War Thunder withdrawing from Steam?

[Zer0_Tru7h 1,207]

30 minutes ago, Pacifica said:

 

The Reviews wont change.... thats why it is such destructive behavior.... ask the hardcore haters, and they will say they will never change their review.... why do you think so many are on the band wagon ? its not for a honest review, have you read the ones full of hatred ? those wont change ever...

 

so dont kid your self, even if you and other honest ones that will change their review back, the hardcore haters will never change it.... and they will just get other like minded haters to flock to the game just to leave hateful reviews just because they can

 

It is one reason why I hate reviews for games, because reviews can and will always be exploited... and I always think it is a bad idea.... anything that you can exploit is a very bad idea...

 

you see, on the net you can do whatever the hell you want without any responsibility... and I have seen a number of very good games go up in flames just because Haters gonna Hate.....  

 

Allow me to address your perspective on the impact of reviews and the notion that previously unacknowledged opinions have found a platform. While I understand your assertion that our personal opinions, as well as those of like-minded individuals, may not have be considered valid by the company, it is crucial to approach us with a sense of respect and understanding.

 

It is indeed a notable occurrence that an increasing number of players have been motivated to express their views through the avenue of reviews. This development can be seen as an encouraging sign of an evolving landscape where diverse voices are finding the courage to be heard. Though I, myself, submitted my review a considerable time ago, it is heartening to witness others discovering their own voices and contributing to the dialogue against Gaijin's abuse.

 

It is vital to recognize the value of these newfound expressions, even if they include individuals with less nuanced methods of negotiating. Each individual possesses unique experiences and perspectives that can greatly enrich the discourse surrounding a particular subject. The introduction of varied opinions into the conversation can foster a more comprehensive understanding of the matter at hand.

 

Furthermore, it is important to approach these expressions with a level of respect and consideration. By acknowledging and embracing the range of viewpoints, we can foster an environment conducive to productive discussions and meaningful exchanges. While blank disregard and gaslighting may naturally arise from the company, engaging in courteous and respectful dialogue allows for the exploration of differing perspectives, thereby enabling the growth of knowledge and understanding. While the reviews may not be to the taste of yourself or to the company, to claim they are of less of value due to the quantity of which they are being received would be wrong and not constructive to the dialogue.

Edited May 23, 2023 by Durandle_X

[gozer 4,134]

25 minutes ago, Pacifica said:

The Reviews wont change.... thats why it is such destructive behavior.... ask the hardcore haters, and they will say they will never change their review.... why do you think so many are on the band wagon ? its not for a honest review, have you read the ones full of hatred ? those wont change ever...

 

so dont kid your self, even if you and other honest ones that will change their review back, the hardcore haters will never change it.... and they will just get other like minded haters to flock to the game just to leave hateful reviews just because they can

 

It is one reason why I hate reviews for games, because reviews can and will always be exploited... and I always think it is a bad idea.... anything that you can exploit is a very bad idea...

 

you see, on the net you can do whatever the hell you want without any responsibility... and I have seen a number of very good games go up in flames just because Haters gonna Hate.....  

 

of course the reviews can change, lots and lots of games managed to dig themselves out from bad reviews, something like No Man's Sky being probably best example. Abysmally bad reviews in the beginning, now they are at Very / Mostly postive.

 

But of course to achieve that developers have to actually put some effort into it ... and they don't like that, they'd much rather stick to the "business like usual" approach of ignoring everything. 

 

All the negative reviews do is show that at some point in time developers managed to get part of playerbase so angry (or annoyed) that they actually did overcome their natural laziness and took a few minutes to write a review.

Edited May 23, 2023 by gozer

[zuh 188]

27 minutes ago, Pacifica said:

 

The Reviews wont change.... thats why it is such destructive behavior.... ask the hardcore haters, and they will say they will never change their review.... why do you think so many are on the band wagon ? its not for a honest review, have you read the ones full of hatred ? those wont change ever...

 

so dont kid your self, even if you and other honest ones that will change their review back, the hardcore haters will never change it.... and they will just get other like minded haters to flock to the game just to leave hateful reviews just because they can

 

It is one reason why I hate reviews for games, because reviews can and will always be exploited... and I always think it is a bad idea.... anything that you can exploit is a very bad idea...

 

you see, on the net you can do whatever the hell you want without any responsibility... and I have seen a number of very good games go up in flames just because Haters gonna Hate.....  

 

It will probably take months if not years to fix what happened, if Gaijin decide to do the right thing, but who's fault this really is? 

