floatplane Finnish Arado Ar 196 A-5

[Mr_Bush 9]

As one of the most attractive Bushes alive(if not THE most), I would like to request the addition of this very intricate vehicle to the game's collection. 

Gaijin please add this.

[gihrenzabi 5]

On 06/05/2022 at 06:55, Alexandros11 said:

It would be a dream to have a fight with a zero in this thing, pretty good guns out the front and back!

I'd imagine fighting this thing in a Zero would require a low-side pass or low six approach, just like an SBD. The MG81Z in the back would be too dangerous for normal angles

[Alexandros11 100]

11 hours ago, gihrenzabi said:

I'd imagine fighting this thing in a Zero would require a low-side pass or low six approach, just like an SBD. The MG81Z in the back would be too dangerous for normal angles

Yes for sure, not exactly a safe aircraft to sit behind. The plane would actually be able to turn fight though as it's not nearly so heavy as an SBD and has pretty good guns. May not outurn a zero but combined with its fantastic low speed handling characteristics and its pretty good defensive capabilities I feel as if it could hold it's own against more advanced aircraft. The MG FF/M cannon would also be very effective against lightly protected aircraft like zeroes - and against faster/slower turning opponents like a 109 it can rely on its nimbleness and manoeuvrability for protection

[Johannes_Seifert 93]

Considering that is an German plane it should be able in German tech tree also, just my opinion 

[Phildahill 2]

This would be fun for  Swedish low tier CAS.  Plus it’s just a really cool plane overall

[NovA29 1,592]

Good luck guys. i realy hope you get what you want.

[Alexandros11 100]

17 minutes ago, NovA29R said:

Good luck guys. i realy hope you get what you want.

Thankyou, I really hope so too

On 13/05/2022 at 17:49, Phildahill said:

This would be fun for  Swedish low tier CAS.  Plus it’s just a really cool plane overall

Definitely, I'm not sure off the top of my head whether MG FF/Ms has AP belts but even so the 20s can do good damage to open top vehicles and the bombs can definitely be put to good use! I await the day I can be the scourge of ground sim in this thing

 

[ChedarTheCheese 1]

+69 the funny plane must be added ….. URGENTLY!!!!

[Alexandros11 100]

6 hours ago, ChedarTheCheese said:

+69 the funny plane must be added ….. URGENTLY!!!!

I'm hoping we can get it done asap - the models already there and just needs a few changes!

[KnightSkeemo 23]

gaijin plz <3

[avp216 23]

Come to think of it, more variants of such aircraft need to happen.  Considering how good they were.

[Alexandros11 100]

On 17/05/2022 at 09:03, avp216 said:

Come to think of it, more variants of such aircraft need to happen.  Considering how good they were.

Well the A-3 is already in game and the A-5 is really the only noteworthy variant with significant upgrades. Not much else to delve into... The Arado Ar 196C was a proposed variant that could have had a significantly more powerful Daimler Benz DB 605 water-cooled engine (giving the nose that streamlined profile like a 109) but it was cancelled. Not sure if any prototypes were made, though that certainly would have been a cool looking aircraft! Would have looked something like this...

 

Edited July 12, 2022 by Alexandros11

[Mr_Bush 9]

Come on ... Can we get a confirmation about this ? 

[MadDaishi 920]

On 18/05/2022 at 03:27, Alexandros11 said:

Well the A-3 is already in game and the A-5 is really the only noteworthy variant with significant upgrades. Not much else to delve into... The Arado Ar 196C was a proposed variant that would have had a significantly more powerful Daimler Benz DB 605 water-cooled engine (giving the nose that streamlined profile like a 109) but it was cancelled. Not sure if any prototypes were made, though that certainly would have been a cool looking aircraft! Would have looked something like this...

