Switching nation for the swiss Hunter F.58

[Lord_Prism 1,827]

3 minutes ago, Command_oCommand said:

Doesn't make the points I originaly made any less valid even if it was the case.

 

Your point is you throwing a hissy fit because you wanted the Swiss Hunter in the French tree 

[TonyTheJackal 80]

I up this as the Hunter has no connection to Germany whatsoever and belongs in the UK

If we're gonna go with "connections" on this you might aswell move our Greek Apache to France as we have better connections with the French. 

[Command_oCommand 94]

2 minutes ago, Lord_Prism said:

Your point is you throwing a hissy fit because you wanted the Swiss Hunter in the French tree 

Despite me really wanting it to be in France, I mainly want it out of germany as there is a smaller connection to it compared to either France due to the history and geopolitical aspects and Britain with the whole fact that it's the designer of the aircraft.

3 minutes ago, Nachtgeist2423@live said:

I mean you are pushing for a Swiss vehicle to be put into one of the two trees of the only nations to have violated Switzerland’s neutrality and killed Swiss citizens.

I'm not aware of any incidents of british bombers bombing swiss cities. It was american ones. 

France violated swiss airspace? May you provide more information about those as I am really curious to know more about them.

[Lord_Prism 1,827]

4 minutes ago, Command_oCommand said:

France violated swiss airspace? May you provide more information about those as I am really curious to know more about them.

Does the name Napoleon ring a bell? 

4 minutes ago, Command_oCommand said:

Despite me really wanting it to be in France, I mainly want it out of germany as there is a smaller connection to it compared to either France due to the history and geopolitical aspects and Britain with the whole fact that it's the designer of the aircraft.

Historically and Geographically, Germany has closer ties than France does, and while yes the Hunter was at base a British vehicle, the Hunter 80 program was done entirely by Swiss companies in an attempt to export the older Hunters 

[Nachtgeist2423@live 27]

2 minutes ago, Command_oCommand said:

Despite me really wanting it to be in France, I mainly want it out of germany as there is a smaller connection to it compared to either France due to the history and geopolitical aspects and Britain with the whole fact that it's the designer of the aircraft.

I'm not aware of any incidents of british bombers bombing swiss cities. It was american ones. 

France violated swiss airspace? May you provide more information about those as I am really curious to know more about them.

Switzerland’s neutrality has been set in stone since the treaty of Westphalia in 1648. In that time only France(1798), Britian(1940-1945), and the US(1943-1945) have violated Swiss neutrality killing large numbers of Swiss citizens. Also the original 13 Cantons being German speaking.

[SithDoesTankTat1 250]

Just now, Lord_Prism said:

Does the name Napoleon ring a bell? 

Historically and Geographically, Germany has closer ties than France does, and while yes the Hunter was at base a British vehicle, the Hunter 80 program was done entirely by Swiss companies in an attempt to export the older Hunters 

I mean if we're going that far back... the vikings violated french airspace, british airspace and american airspace

[Thodin 6,784]

There was probably a reason why Gajin dropped the devblog just a couple of hours before the patch went live^^ 

[Command_oCommand 94]

4 minutes ago, Lord_Prism said:

Does the name Napoleon ring a bell? 

Historically and Geographically, Germany has closer ties than France does, and while yes the Hunter was at base a British vehicle, the Hunter 80 program was done entirely by Swiss companies in an attempt to export the older Hunters 

Yeah the name does ring a bell. He played a big part in shaping Switzerland as it is today by bringing centralisation of power among the cantons thanks for reminding me and further proving my point about France's influence in Switzerland's history

5 minutes ago, Nachtgeist2423@live said:

Switzerland’s neutrality has been set in stone since the treaty of Westphalia in 1648. In that time only France(1798), Britian(1940-1945), and the US(1943-1945) have violated Swiss neutrality killing large numbers of Swiss citizens. Also the original 13 Cantons being German speaking.

Britain did violate swiss air space but so did Germany. However I have never heard of any cases of British bombers bombing swiss cities. It was american ones.

And your argument of the original cantons being german speaking also shows to me that some of the reason why people want swiss vehicles in Germany boils down to the "they share a language they must be related then"

[ElRodriM16 15]

It's fine where it is

[Lord_Prism 1,827]

2 minutes ago, Command_oCommand said:

Yeah the name does ring a bell. He played a big part in shaping Switzerland as it is today by bringing centralisation of power among the cantons thanks for reminding me and further proving my point about France's influence in Switzerland's history

>The french swissman says the french had a big part in forming switzerland

hmmmmmm

[Nachtgeist2423@live 27]

6 minutes ago, Command_oCommand said:

Yeah the name does ring a bell. He played a big part in shaping Switzerland as it is today by bringing centralisation of power among the cantons thanks for reminding me and further proving my point about France's influence in Switzerland's history

Britain did violate swiss air space but so did Germany. However I have never heard of any cases of British bombers bombing swiss cities. It was american ones.

