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Set Entrance Limit For World War Mode


Sicked of players without the basic understanding of the game crowding into world war, keep spawn and die.

(Most importantly, took away those better tanks and wasting spawn counts)

Please add Entrance Limit for the mode

(such as unlocking tier3 of the nation participating the current world war campaign

And, most importantly, give access of "special" unit types (like panther among PzIVs, or Jagdpanther among Nashorns) only to those who own these vehicles

Edited by Russian_____Bias
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On 16/02/2023 at 16:29, Russian_____Bias said:

Sicked of players without the basic understanding of the game crowding into world war, keep spawn and die.

(Most importantly, took away those better tanks and wasting spawn counts)

Please add Entrance Limit for the mode

(such as unlocking tier3 of the nation participating the current world war campaign

And, most importantly, give access of "special" unit types (like panther among PzIVs, or Jagdpanther among Nashorns) only to those who own these vehicles

The more we start the WWM - the more people will have the opportunity to learn how to play well.

We already have a limit for entry - rank III of any country. This allows us to weed out absolutely novices.

Panther is not the best version of the PzIV, nor is the Jagdpanther among the Nashorns. These are all separate vehicles in separate groups and they can be obtained by all players on equal terms. You can see the vehicles groups here: https://wiki.warthunder.com/Operation_Nordwind

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WW mode has a couple of missions like Convoy Interceptions that can be used as target practice maps for ground SPAA to learn how to lead in RB.

It's kinda refreshing to see players trying to use SPAA for once instead of ditching it and leaving a battle.

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7 hours ago, DmGordeev said:

Panther is not the best version of the PzIV, nor is the Jagdpanther among the Nashorns. These are all separate vehicles in separate groups and they can be obtained by all players on equal terms. You can see the vehicles groups here: https://wiki.warthunder.com/Operation_Nordwind

I think what he's saying is Panthers should have been in the Pz IV group, and Jagdpanthers in the medium TD group, not broke apart into their own groups. I mean, it's obvious you broke them out to control their total numbers, so I see why you wouldn't do this. Being a new player and trying out a mid-tier tank you don't own is really part of the fun of WWM for randoes, so I think it would be a mistake for the health of the mode to change this as the player is recommending.

That said, I think the number of groups might have been a little large this time. Here I don't know that you needed to split up the US TDs or the US fighters into two groups or the German fighters into three. The trouble is, that most people run six or seven crew slots, and everything past that is a crew skills=1 slot, which is a bit of a disadvantage for players trying to min/max their crew skills for these games. I think if you break out a group to prevent it ahistorically dominating (like 262s or Jagdtigers) that's fine, but if you find you're just doing it to increase vehicle variety, try and collapse them into a smaller number of groups if possible.

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8 hours ago, DmGordeev said:

Panther is not the best version of the PzIV, nor is the Jagdpanther among the Nashorns. These are all separate vehicles in separate groups and they can be obtained by all players on equal terms.

I know but, for example, We could let novice use PzIVs, and let Panther avaliable only to those who have them. Same for Nashorn and Jagderpanthers.

It's really annoying and suffers from disadvantage when novice players rolled and get vehicle groups containing powerful vehicle but they don't have it (for example Jagdtiger).

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2 hours ago, Russian_____Bias said:

I know but, for example, We could let novice use PzIVs, and let Panther avaliable only to those who have them. Same for Nashorn and Jagderpanthers.

It's really annoying and suffers from disadvantage when novice players rolled and get vehicle groups containing powerful vehicle but they don't have it (for example Jagdtiger).

 

The *Heavy TD* branch was problematic by itself.

The Jagdpanther might be quite resistant to the 76mm guns the americans had this season, but to compare it with a Jagdtiger that is basically immune to frontal hits and can reliably oneshot any tank the allied had to offer is overexaggerated.

I was only able to bring in maybe 3-4 Jagdtigers over the whole weekend, cause the slots were taken by Jagdpanther drivers almost everytime.

 

But Gaijin did the right thing to match the Jagdpanthers with Jagdtiger TD's because the Wehrmacht used them both in *schwere Panzerjäger Abteilungen* (heavy tank destroyer battalion)

 

My question here is if it's possible to prioritize players with a top tier vehicle in their slots for picking a tank next season, before anyone else with a backup can choose one?

Such a system would benefit more towards the more experienced players being able to choose the rare stuff first once a match starts. If everyone with a corresponding vehicle took their slot, the rest would then go to the backup users.

Edited by Mordegar
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17 hours ago, Bruce_R1 said:

That said, I think the number of groups might have been a little large this time. Here I don't know that you needed to split up the US TDs or the US fighters into two groups or the German fighters into three. The trouble is, that most people run six or seven crew slots, and everything past that is a crew skills=1 slot, which is a bit of a disadvantage for players trying to min/max their crew skills for these games. I think if you break out a group to prevent it ahistorically dominating (like 262s or Jagdtigers) that's fine, but if you find you're just doing it to increase vehicle variety, try and collapse them into a smaller number of groups if possible.

Too dense groups of vehicles cause problems in tactical choice. Having M18 and M36 in the same group is a real problem. I can say the same about the R-47 / P-51 pair. In WWM, we should focus on 10 groups of vehicles in each operation, according to the number of player slots.

16 hours ago, Russian_____Bias said:

I know but, for example, We could let novice use PzIVs, and let Panther avaliable only to those who have them. Same for Nashorn and Jagderpanthers.

It's really annoying and suffers from disadvantage when novice players rolled and get vehicle groups containing powerful vehicle but they don't have it (for example Jagdtiger).

But put yourself in the place of these players. Surely they play these vehicles worse than professionals, but much better than Pz IV - I think this is a great joy for them.

 

14 hours ago, Mordegar said:

My question here is if it's possible to prioritize players with a top tier vehicle in their slots for picking a tank next season, before anyone else with a backup can choose one?

Such a system would benefit more towards the more experienced players being able to choose the rare stuff first once a match starts. If everyone with a corresponding vehicle took their slot, the rest would then go to the backup users.

I'm afraid then players without this vehicles will have nothing to catch at all in WWM. You just drive them away with such a suggestion.

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2 hours ago, DmGordeev said:

But put yourself in the place of these players. Surely they play these vehicles worse than professionals, but much better than Pz IV - I think this is a great joy for them.

Maybe I didn't expressed clearly. Even a novice in a Jagdtiger can be powerful (or at least not that easy to die). But the fact is they do not have it and have to use something like Jagdpanther. So maybe we could just give access to all, or separate them out. Now the current rule just make novices enjoy and drive experienced players away. Every friend I knew all gave negative review toward the current WWM session (and of course most of them are experienced).

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21 hours ago, Russian_____Bias said:

Maybe I didn't expressed clearly. Even a novice in a Jagdtiger can be powerful (or at least not that easy to die). But the fact is they do not have it and have to use something like Jagdpanther. So maybe we could just give access to all, or separate them out. Now the current rule just make novices enjoy and drive experienced players away. Every friend I knew all gave negative review toward the current WWM session (and of course most of them are experienced).

I will think about making the vehicle distribution algorithm not completely random, but dependent on the player's vehicle and crew level. Randomness should still be present (and possibly prevail) - this is the WWM feature that makes each of your battle different.

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We must have different friends. None of mine had negative comments about WWM, just a few suggestions to improve it. Whilst allowing those who actually have the better tanks etc. first pick of them, blocking randoms from them would be too extreme and drive them away. It all comes down to balance, but one thing is clear. We need more players as sometimes there might be 19-20 wanting to play on one side, and only 2-3 on the other.

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