note that i put a link under the name of the vehicles when there is a suggestion made about them or if they are ingame. use those link for more details.

[Cedjoe 5,482]

Here are some I didn't see listed in the comments :

 

Cannon AAs :

AMX-10 RAA (twin 30mm)

Spoiler

VAB TA20 & TA23 & TA25 (twin 20/23/25mm and up to 6 Mistrals)

Spoiler

 

IFV/light AA :

VAB T20/13 (single 20mm)

Spoiler

AMX-10P (single 20mm)

Spoiler

VBL 20mm (single 20mm)

Spoiler

 

Missile platforms :
VLRA Javelin (Starburst missile x2)

Spoiler

TPK 425 STL PAMELA aka VLRA Mistral (single Mistral mount)

Spoiler

VLRA ALBI (twin Mistral mount)

Spoiler

VAB ALBI (twin Mistral mount)

Spoiler

VBL Mistral/ALBI (twin Mistral mount)

Spoiler

P4 Mygale (quadruple Mistral mount)

Spoiler

VBL Aspic (sextuple Mistral mount)

Spoiler

ERC Santal (sextuple Mistral mount)

Spoiler

 

The last ones I could think of that I didn't list here are all the platforms for Roland and Crotale missiles.

 

Edited September 30, 2020 by Cedjoe

[AlphaVI 1,211]

JESUS these are way too cool, if they in the game il be playing AA all day long !

AMAZING TREAD !

[CaID 8,996]

1 hour ago, AlphaVI said:

JESUS these are way too cool, if they in the game il be playing AA all day long !

AMAZING TREAD !

France have a wide selection of vehicles. I saw a message from one of the admin in the devblog under the strategist even explaining why the event vehicles or often either Germany, USA or Russian, it say other nation like UK, France, Italy, Japan, Sweden or china do not have much good choice to be added. I think it's totally wrong for UK, France and china. But true enough for italy, Japan and Sweden. While They still haven't reach those nation's limite, They have little interesting addition to do. 

 

I want to show that France have one of the largest addition pool as for now. Here We already have about 50 aa vehicles. It mean at least 5 for each rank. If not all of them need to be added, They could at very least add a few of them, with a priority for the rank 2 who is missing for 2 years. I also plan to work up the tree a bit like i did in the chinese, with a step by step expansion to show what work it could be done in a single year by adding 1-2 reasearchable vehicles in majors update. The air tree also can be reworked.

 

On The other hand, i will flood The suggestion board with good French vehicles to add some details on those choice.

 

So next time and admin pull out a bad excuse to say France do not have the largest pool of addition, We can point him out ATM it have wider pool of unique additions than USA, Germany or Russia as those 3 nation have pretty much reach a points where the addition are mostly different modification of share They already have.

 

Notice there is no real ATGM tank in French tree for the moment. Its not like France had not used the milan or two ATGM on tank/AFV platform. France was simply neglugated. Uk as well but i will leave UK for later

[Cedjoe 5,482]

The MPCV actually has a suggestion on the Italian forum 

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/455157-mpcv/

 

Btw you forgot to mention the 12.7mm machine gun in between the missiles.

 

Here I found some documents about the Santal turret :

https://cloud.mail.ru/public/9dEX/djuwzbp4V/Armee et Defense/1988/03-04/

https://cloud.mail.ru/public/9dEX/djuwzbp4V/Armee et Defense/1990/11-12/

Looks like it has an impressive 50°/s rotation speed.

 

34 minutes ago, CaID said:

France have a wide selection of vehicles. I saw a message from one of the admin in the devblog under the strategist even explaining why the event vehicles or often either Germany, USA or Russian, it say other nation like UK, France, Italy, Japan, Sweden or china do not have much good choice to be added. I think it's totally wrong for UK, France and china. But true enough for italy, Japan and Sweden. While They still haven't reach those nation's limite, They have little interesting addition to do. 

 

I want to show that France have one of the largest addition pool as for now. Here We already have about 50 aa vehicles. It mean at least 5 for each rank. If not all of them need to be added, They could at very least add a few of them, with a priority for the rank 2 who is missing for 2 years. I also plan to work up the tree a bit like i did in the chinese, with a step by step expansion to show what work it could be done in a single year by adding 1-2 reasearchable vehicles in majors update. The air tree also can be reworked.