And your argument of the original cantons being german speaking also shows to me that some of the reason why people want swiss vehicles in Germany boils down to the "they share a language they must be related then"

A country invading you isn’t a good thing. They killed 700 Swiss. 
Geneva, Renes, Basel, and Zurich would like to disagree with you about how the RAF is innocent in your eyes. Those 13 original cantons were Germanic. Also the Sonderbundskrieg is what made Switzerland what it is today. 

Edited March 7, 2023 by Nachtgeist2423@live

[Thodin 6,784]

4 minutes ago, Lord_Prism said:

>The french swissman says the french had a big part in forming switzerland

hmmmmmm

 

Switzerland was de jure part of the Reich until 1648.

 

(Never was part of France except the Napoleonic occupation)

Edited March 7, 2023 by Thodin

[SithDoesTankTat1 250]

1 minute ago, Thodin said:

 

Switzerland was de jure part of the Reich until 1648.

 

(Never was part of France)

Germany wasn't even a country until the 1800's 

[Command_oCommand 94]

2 minutes ago, Lord_Prism said:

>The french swissman says the french had a big part in forming switzerland

hmmmmmm

It did. 

2 minutes ago, Nachtgeist2423@live said:

A country invading you isn’t a good thing. They killed 700 Swiss. 
Geneva, Renes, Basel, and Zurich would like to disagree with you about how the RAF is innocent in your eyes. Those 13 original cantons were Germanic. 

I looked it up, fair point ! But back to my original point, the reason why I'm saying the Hunter could also be in the British tree is because the plane is british in design.

And once again, just because a country shares a language with an other one that is in War Thunder doesn't mean they the country's vehicles should be put in that other nation in War Thunder.

[Lord_Prism 1,827]

1 minute ago, Command_oCommand said:

It did. 

Germany had a bigger part

[nathanclawfish 647]

1 minute ago, Command_oCommand said:

It did. 

I looked it up, fair point ! But back to my original point, the reason why I'm saying the Hunter could also be in the British tree is because the plane is british in design.

And once again, just because a country shares a language with an other one that is in War Thunder doesn't mean they the country's vehicles should be put in that other nation in War Thunder.

 

If that was the case the entire american tech tree would be in the british tech tree

[Command_oCommand 94]

6 minutes ago, dotEXCEL said:

literally the entire ground force projects were developed in coop with german companies.
apart from the s*hitty amx-13's ofc

During the cold war most likely. But I'm also bringing over the sort of "alliance" with France.

3 minutes ago, Lord_Prism said:

Germany had a bigger part

Do tell.

[WT_CT_Center 2,395]

38 minutes ago, Nachtgeist2423@live said:

I mean you are pushing for a Swiss vehicle to be put into one of the two trees of the only nations to have violated Switzerland’s neutrality and killed Swiss citizens.

 

The swiss didnt have allies in ww2, they had losses from both germans and allies, there was however times where the swiss air force engaged in dog fights with german fighters where both sides lost planes and pilots. " In several air incidents, the Swiss shot down 11 Luftwaffe aircraft between 10 May and 17 June 1940, while suffering the loss of three of their own aircraft."

If you made an effort to research the swiss during ww2 you would understand that your point makes no sense, the germans were not buddy buddy with the swiss. 

 

 

Besides everything, the plane just shouldnt have really been added because it starts arguments like this, gaijin were grasping at straws to add it in the first place because it doesnt really fit comfortably anywhere in the game.

[Headnaught 504]

1 minute ago, WT_CT_Center said:

 

Besides everything, the plane just shouldnt have really been added because it starts arguments like this, gaijin were grasping at straws to add it in the first place because it doesnt really fit comfortably anywhere in the game.

 

Can definitely agree on this part

[Nachtgeist2423@live 27]

11 minutes ago, WT_CT_Center said:

 

The swiss didnt have allies in ww2, they had losses from both germans and allies, there was however times where the swiss air force engaged in dog fights with german fighters where both sides lost planes and pilots. " In several air incidents, the Swiss shot down 11 Luftwaffe aircraft between 10 May and 17 June 1940, while suffering the loss of three of their own aircraft."

If you made an effort to research the swiss during ww2 you would understand that your point makes no sense, the germans were not buddy buddy with the swiss. 

 

 

Besides everything, the plane just shouldnt have really been added because it starts arguments like this, gaijin were grasping at straws to add it in the first place because it doesnt really fit comfortably anywhere in the game.

Losing a plane is not the same as losing a pilots. Also your only defense is the lose of 3 E model 109’s which would be replaced soon thereafter when a 110 landed in Switzerland and Germany provided 6 G model 109’s in exchange for the destruction of sensitive material. Also last I checked Germany didn’t bomb or drop incendiaries on Switzerland.