880.83 kB  ·  0 downloads

hmmm....looks like a screen shot from deviantart or similar whiffie site

according by "Adler über See" by Christian König, a book about the "Bordflugzeuge und Küstenaufklärer Ar 196" the Arado 196 C would have been powered by a BMW 132 K

and it was planned  to user MG 151/20  instead of MG FF and should have gotten greater floats to accommodate more fuel
all this was stopped in July 1942, according to the book mentioned above

 

 

the idea with a water cooled inline engine sounds nice, but would generate to completly redesign of hull and wing of the aircraft to accommodate the cooling system for the engine

but this is only my point of view

 

my 2 cents

MadDaishi

[Alexandros11 100]

14 minutes ago, MadDaishi said:

hmmm....looks like a screen shot from deviantart or similar whiffie site

according by "Adler über See" by Christian König, a book about the "Bordflugzeuge und Küstenaufklärer Ar 196" the Arado 196 C would have been powered by a BMW 132 K

and it was planned  to user MG 151/20  instead of MG FF and should have gotten greater floats to accommodate more fuel
all this was stopped in July 1942, according to the book mentioned above

 

 

the idea with a water cooled inline engine sounds nice, but would generate to completly redesign of hull and wing of the aircraft to accommodate the cooling system for the engine

but this is only my point of view

 

my 2 cents

MadDaishi

That's interesting - yes I didn't do a whole lot of research into the C - Just heard that it was a variant proposed to become more aerodynamically sound by having a water cooled inline engine. I certainly haven't got any proper evidence, was just floating the idea as I thought it looked rather cool. That picture is just one I quickly stitched together with the nose of a G6 on the Arado - was just supposed to give a rough idea of what it would have looked like.

 

That source does seem a little odd though as everywhere I find states 1941 and it seems odd to use the already underpowered BMW 132K for an aircraft with even more weight and bigger floats?

20 minutes ago, MadDaishi said:

hmmm....looks like a screen shot from deviantart or similar whiffie site

according by "Adler über See" by Christian König, a book about the "Bordflugzeuge und Küstenaufklärer Ar 196" the Arado 196 C would have been powered by a BMW 132 K

and it was planned  to user MG 151/20  instead of MG FF and should have gotten greater floats to accommodate more fuel
all this was stopped in July 1942, according to the book mentioned above

 

 

the idea with a water cooled inline engine sounds nice, but would generate to completly redesign of hull and wing of the aircraft to accommodate the cooling system for the engine

but this is only my point of view

 

my 2 cents

MadDaishi

I'd be very interested in reading this book. Do you know if it's been printed in English? (Or Greek)

[MadDaishi 920]

Hi there

I'm not aware of a translation in other languages, seems to be only available in german at the moment

even Aamazon only lists it in german

 

EDIT
btw the book mentions the Arado E.380 which would have been powered a version of the BMW 801, but this was some paper ideas which were discarded

 

Edited May 19, 2022 by MadDaishi

[Alexandros11 100]

6 minutes ago, MadDaishi said:

Hi there

I'm not aware of a translation in other languages, seems to be only available in german at the moment

even Aamazon only lists it in german

 

EDIT
btw the book mentions the Arado E.380 which would have been powered a version of the BMW 801, but this was some paper ideas which were discarded

 

Ah shame about that - maybe I need to learn German!

 

Ah that E.380 is very interesting, although that also appears to be an air cooled engine. Considering there are quite a few completely 'paper' planes I don't think it's so far fetched to add a paper engine to a real aircraft. Arado 196 is one of my favourite planes so the more variants the better in my book. 1,500HP is a pretty huge performance boost over the 132K so I guess there would have been other design changes to the airframe/wings to accommodate for much faster cruising speeds.

[M_T_O_13@psn 2]

As a collector myself I would love to see this be added to the game. Either as a premium or tech tree vehicle. Even better would be as an event vehicle, as it is nothing too broken and also something nice for the Swedish tech tree. They finally get another floatplane and it would only take a minimal amount of effort to do so.

[Alexandros11 100]

22 hours ago, M_T_O_13@psn said:

As a collector myself I would love to see this be added to the game. Either as a premium or tech tree vehicle. Even better would be as an event vehicle, as it is nothing too broken and also something nice for the Swedish tech tree. They finally get another floatplane and it would only take a minimal amount of effort to do so.

Would love it as a premium, not sure as an event vehicle because then we'll run into the same issue in a few years where people who want to fly can't get their hands on it unless it could be sold on the marketplace - which I personally think all event vehicles should be.