 

On The other hand, i will flood The suggestion board with good French vehicles to add some details on those choice.

 

So next time and admin pull out a bad excuse to say France do not have the largest pool of addition, We can point him out ATM it have wider pool of unique additions than USA, Germany or Russia as those 3 nation have pretty much reach a points where the addition are mostly different modification of share They already have.

 

Notice there is no real ATGM tank in French tree for the moment. Its not like France had not used the milan or two ATGM on tank/AFV platform. France was simply neglugated. Uk as well but i will leave UK for later

France has also been leading in the ATGM field since the 50s and had some of the first (maybe the first ones? I'm not sure) ATGM carrying vehicles in the world...

I think another thread like this one about rocket/ATGM carrying vehicles could be interesting and would have almost as many vehicles as this one 

Edited October 1, 2020 by Cedjoe

[CaID 8,996]

11 minutes ago, Cedjoe said:

The MPCV actually has a suggestion on the Italian forum 

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/455157-mpcv/

 

Btw you forgot to mention the 12.7mm machine gun in between the missiles.

 

Here I found some documents about the Santal turret :

https://cloud.mail.ru/public/9dEX/djuwzbp4V/Armee et Defense/1988/03-04/

Looks like it has an impressive 50°/s rotation speed.

France has also been leading in the ATGM field since the 50s and had some of the first (maybe the first ones? I'm not sure) ATGM carrying vehicles in the world...

I think another thread like this one about rocket/ATGM carrying vehicles could be interesting and would have almost as many vehicles as this one 

i belive i mentioned the LMG

 

lastest SAM to enter in the french services with the first vehicles in operation since 2016. it feature the Mistral-2 SAM with electro-optical sensors and a light calliber machine-gun. additional 4 missiles are stored inside the truck. the high mobility and the light protection will make this vehicle a interresting improvement over the Peugeot P4.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 13 000 kg
length: 3,54 m
width: 2,36 m

Height : 2,13 m (without the turret)
engine make: diesel
power: ?
max speed: 110 kph
armament: 4x (ready) Mistral 2 surface to air missiles (4x additional missiles stored)

armour : light

 

it's not necessary the 12.7mm, but yeah i will point out there is a LMG in the armament.

[Cedjoe 5,482]

1 minute ago, CaID said:

i belive i mentioned the LMG

 

lastest SAM to enter in the french services with the first vehicles in operation since 2016. it feature the Mistral-2 SAM with electro-optical sensors and a light calliber machine-gun. additional 4 missiles are stored inside the truck. the high mobility and the light protection will make this vehicle a interresting improvement over the Peugeot P4.

 

 

Characteristics:
weight: 13 000 kg
length: 3,54 m
width: 2,36 m

Height : 2,13 m (without the turret)
engine make: diesel
power: ?
max speed: 110 kph
armament: 4x (ready) Mistral 2 surface to air missiles (4x additional missiles stored)

armour : light

 

it's not necessary the 12.7mm, but yeah i will point out there is a LMG in the armament.

Yeah I meant in the armament section 

[CaID 8,996]

a little up-date done, adding most of the auto-cannon vehicles without radar that was mentioned in your comments. some more will come later. still have to do the SAM and Radar guided auto-cannon.

 

45 vehicles so far (not counting the Flakpanzer leclerc). about 10 more that could be added.

the SPAA along could be a tree on his own.

 

i also move the ERB 25 in the refused section as it was more like a recon vehicles with AA capacity than an actual SPAA. i would not want it to lose his chance to have the recon system in-game. also added the modern Armoured car with the TAC40 turret so people will know i didn't forget about them. they are just not good choice of SPAA and better choice as light tank.

Edited October 1, 2020 by CaID

[AlphaVI 1,211]

 

took me 10 min, and i created a folder with 2 AA,

 

for the game you can just take the turret and the chasis and mixe them, litraly like the chaffe AMX13,

come on its not hat hard to do it

 

btw the reason i put at 7.3 is beacaus the falcon is 7.3 wit hstabilizer if im not wrong ?

so maybe even put it at 7.0 ?