Why is KA-50 still allowed to remain invincible through detonating SAM's missiles with its own?

[chomiake 769]

Frankly, I find it ridiculous that it is pretty much invincible unless the pilot is caught unaware. In order to take the heli down, the SAM has to deliberately avoid aiming at its target and only aim once the missile is too close to the helicopter for the pilot to time its missiles properly. This is a feature given only to one nation which I find plain unfair. Even the best SPAA in the game currently, Flarakrad with its ludicrous repair cost is defeated easily just because it can launch only 2 missiles while the helicopter has no reload at all.

 

It's just like the old "feature" that made OTOMATIC defenceless against dumb rockets because its ammo kept detonating on rockets, making the helicopters win every time. 

SPAA ammo must not detonate on enemy projectiles period

[CodeNameColdWar 823]

Yes i don't know if it is realistic to use its own missiles as some kind of APS. 

I assume in reality it can be done but hard to achieve against fast moving missiles.

Due to 1)  Visibility (pilots in reality sit in his cockpit not having a 3rd view. and has to look out for fast moving missiles in his cam or from inside cockpit) 

            2)  Tech wise (Don't know if Vikhr proxy fuse is really that sensitive against such small and fast moving targets. Because if it was too sensitive it could blow off before hitting any tank on the ground)

   

[chomiake 769]

6 hours ago, MCmaddawg said:

It's realistic, quit your crying and git gud.

and how exactly am I supposed to git gud in this case?

 

besides, you call this realistic? xDDD An SPAA with 10km range and no self-defence weaponry, which is not supposed to ever see the frontline, is put in a box with MBTs who can easily come closer than 1km, while being literally uncapable of destoying a still target it is designed to counter and I am supposed to accept it as realistic xDDD

 

just another troll to add to ignore list I guess

Edited June 25, 2021 by chomiake

[MCmaddawg 341]

2 hours ago, CodeNameColdWar said:

Yes i don't know if it is realistic to use its own missiles as some kind of APS. 

I assume in reality it can be done but hard to achieve against fast moving missiles.

Due to 1)  Visibility (pilots in reality sit in his cockpit not having a 3rd view. and has to look out for fast moving missiles in his cam or from inside cockpit) 

            2)  Tech wise (Don't know if Vikhr proxy fuse is really that sensitive against such small and fast moving targets. Because if it was too sensitive it could blow off before hitting any tank on the ground)

   

Ka52 has 2 pilots, one controls the aircraft the other one controls the missiles. When ever they are being locked by radar or a missile is being launched they are alerted. Obviously in real life they would most likely decide to dodge the missile, but it's also entirely possible to shoot down the incoming missile aswell. Don't forget that both missiles have fuzes on them, so if one doesn't fuze, the other one will.

38 minutes ago, chomiake said:

and how exactly am I supposed to git gud in this case?

 

besides, you call this realistic? xDDD An SPAA with 10km range and no self-defence weaponry, which is not supposed to ever see the frontline, is put in a box with MBTs who can easily come closer than 1km, while being literally uncapable of destoying a still target it is designed to counter and I am supposed to accept it as realistic xDDD

 

just another troll to add to ignore list I guess

"Wah wah, can't just point and click an aircraft away, must actually play it smart, wah wah, what do!"

[Aerobane 4,140]

"just spawn SPAA bruv"

 

Kamovs: 1:38, 2:27, 4:15...

[MCmaddawg 341]

12 minutes ago, Aerobane said:

"just spawn SPAA bruv"

 

Kamovs: 1:38, 2:27, 4:15...

This guy is terrible. At most 4 kills with the ka52 before he dies, this is nothing. Literally if there were competent SPAA players he would have been dead before he even aproached the playable area.

This is better, 6 kills with the Mi28. I had +12 kill games, just didn't have those recorded. If there was a gepard or a second SPAA, I would have been most likely dead.

[TheFuzzieOne 3,355]

Because it makes money.

[Thodin 6,784]

22x S-13 onetap rockets + ballistic computer as 300 spawn point starter loadouts is just the most idiotic thing in WT. But ye a Phantom with two Mavericks costs 900 sp. Totally justified^^

 

And why is it cleary more lethal any real ATGMs ? 

[ksix 902]

4 hours ago, Thodin said:

22x S-13 onetap rockets + ballistic computer as 300 spawn point starter loadouts is just the most idiotic thing in WT. But ye a Phantom with two Mavericks costs 900 sp. Totally justified^^

 

And why is it cleary more lethal any real ATGMs ? 

