The_one_guy 45 Report post Posted May 25, 2023 I tried to play nice but Gaijin really didn't seem to like when I called them out for their predatory business model. So instead of going back and forth with moderation team only interested in suppressing the truth, here's my findings on the game. The TLDR is if you want to play for free it would take 35.5 years to unlock everything, since the game has been out for 11 years that means it's impossible to unlock everything for free. At the fastest possible pace you would have to play everyday for about 3.5 years and pay close to $23,000 just on research points. Chapter 1: Warthunder’s game progression – ranks For each of these ranks I will be using USSR Ground tab as a base standard and the average RP gain per match to be the minimum RP multiplier per tier times 1000 for a 30 minute match. This would be for an above average player. I will also assume every 6 hours of game time is 1 day of real time as players will obviously not normally play 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. It should also be taken into account that due to requirements of a vehicle being in line with another, some of the below times may be larger than expected. I will also assume no premium time nor any other paid incentives for these calculations. Rank 1 provides the fastest progression of any tier. Assuming players achieve 1000 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 2 can be achieved in about 8 hours of play (2 days) with all vehicles researched in about 20 hours of play (4 days). Rank 2 is a large jump in progression time but is still reasonable. Assuming players achieve 1120 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 3 can be achieved in about 30 hours of play (5 days) with all vehicles researched in about 91 hours of play (16 days). Rank 3 is another jump in progression time. Assuming players achieve 1420 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 4 can be achieved in about 72 hours of play (12 days) with all vehicles researched in about 162 hours of play (27 days). Rank 4 continues the exponential trend. Assuming players achieve 1600RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 5 can be achieved in about 127 hours of play (22 days) with all vehicles researched in about 254 hours of play (43 days). Rank 5 gets even higher. Assuming players achieve 1900 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 6 can be achieved in about 171 hours of play (29 days) with all vehicles researched in about 328 hours of play (55 days). Rank 6 is getting ridiculously high. Assuming players achieve 2140 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 7 can be achieved in about 376 hours of play (63 days) with all vehicles researched in about 1035 hours of play (173 days). Rank 7 is the apex of the curve. Assuming players achieve 2320 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean every vehicle would need 73 hours of play (13 days) with all vehicles researched in 703 hours (118 days) In total, assuming players get the most efficient play possible 6 hours a day (42 hours a week), a top rank vehicle can be achieved in 857 hours of play or about 143 days (5 months) with all vehicles of a single tab of a single nation taking around 2593 hours of play or 433 days (1.2 years). To account for all nations and all tabs, assuming 10 nations, 3 tabs per nation (there are usually 5 but some have less vehicles per tab or less tabs overall). To reach top rank in every nation in every tab would take about 25710 hours of play (11.74 years) if done efficiently and would take 77790 hours of play (35.5 years) to research every vehicle ever offered. This means it is theoretically possible for a player whom has played since Warthunder’s debut to have the highest rank vehicle in every nation in every tab without paying anything however it is impossible for any player to have every vehicle without paying as this would assume the player spent close to 19.4 hours per day everyday for the last 11 years. Chapter 1: Warthunder’s game progression – Paid incentives As is evident by the previous chapter, the game is impossible to unlock all vehicles without spending money. There are 4 methods of spending money to attain boosters available. Each has varying degrees of effectiveness. The first method is premium time, this provides a +100% or 2 times multiplier on research gains. Using solely this method any research time can be cut in half. At a price of $74 per year (approximate), below is the time and money spent to research to top tier effectively and to research everything: Premium Minimum hours Maximum hours Minimum days Maximum days Minimum $ Maximum $ Rank 1 4 10 1 2 0.2 0.41 Rank 2 15 46 3 8 0.61 1.62 Rank 3 36 81 6 14 1.22 2.84 Rank 4 64 127 11 22 2.23 4.46 Rank 5 86 164 15 28 3.04 5.68 Rank 6 188 518 32 87 6.49 17.64 Rank 7 37 352 7 59 1.42 11.96 Total 1 Tab 429 1297 72 217 14.6 43.99 Total Everything 12855 38895 2143 6483 434.47 1314.36 As you can see the total time to research everything is still large but