 

The frustration was building for years probably. 

 

I'm one of those who would change review, but instead let me and like minded ppl went, someone here decided to move my feedback:

 

 

to: 

• Technical /Community Technical Support/Steam Problems & Advice 

Like it is problem with the steam, not Gaijin... or is it just to hide it in the forgotten corner of the forum? How it belongs there? 

 

Fortunately, I'm not that guy, but this is how you create and feed zealots. 

 

"The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers."

 

 

Edited May 23, 2023 by zuh

[GloBlue 94]

Il y a 1 minute, zuh a dit :

 

Il faudra probablement des mois, voire des années, pour réparer ce qui s'est passé, si Gaijin décide de faire la bonne chose, mais qui est vraiment responsable ?

 

La frustration s'est probablement accumulée pendant des années.

 

Je suis l'un de ceux qui changeraient l'examen, mais au lieu de cela, laissez-moi et les gens de l'esprit y vont, quelqu'un ici a décidé de déplacer mes commentaires :

 

 

Pour :

• Support technique/communautaire/Problèmes de vapeur et conseils

Comme si c'est un problème avec la vapeur, pas avec Gaijin... ou est-ce juste pour le cacher dans le coin oublié du forum ? Comment ça appartient là-bas ?

 

Heureusement, je ne suis pas ce type, mais c'est ainsi que vous créez et nourrissez les fanatiques.

 

"Plus vous serrez votre poignée, Tarkin, plus les systèmes d'étoiles glisseront entre vos doigts."

 

+1

[Angulus55@psn 118]

33 minutes ago, Pacifica said:

 

The Reviews wont change.... thats why it is such destructive behavior.... ask the hardcore haters, and they will say they will never change their review.... why do you think so many are on the band wagon ? its not for a honest review, have you read the ones full of hatred ? those wont change ever...

 

so dont kid your self, even if you and other honest ones that will change their review back, the hardcore haters will never change it.... and they will just get other like minded haters to flock to the game just to leave hateful reviews just because they can

 

It is one reason why I hate reviews for games, because reviews can and will always be exploited... and I always think it is a bad idea.... anything that you can exploit is a very bad idea...

 

you see, on the net you can do whatever the hell you want without any responsibility... and I have seen a number of very good games go up in flames just because Haters gonna Hate.....  

Dear @Pacifica I can understand your point of view. 

But just tell us, what the playerbase should have done better.

Players used this forum to express their opinion about russian bias and the economy system. And there were polls with over 90% against decisions gaijin made. With which success? None and you know it.

And then there was the survey, I took some time to list my constructive advises what sholud be changed. I was hoping gaijin wants to hear our constructive opinions. And then I come back to the forum and see how constructive posts get still deleted. Will gaijin learn some day how to handle our feedback?

All fair communication tools have failed and there were tries over years. So this is the point wher the playerbase took their reasonabel complains to the next level.

So please what should we do in your opinion to get our demands fullfilled? Demands that would be a win win situation where under the line gaijin would be more successful and earn more money?

And please don´t argue the change of the economic system would not be good for gaijin. 

[Stavroforos 15,367]

6 minutes ago, Angulus55@psn said:

So please what should we do in your opinion to get our demands fullfilled?

Because extortion is obviously the answer. 

 

Voting with your walltet =/= review bombing. 

[Prophet1313 236]

2 minutes ago, Angulus55@psn said:

Dear @Pacifica I can understand your point of view. 

But just tell us, what the playerbase should have done better.

Players used this forum to express their opinion about russian bias and the economy system. And there were polls with over 90% against decisions gaijin made. With which success? None and you know it.

And then there was the survey, I took some time to list my constructive advises what sholud be changed. I was hoping gaijin wants to hear our constructive opinions. And then I come back to the forum and see how constructive posts get still deleted. Will gaijin learn some day how to handle our feedback?

All fair communication tools have failed and there were tries over years. So this is the point wher the playerbase took their reasonabel complains to the next level.

So please what should we do in your opinion to get our demands fullfilled? Demands that would be a win win situation where under the line gaijin would be more successful and earn more money?

And please don´t argue the change of the economic system would not be good for gaijin. 