[KnightSkeemo 23]

On 17/05/2022 at 21:27, Alexandros11 said:

Well the A-3 is already in game and the A-5 is really the only noteworthy variant with significant upgrades. Not much else to delve into... The Arado Ar 196C was a proposed variant that could have had a significantly more powerful Daimler Benz DB 605 water-cooled engine (giving the nose that streamlined profile like a 109) but it was cancelled. Not sure if any prototypes were made, though that certainly would have been a cool looking aircraft! Would have looked something like this...

880.83 kB  ·  0 downloads

how much information do we actually have on this? or is it just something they spontaneously came up with?

[PoseidonOceans@psn 1]

Well it's a yes from me  . Would love to see that in war thunder and also fly in it  !!!

[Alexandros11 100]

14 hours ago, KnightSkeemo said:

how much information do we actually have on this? or is it just something they spontaneously came up with?

Not much - the aerodynamically proposed Ar 196C went on pre-war in which time the Arado was actually intended to be powered by a DB 600 before production issues meant it had to be switched to the BMW 132K. Seeing as the Ar 196C variant was cancelled in late 1941 but started before the switch to radial BMW it must have been designed to accommodate a Daimler Benz inline water cooled engine. If not the 605 then certainly the 600 - the actual nose would look the same as pictured above but of course the 600 produced less horsepower. It would still be significantly faster than the standard 196 - the engine power and improved aerodynamics combined.

Edited May 21, 2022 by Alexandros11

[KnightSkeemo 23]

On 20/05/2022 at 19:15, Alexandros11 said:

Not much - the aerodynamically proposed Ar 196C went on pre-war in which time the Arado was actually intended to be powered by a DB 600 before production issues meant it had to be switched to the BMW 132K. Seeing as the Ar 196C variant was cancelled in late 1941 but started before the switch to radial BMW it must have been designed to accommodate a Daimler Benz inline water cooled engine. If not the 605 then certainly the 600 - the actual nose would look the same as pictured above but of course the 600 produced less horsepower. It would still be significantly faster than the standard 196 - the engine power and improved aerodynamics combined.

makes sense... gib!

[mixu83 209]

There's a one big problem with this suggestion. The Ar-196's, although operated by Finnish crews, were on loan from Luftwaffe and therefore retained their German national markings. Only time period in which any other markings might have been used is the short period in between of beginning Lapland War and transferring German owned planes to USSR as part of peace deal.

 

Olli Kepsu's biography mentions that his Ar-196 still had German markings (Radio code A3+AC) on 5.9.44, after that the Luftwaffe markings were painted over and replaced with temporary civilian registry OH-PMK until it was handed over to Russia. (In slightly burned but flyable state as a Finnish mechanic tried weld a leak in pontoon without knowing that Ar-196's fuel was stored there.)

[Alexandros11 100]

On 22/05/2022 at 18:29, mixu83 said:

There's a one big problem with this suggestion. The Ar-196's, although operated by Finnish crews, were on loan from Luftwaffe and therefore retained their German national markings. Only time period in which any other markings might have been used is the short period in between of beginning Lapland War and transferring German owned planes to USSR as part of peace deal.

 

Olli Kepsu's biography mentions that his Ar-196 still had German markings (Radio code A3+AC) on 5.9.44, after that the Luftwaffe markings were painted over and replaced with temporary civilian registry OH-PMK until it was handed over to Russia. (In slightly burned but flyable state as a Finnish mechanic tried weld a leak in pontoon without knowing that Ar-196's fuel was stored there.)

There's no question that some 196s were loaned by Germany and flown with Luftwaffe markings but these new evidences show a part of history that appears to have been slightly forgotten. Finland ordered 12 Arado 196 A-3s that were converted to A-5s and flew with 12th squadron in the continuation war. These were Finnish Air Force Arado Ar 196 A-5s, not in Luftwaffe markings or on loan. I've been glad to bring to light this part of semi-forgotten history of the 196 and I simply hope we can see it in-game.

 

So Finland absolutely did operate their own Arados in Finnish markings during the war, though for some reason this has been largely forgotten and most focus has been on the loaned Luftwaffe models instead. 

Edited June 20, 2022 by Alexandros11