for a relatively small payment it is quite an effective method of speeding up progression if we are considering only 1 nation and 1 tab. To research everything with this method alone is unreasonable as it would have taken approximately 17.76 years to research everything. The second method is premium vehicles. Every vehicle has variable prices and effectiveness. Most vehicles provide a 2x multiplier to RP of a similar rank vehicle for about $50 more or less, assuming the highest rank premium. Unlike premium time, this is not a time limited purchase and will be in the player’s inventory forever. However, unlike premium time, a vehicle can only be used for a single tab of a single nation. Assuming a player used solely this method for the 38 tabs, below is an estimation of time and costs: Premium Vehicle Minimum hours Maximum hours Minimum days Maximum days $ Rank 1 2 4 1 1 50 Rank 2 7 22 2 4 50 Rank 3 22 50 4 9 50 Rank 4 44 88 8 15 50 Rank 5 70 134 12 23 50 Rank 6 173 477 29 80 50 Rank 7 37 351 7 59 50 Total 1 Tab 355 1126 60 188 50 Total Everything 10650 33780 1775 5630 1900 As you can see for this method the price is more fixed and provides a slightly higher time effectiveness, especially at lower ranks if the player is utilizing a high rank premium. However, this method by itself is still unreasonable to research everything as it would take 15.42 years. The third method is free research. For this method I am going to assume the player has infinite free research available to simplify the calculation. At this time 45 RP is equal to 1 GE, this makes the free RP about 9868 RP per $ using the most discounted option. The advantage of this method is it takes no extra time on part of the player to research so long as the accrued free research is already available. Free research Minimum $ Maximum $ Rank 1 1.7 3.99 Rank 2 6.89 20.58 Rank 3 20.67 46.61 Rank 4 41.24 82.49 Rank 5 65.87 126.16 Rank 6 163.15 448.91 Rank 7 34.45 330.35 Total 1 Tab 333.97 1059.09 Total Everything 10019.1 31772.7 As you can see the primary disadvantage to the player with this method is the cost. With the cost of purchasing every vehicle in the game being only slightly less the actual cost of buying a real life functional tank, an old one at that. The fourth method is by buying boosters. The largest booster on sale is a +75% booster for 10 games for about $3.3. This provides the choice of the player to pick when to use a booster and is thus not time limited but play time is still required. Booster Minimum hours Maximum hours Minimum days Maximum days Minimum $ Maximum $ Rank 1 5 11 1 2 3.3 7.26 Rank 2 17 52 3 9 11.22 34.32 Rank 3 41 93 7 16 27.06 61.38 Rank 4 73 145 13 25 48.18 95.7 Rank 5 98 187 17 32 64.68 123.42 Rank 6 215 591 36 99 141.9 390.06 Rank 7 42 401 7 67 27.72 264.66 Total 1 Tab 491 1480 82 247 324.06 976.8 Total Everything 14730 44400 2455 7400 9721.8 29304 As you can see this method is the least efficient of the four as it requires the player to still play the game while having cost values that are comparable to outright purchasing a vehicle using free research. Combining these methods onto the ultimate payment plan. Below is the cost a player can achieve all vehicles in the game in the shortest amount of time: ALL Paid incentives Min RP Max RP Minimum hours Maximum hours Minimum days Maximum days Minimum $ Maximum $ All nations all tabs 98874000 313545000 Bought with Free RP 49437000 156772500 5009.62 15886.28 total boosts (4.5x) 49437000 156772500 2368 7508 395 1252 +75% boost 2368 7508 395 1252 1562.88 4955.28 premium time 2368 7508 395 1252 80.08 253.83 premium vehicle 1900 1900 Total Everything 8552.58 22995.39 To summarize, while the paid incentives do allow for faster progression, they require thousands of dollars and many years of constant gameplay in order to experience every vehicle the game offers. In the case of the fastest possible progression at 6 hours a day, it would take 3.43 years and $22,995 to attain every vehicle in Warthunder. This does not include any accrued costs or benefits due to spading a vehicle. 1 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amalric261 83 Report post Posted May 26, 2023 2 hours ago, The_one_guy said: I tried to play nice but Gaijin really didn't seem to like when I called them out for their predatory business model. So instead of going back and forth with moderation team only interested in suppressing the truth, here's my findings on the game. The TLDR is if you want to play for free it would take 35.5 years to unlock everything, since the game has been out for 11 years that means it's impossible to unlock everything for free. At the fastest possible pace you would have to play everyday for about 3.5 years and pay close to $23,000 just on research points. Chapter 1: Warthunder’s game progression – ranks For each of these ranks I will be using USSR Ground tab as a base standard and the average RP gain per match to be the minimum RP multiplier per tier times 1000 for a 30 minute match. This would be for an above average player. I will