I agree with everything but please bear in mind the Forum staff and most devs have literally no control over where the game goes. It's not their fault and I am sure they have done their best over the years. The problem is the leadership at Gaijin who have, on countless occasions, chosen to ignore suggestions and constructive criticism. @Pacifica, just like every other forum mod is just a person who works for gaijin. They moderate the forums, pass on feedback and communicate Gaijin's responses to the players. As most of them actively play the game Im sure they agree with almost everything that has happened over the last few days except for the part where it actually threatens their livelihood. It's a shame that it's come to this but this is our last option as players 

[Angulus55@psn 118]

1 minute ago, Stavroforos said:

Because extortion is obviously the answer. 

 

Voting with your walltet =/= review bombing. 

sorry mate the question was adressed to Pacifica

[Stavroforos 15,367]

Just now, Angulus55@psn said:

sorry mate the question was adressed to Pacifica

Oh sorry, didn't realize this was a discussion you were having through PMs. 

[Angulus55@psn 118]

2 minutes ago, Prophet1313 said:

I agree with everything but please bear in mind the Forum staff and most devs have literally no control over where the game goes. It's not their fault and I am sure they have done their best over the years. The problem is the leadership at Gaijin who have, on countless occasions, chosen to ignore suggestions and constructive criticism. @Pacifica, just like every other forum mod is just a person who works for gaijin. They moderate the forums, pass on feedback and communicate Gaijin's responses to the players. As most of them actively play the game Im sure they agree with almost everything that has happened over the last few days except for the part where it actually threatens their livelihood. It's a shame that it's come to this but this is our last option as players 

And I am with you. My question to Pacifica is not adressed against Mods I know they only can do what they getting ordered by other gaijin authorities.

[Pacifica 15,971]

2 minutes ago, Angulus55@psn said:

And I am with you. My question to Pacifica is not adressed against Mods I know they only can do what they getting ordered by other gaijin authorities.

 

Moderators are not Gaijin employees, we are volunteers, we look out for the Rules of our Forum.... but we are also Gamers, and ive seen whats happened to other games out there, ive also been a Alpha, Beta, C/B and so on for a ton of games over 25 or so years

[Zer0_Tru7h 1,207]

3 minutes ago, Pacifica said:

 

Moderators are not Gaijin employees, we are volunteers, we look out for the Rules of our Forum.... but we are also Gamers, and ive seen whats happened to other games out there, ive also been a Alpha, Beta, C/B and so on for a ton of games over 25 or so years

 

Ask not what the review bombing will do to the game, but what the game has done to the gamers XD

[Unnamed_91 367]

1 hour ago, Pacifica said:

 

The Reviews wont change.... thats why it is such destructive behavior.... ask the hardcore haters, and they will say they will never change their review.... why do you think so many are on the band wagon ? its not for a honest review, have you read the ones full of hatred ? those wont change ever...

 

so dont kid your self, even if you and other honest ones that will change their review back, the hardcore haters will never change it.... and they will just get other like minded haters to flock to the game just to leave hateful reviews just because they can

 

It is one reason why I hate reviews for games, because reviews can and will always be exploited... and I always think it is a bad idea.... anything that you can exploit is a very bad idea...

 

you see, on the net you can do whatever the hell you want without any responsibility... and I have seen a number of very good games go up in flames just because Haters gonna Hate.....  

Well why doesn't witcher 3, warzone, and tons of other games have those very frustrated reviews? Gaijin brought this to themselves. This is not reaction of last economy changes, its literally frustration that's ongoing for years. Reviews are customers reactions of company actions.

You cant seriously justify everything and still refuse to start fixing situation asap.

 

Game reviews are absolutely not being exploited in this case. This is ongoing for years.

 

I haven't left review on steam (I don't say I wont), but I don't blame those who did.

 

Withdrawing war thunder from steam will send very bad message to players. 

Hell, I think game might even eventually shut down.

Gaijin is affording themselves luxury of having pride before reason (bisnis). That's how I see this. Usually, consequence of pride are bags eventually..

 

Gaijin is way too stubborn. Unhealthy I might say even.

 

EDIT:

And oh, you forgot to mention that exploiting game reviews is a two way street.

So they might not earned those reviews in first place by that logic.

Edited May 23, 2023 by Unnamed_91

[_Pterodacty91855 193]

1 hour ago, Pacifica said:

 

The Reviews wont change.... thats why it is such destructive behavior.... ask the hardcore haters, and they will say they will never change their review.... why do you think so many are on the band wagon ? its not for a honest review, have you read the ones full of hatred ? those wont change ever...