Damage inflation is a problem with pretty much all late game rockets/missiles plane or heli mounted. They've repeatedly nerfed and buffed the lethality of the splash of these air to ground weapons over the years as they seem to have no clue how to balance them.

Edited June 26, 2021 by ksix

[Loongsheep 5,339]

7 hours ago, Thodin said:

22x S-13 onetap rockets + ballistic computer as 300 spawn point starter loadouts is just the most idiotic thing in WT. But ye a Phantom with two Mavericks costs 900 sp. Totally justified^^

 

And why is it cleary more lethal any real ATGMs ? 

To be honest using CCIP 1000lb bombs with Phantom is far more cost-effective.

But the Ka-50/52 still need to go up in spawn point and repair bill.

[Taeblamees 1,092]

13 hours ago, MCmaddawg said:

"Wah wah, can't just point and click an aircraft away, must actually play it smart, wah wah, what do!"

But aircraft can just point and click anything while being invulnerable to something that is in the game to literally counter that very system. gg, balance

There's nothing you can do to play smart, you just die.

[MCmaddawg 341]

2 hours ago, Taeblamees said:

But aircraft can just point and click anything while being invulnerable to something that is in the game to literally counter that very system. gg, balance

There's nothing you can do to play smart, you just die.

Nothing is unvulnerable. While you're in a helicopter, you constantly have to battle incoming jets, other helicopters, SPAA and even tanks trying to shoot you down. While as an SPAA, you just have to hide somewhere and wait for an opportunity to launch a missile.

 

Literally git gud.

[Taeblamees 1,092]

6 minutes ago, MCmaddawg said:

Nothing is unvulnerable. While you're in a helicopter, you constantly have to battle incoming jets, other helicopters, SPAA and even tanks trying to shoot you down. While as an SPAA, you just have to hide somewhere and wait for an opportunity to launch a missile.

 

Literally git gud.

The only hope is that he's busy killing somebody else so you can maybe get a shot in, effectively letting him kill half your team. That's not a counter, that's sacrificing your team to maybe get down the heli while their ground vehicles just rush you. And that's dealing with just one heli, god help if there's more of them at one time.

[MCmaddawg 341]

36 minutes ago, Taeblamees said:

The only hope is that he's busy killing somebody else so you can maybe get a shot in, effectively letting him kill half your team. That's not a counter, that's sacrificing your team to maybe get down the heli while their ground vehicles just rush you. And that's dealing with just one heli, god help if there's more of them at one time.

Never had a problem shooting them down, whether I'm using an ADATS or an Otomatic. You have 3rd person, look around the corner of a building/rock and see him turn somewhere else (because the launch window is so small), turn off your radar and fire a missile. Ez helicopter kill. Ka50's are even easier to deal with, because they don't have thermals.

[CodeNameColdWar 823]

On 26/06/2021 at 01:12, MCmaddawg said:

Ka52 has 2 pilots, one controls the aircraft the other one controls the missiles. When ever they are being locked by radar or a missile is being launched they are alerted. Obviously in real life they would most likely decide to dodge the missile, but it's also entirely possible to shoot down the incoming missile aswell. Don't forget that both missiles have fuzes on them, so if one doesn't fuze, the other one will.

I just said that i never see any record or report of Ka-50/52 or any helicopters use this as a tactic in reality. Nor mention about it. 

This is literally Hard-kill APS level. And we didn't even know if it is that easy to done in reality.

 

 

[ExodusV 284]

4 hours ago, CodeNameColdWar said:

I just said that i never see any record or report of Ka-50/52 or any helicopters use this as a tactic in reality. Nor mention about it. 

This is literally Hard-kill APS level. And we didn't even know if it is that easy to done in reality.

 

 

Cuz in ReAlITy we have constant wars... Helicopters hardly fought something more than insurgencies while mostly undercover of night while provided air superiorty by airforce annnnd working in tandem with other forces.

Edited June 27, 2021 by ILLUMINATUS

[CodeNameColdWar 823]

1 hour ago, ILLUMINATUS said:

Cuz in ReAlITy we have constant wars... Helicopters hardly fought something more than insurgencies while mostly undercover by night while provided air superiorty by airforce annnnd working in tandem with other forces.

 

Exactly ! But not even field manual about Vikhr missiles say any things about this capability ? If so How would we know if it is over-power ? or underperform ? (I guess we won't know. For now)

I want to know how capable Vikhr really is when they become Hard-kill APS tools.