[Command_oCommand 94]

14 minutes ago, WT_CT_Center said:

 

The swiss didnt have allies in ww2, they had losses from both germans and allies, there was however times where the swiss air force engaged in dog fights with german fighters where both sides lost planes and pilots. " In several air incidents, the Swiss shot down 11 Luftwaffe aircraft between 10 May and 17 June 1940, while suffering the loss of three of their own aircraft."

If you made an effort to research the swiss during ww2 you would understand that your point makes no sense, the germans were not buddy buddy with the swiss. 

 

 

Besides everything, the plane just shouldnt have really been added because it starts arguments like this, gaijin were grasping at straws to add it in the first place because it doesnt really fit comfortably anywhere in the game.

It is part of the reason why, somewhere, I didn't want Switzerland to be added in the game

1 minute ago, Nachtgeist2423@live said:

Losing a plane is not the same as losing a pilots. Also your only defense is the lose of 3 E model 109’s which would be replaced soon thereafter when a 110 landed in Switzerland and Germany provided 6 G model 109’s in exchange for the destruction of sensitive material. Also last I checked Germany didn’t bomb or drop incendiaries on Switzerland.

You forgot to mention how poorly these G models were manufactured. They were in such a pitiful state they weren't usable.

 

-You destroy a highly valuable tech aircraft. You get barely working and unusable aircrafts in exchange

[gateausalaire 5]

i completly agree, this plane has no business being in the german tech tree, for one more french vehicles than any others we're used by the swiss forces, secondly, the mlilan is an important thing to look at, while never in swiss service, its the closest thing in game to an already swiss vehicle, and its been given to the french, not the germans, thirdly the german tech trees don't lack in decent fighters or attackers, nor does it lack any squadron vehicles, this would be its 4th, while france as yet to recieve none, there is another nation that would benefit even more from it however, and that is italy, with its almsot empty tech tree in the air or ground at certain BR lacking any amount of sensible machines, the hunter would have been a way way better implementation, and of course lets not forget the fact that the swiss while having a majority of ethnic germans, is not a german country, neither is it affiliated with the german government, it being in the german tree feels more forced than anything else, as two other nations which also make up a majority of the swiss population are in game, and lacking a fill up in some areas or any squadron at all for that matter

THE BETTER IDEA IS SIMPLE, two or three nations could have gotten this amazing vehicle, but one is already way too filled with squadron, its britain, which already has 2 squadron planes, italy which definitly needs new options at top tier, or france which already has a mostly almost accepted vehicle for swiss service, eiher of those last two would have been a  way better option than the german tree which doesn't lack options or has any need for more squadron or one at that specific battle rating

[nathanclawfish 647]

17 minutes ago, Headnaught said:

 

Can definitely agree on this part

Same, the precident it has changed and now set is upsetting for quite a range across the board. 

[Command_oCommand 94]

6 minutes ago, gateausalaire said:

i completly agree, this plane has no business being in the german tech tree, for one more french vehicles than any others we're used by the swiss forces, secondly, the mlilan is an important thing to look at, while never in swiss service, its the closest thing in game to an already swiss vehicle, and its been given to the french, not the germans, thirdly the german tech trees don't lack in decent fighters or attackers, nor does it lack any squadron vehicles, this would be its 4th, while france as yet to recieve none, there is another nation that would benefit even more from it however, and that is italy, with its almsot empty tech tree in the air or ground at certain BR lacking any amount of sensible machines, the hunter would have been a way way better implementation, and of course lets not forget the fact that the swiss while having a majority of ethnic germans, is not a german country, neither is it affiliated with the german government, it being in the german tree feels more forced than anything else, as two other nations which also make up a majority of the swiss population are in game, and lacking a fill up in some areas or any squadron at all for that matter

THE BETTER IDEA IS SIMPLE, two or three nations could have gotten this amazing vehicle, but one is already way too filled with squadron, its britain, which already has 2 squadron planes, italy which definitly needs new options at top tier, or france which already has a mostly almost accepted vehicle for swiss service, eiher of those last two would have been a  way better option than the german tree which doesn't lack options or has any need for more squadron or one at that specific battle rating

I really agree with you and the points your brought up.

Thanks for putting in more explanation than I could lol

[gateausalaire 5]

5 minutes ago, Command_oCommand said:

I really agree with you and the points your brought up.

Thanks for putting in more explanation than I could lol

i honestly don't know much more than you probably do, i'm just some french dude who plays way too much this silly war game, what i'd hope for is one day seeing stuff like the taifun II or PZ68 either in french or italian tech tree and not germany, that would suck tremendous ****, and the hunter, even if a minor plane is probably already a step too far, it either means no more swiss stuff after or all swiss stuff going to germany, that wouldn't make it fun or enjoyable for anyone who's actually interested in them, the only messages i've seen so far are jsut people saying "lol nah is gud in germany" without caring about the political or historical or gameplay implication, and its just quite sad