 

so dont kid your self, even if you and other honest ones that will change their review back, the hardcore haters will never change it.... and they will just get other like minded haters to flock to the game just to leave hateful reviews just because they can

 

It is one reason why I hate reviews for games, because reviews can and will always be exploited... and I always think it is a bad idea.... anything that you can exploit is a very bad idea...

 

you see, on the net you can do whatever the hell you want without any responsibility... and I have seen a number of very good games go up in flames just because Haters gonna Hate.....  

 

You act like Gaijin and Warthunder earned those Positive reviews.  They didnt.  Warthunder bribed steam players with 3 days FREE premium for leaving a good review.  All those good reviews you had before this debacle happened were bought.  Not earned.  Warthunder would have been Mostly Negative years ago if they hadnt bought the good reviews with bribes.  In fact if you read most of the positive reviews they literally have nothing to do about Warthunder.  One is a recipe for butter chicken, its pretty good, you should check it out.  Steam has a policy of removing meme reviews and guess which reviews fall under that category for Warthunder? Hint: Its not the negative ones.  

 

You now get to see the reviews that actually reflect how people think about Warthunder Developers and their recent policies.  Basically...if you suck...you get told you suck.  You can cry about that all you want, but thats the way the world works.  

Edited May 23, 2023 by BrBStoveXploded

[Zer0_Tru7h 1,207]

1 minute ago, BrBStoveXploded said:

 

You act like Gaijin and Warthunder earned those Positive reviews.  They didnt.  Warthunder bribed steam players with 3 days FREE premium for leaving a good review.  All those good reviews you had before this debacle happened were bought.  Not earned.  Warthunder would have been Mostly Negative years ago if they hadnt bought the good reviews with bribes.  

 

You now get to see the reviews that actually reflect how people think about Warthunder Developers and their recent policies.  Basically...if you suck...you get told you suck.  You can cry about that all you want, but thats the way the world works.  

 

 

 

See for yourself guys to see how scummy this is.

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/577224-does-anyone-else-got-a-premium-reward-for-being-active-in-the-community/&tab=comments#comment-9648380

 

[Thodin 6,784]

5 minutes ago, Unnamed_91 said:

Well why doesn't witcher 3, warzone, and tons of other games have those very frustrated reviews? Gaijin brought this to themselves. This is not reaction of last economy changes, its literally frustration that's ongoing for years. Reviews are customers reactions of company actions.

You cant seriously justify everything and still refuse to start fixing situation asap.

 

 

Cyberpunk had horrible reviews after launch and now it looks very good. They improved alot stuff.

[_Pterodacty91855 193]

They probably have been silent these last few days trying to figure out how to take away the 3 days free premium from people who changed their review to negative lol.  

[Unnamed_91 367]

1 minute ago, Thodin said:

 

Cyberpunk had horrible reviews after launch and now it looks very good. They improved alot stuff.

Thanks for info. Yea there are tons of examples, i just havent gone deep into that as i dont think that is focus. Focus should be on gaijin fixing situation. Not us explaining and justyfing ourselves why our reactions are like this..

[lnVader 759]

1 hour ago, Pacifica said:

The Reviews wont change.... thats why it is such destructive behavior.... ask the hardcore haters, and they will say they will never change their review.... why do you think so many are on the band wagon ? its not for a honest review, have you read the ones full of hatred ? those wont change ever...

Perhaps a small percentage of those reviews will stay (<10%) once all the concers the community has have been resolved.
I have also changed my review to a negative one and it is honestly deserved. The gameplay is very good (except for some balance issues here and there), but the progression is predatory considering 90% of the advertising is focused on top tier vehicles.

I'll gladly change my review, as will many others, when things get sorted out. But for now it stays, it is honestly deserved. Gaijin has received tons of valid feedback and good suggestions over the years but they refuse to do anything with most of it.

 

1 hour ago, Pacifica said:

It is one reason why I hate reviews for games, because reviews can and will always be exploited... and I always think it is a bad idea.... anything that you can exploit is a very bad idea...

I think I should be able to tell players about slightly predatory grind when possible.
As I stated earlier, 90% of War Thunders marketing seems to be focused on top tier.

How long does it take a completely free to play player to get there, huh? It just does not make sense.

 

Myself as a veteran 10 year player of this game, if I want to unlock one of the new top tier aircraft you know what I have to do?
Spend 8 hours tryharding flying a premium plane (70$) along with premium account (+$) against other people flying premium planes trying to grind.

And that 8 hours is only because I'm a lot better than the average player. That's usually 2+ kills per game with some even going as high as 5-10.
Imagine someone less skilled than me, it could take 2x or 3x longer even with a premium plane and account.