  

Edited June 27, 2021 by CodeNameColdWar
edit for correct

[TheFuzzieOne 3,355]

On 26/06/2021 at 11:17, MCmaddawg said:

Nothing is unvulnerable. While you're in a helicopter, you constantly have to battle incoming jets, other helicopters, SPAA and even tanks trying to shoot you down. While as an SPAA, you just have to hide somewhere and wait for an opportunity to launch a missile.

 

Literally git gud.

 

It's sounding more and more like you're just desperate for your flying pay to win vehicle to not be nerfed and spoil your own fun.

[MCmaddawg 341]

15 minutes ago, TheFuzzieOne said:

 

It's sounding more and more like you're just desperate for your flying pay to win vehicle to not be nerfed and spoil your own fun.

It's all historical. There's nothing to be nerfed unless they make it perform unhistorically. Now what they can do is buff helicopters of other nations, so the ka50/52s aren't the only ones having fun.

 

It also sounds more and more like you want to point and click aircraft away with your SPAA like what was happening upon their introduction.

 

Also, I made this specifically for people like you:

 

Edited June 27, 2021 by MCmaddawg

[chomiake 769]

On 25/06/2021 at 20:12, MCmaddawg said:

"Wah wah, can't just point and click an aircraft away, must actually play it smart, wah wah, what do!"

wah wah, cant just sit in the air and point and click both tanks and aircrafts, must actually play it smart, stay low and avoid detection, what do!

you're a hypocrite

[MCmaddawg 341]

47 minutes ago, chomiake said:

wah wah, cant just sit in the air and point and click both tanks and aircrafts, must actually play it smart, stay low and avoid detection, what do!

you're a hypocrite

Except I can. I can stay in the air and destroy silly people who don't know how to play SPAA.

Seethe and cope.

[Foxtrot39 208]

Nah those 2 helos NEED to be nerfed directly or not, they've made SIM and helo EC a total unplayable P2W mode since their introduction

 

Sim battle : depending of the map AA get spawnkilled after 2 min if not after 10s and can't do anything, jets get wrecked as they can use thermal and spawncamp them once they take off, other helo have nothing that has similar range and ,same as jet, get spawncamped from the enemy helipad, too much flatland that allow KA series to overperform

 

EC helo battle same map issue but even worse as the entire map are designed to let vikhr dominate the entire match by removing any cover you could use and placing any target in large totaly exposed areas

 

Either they're straight out banned to particpate in SIM and helo EC or gaijin is doing a major map overhaul to nerf the range on vikhr  by forcing their engagement to be in range of other nation helo launched ATGM / ATAM

 

In GFRB just having 1-2 SAM at the start is usualy enough to kill the S-13 bumrush tactic I see verytime with russia

 

Then the problem is about ammo management : A helo take 20s to reload and repair everything in a safe space no AA can usualy reach but an AA has to go on a cap zone usualy watched over by the entire enemy team and wait up to 3 min to reload completely

 

Then AA are too often exposed to horrible map design and can't be safe anywhere to perform AA duty

Edited June 27, 2021 by Foxtrot39

[TheFuzzieOne 3,355]

9 hours ago, MCmaddawg said:

It's all historical. There's nothing to be nerfed unless they make it perform unhistorically.

 

So like how most SAMs are run unhistorically less than they could.

 

Or like how all ground radars run unhistorically less than they could.

 

Or like how many aspects of the Ka's perform unhistorically more than they would due tothe viewpoint and environment.

 

Not a great argument. Many things in WT that would counter it are either A) Massively nerfed compared to reality or B) From eras long before it and not possessing the real counters that it would be facing.

[MCmaddawg 341]

4 hours ago, TheFuzzieOne said:

Or  like how many aspects of the Ka's perform unhistorically more than they would due tothe viewpoint and environment.

What exactly is unhistorical about it?

[Wiggly_Armed_Man 2,383]

5 hours ago, MCmaddawg said:

What exactly is unhistorical about it?

I imagine it detonating missiles with the Vikhrs might be one of the things. There's no instance of it happening in real life, or at least instances of SAM missiles detonating on a missile heading towards it without it being programmed into the warhead beforehand (though the latter is more for anti-cruise missiles than a tiny ATGM). Either the Vikhir should also detonate on missiles or, preferably, neither SAMs or Vikhirs should detonate on them rather than the invincible Vikhrs we have now.