 

That 8 hours it takes for me to get a top tier is as many hours as one day of my regular 9-5, but doing that 9-5 I earn enough money to outright buy whatever it is I want to research and I have those 8 hours left to play the vehicle instead of grind it.

This grind is borderline predatory if things don't change.
When was the last time we've seen big RP requirement adjustments? I remember when rank 6 and 7 air were added that the previous ranks RP requirements went down.
Since the addition of rank 8 there has been no word on this happening.

 

You can't reasonably think that people will keep swallowing this poop and not eventually get frustrated, right?

 

Edited May 23, 2023 by lnVader

[Vamilad 238]

1 hour ago, Pacifica said:

 

The Reviews wont change.... thats why it is such destructive behavior.... ask the hardcore haters, and they will say they will never change their review.... why do you think so many are on the band wagon ? its not for a honest review, have you read the ones full of hatred ? those wont change ever...

 

so dont kid your self, even if you and other honest ones that will change their review back, the hardcore haters will never change it.... and they will just get other like minded haters to flock to the game just to leave hateful reviews just because they can

 

It is one reason why I hate reviews for games, because reviews can and will always be exploited... and I always think it is a bad idea.... anything that you can exploit is a very bad idea...

 

you see, on the net you can do whatever the hell you want without any responsibility... and I have seen a number of very good games go up in flames just because Haters gonna Hate.....  

 

It's a video game.  We put our free time in to the game to enjoy it.  At present our free time is being wasted in our view due to Gaijin's continued insistence in increasing monetization while also further further restricting rewards.

 

You can buy T7 premiums now for $70, but Gaijin wants players to also pay a yearly sub to play tech tree vehicles without having a negative SL balance.

 

When is enough enough? For players it was the most recent tightening of the screws.  You can claim no one will ever change their review and you'll likely be proven right. 

 

Not because players are "hardcore haters", but because Gaijin won't fix the economy to not be so oppressive.  The ball is in Gaijin's court.  If they want public opinion to change then they need to take steps to address player's grievances.  If they want to yank the game from the Steam store rather than creating a more positive experience for players then everyone's Steam review will have been validated.

 

Whatever they choose it's their game.  Their choices.

Edited May 23, 2023 by Vamilad

[Ustioo 85]

20 minutes ago, Pacifica said:

 ive also been a Alpha, Beta, C/B and so on for a ton of games over 25 or so years

Curious, in your opinion do you think the current game economy is healthy to sustain the game for the long run?

[ARK_BOI 810]

You know what I feel sorry for my account right now it not my and my account fault I enjoy it ten years

Edited May 23, 2023 by ARK_BOI

[Waelse 278]

30 minutes ago, Pacifica said:

 

Moderators are not Gaijin employees, we are volunteers, we look out for the Rules of our Forum.... but we are also Gamers, and ive seen whats happened to other games out there, ive also been a Alpha, Beta, C/B and so on for a ton of games over 25 or so years

We all are still in a Beta!

[_Acadia_ 114]

1 hour ago, Pacifica said:

 

The Reviews wont change.... thats why it is such destructive behavior.... ask the hardcore haters, and they will say they will never change their review.... why do you think so many are on the band wagon ? its not for a honest review, have you read the ones full of hatred ? those wont change ever...

 

so dont kid your self, even if you and other honest ones that will change their review back, the hardcore haters will never change it.... and they will just get other like minded haters to flock to the game just to leave hateful reviews just because they can

 

It is one reason why I hate reviews for games, because reviews can and will always be exploited... and I always think it is a bad idea.... anything that you can exploit is a very bad idea...

 

you see, on the net you can do whatever the hell you want without any responsibility... and I have seen a number of very good games go up in flames just because Haters gonna Hate.....  

No just no, reviews are essential and must have for Video Games
Without reviews a dev can literally throw unfinished half baked game, many people still buy it

For Warthunder situation it's 100% it's fault, what Gj should do after may 19 economy cancel update announcement,just update to better economy soon, no more whining

But alas what they did was spouting more nonsense for its defense, GJ really need to change its PR team
TALK LESS DO MORE, thats what they really should did, but it's too late

 

[Pacifica 15,971]

17 minutes ago, Waelse said:

We all are still in a Beta!

 

Well thats the thing, Online games are always in Development... Gaijin wanted to get out of Beta ASAP, but the game is in constant Development... it is just the nature of MMOs