also assume every 6 hours of game time is 1 day of real time as players will obviously not normally play 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. It should also be taken into account that due to requirements of a vehicle being in line with another, some of the below times may be larger than expected. I will also assume no premium time nor any other paid incentives for these calculations. Rank 1 provides the fastest progression of any tier. Assuming players achieve 1000 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 2 can be achieved in about 8 hours of play (2 days) with all vehicles researched in about 20 hours of play (4 days). Rank 2 is a large jump in progression time but is still reasonable. Assuming players achieve 1120 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 3 can be achieved in about 30 hours of play (5 days) with all vehicles researched in about 91 hours of play (16 days). Rank 3 is another jump in progression time. Assuming players achieve 1420 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 4 can be achieved in about 72 hours of play (12 days) with all vehicles researched in about 162 hours of play (27 days). Rank 4 continues the exponential trend. Assuming players achieve 1600RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 5 can be achieved in about 127 hours of play (22 days) with all vehicles researched in about 254 hours of play (43 days). Rank 5 gets even higher. Assuming players achieve 1900 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 6 can be achieved in about 171 hours of play (29 days) with all vehicles researched in about 328 hours of play (55 days). Rank 6 is getting ridiculously high. Assuming players achieve 2140 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean rank 7 can be achieved in about 376 hours of play (63 days) with all vehicles researched in about 1035 hours of play (173 days). Rank 7 is the apex of the curve. Assuming players achieve 2320 RP per 30 minute battle, this would mean every vehicle would need 73 hours of play (13 days) with all vehicles researched in 703 hours (118 days) In total, assuming players get the most efficient play possible 6 hours a day (42 hours a week), a top rank vehicle can be achieved in 857 hours of play or about 143 days (5 months) with all vehicles of a single tab of a single nation taking around 2593 hours of play or 433 days (1.2 years). To account for all nations and all tabs, assuming 10 nations, 3 tabs per nation (there are usually 5 but some have less vehicles per tab or less tabs overall). To reach top rank in every nation in every tab would take about 25710 hours of play (11.74 years) if done efficiently and would take 77790 hours of play (35.5 years) to research every vehicle ever offered. This means it is theoretically possible for a player whom has played since Warthunder’s debut to have the highest rank vehicle in every nation in every tab without paying anything however it is impossible for any player to have every vehicle without paying as this would assume the player spent close to 19.4 hours per day everyday for the last 11 years. Chapter 1: Warthunder’s game progression – Paid incentives As is evident by the previous chapter, the game is impossible to unlock all vehicles without spending money. There are 4 methods of spending money to attain boosters available. Each has varying degrees of effectiveness. The first method is premium time, this provides a +100% or 2 times multiplier on research gains. Using solely this method any research time can be cut in half. At a price of $74 per year (approximate), below is the time and money spent to research to top tier effectively and to research everything: Premium Minimum hours Maximum hours Minimum days Maximum days Minimum $ Maximum $ Rank 1 4 10 1 2 0.2 0.41 Rank 2 15 46 3 8 0.61 1.62 Rank 3 36 81 6 14 1.22 2.84 Rank 4 64 127 11 22 2.23 4.46 Rank 5 86 164 15 28 3.04 5.68 Rank 6 188 518 32 87 6.49 17.64 Rank 7 37 352 7 59 1.42 11.96 Total 1 Tab 429 1297 72 217 14.6 43.99 Total Everything 12855 38895 2143 6483 434.47 1314.36 As you can see the total time to research everything is still large but for a relatively small payment it is quite an effective method of speeding up progression if we are considering only 1 nation and 1 tab. To research everything with this method alone is unreasonable as it would have taken approximately 17.76 years to research everything. The second method is premium vehicles. Every vehicle has variable prices and effectiveness. Most vehicles provide a 2x multiplier to RP of a similar rank vehicle for about $50 more or less, assuming the highest rank premium. Unlike premium time, this is not a time limited purchase and will be in the player’s inventory forever. However, unlike premium time, a vehicle can only be used for a single tab of a single nation. Assuming a player used solely this method for the 38 tabs, below is an estimation of time and costs: Premium Vehicle Minimum hours Maximum hours Minimum days Maximum days $ Rank 1 2 4 1 1 50 Rank 2 7 22 2 4 50 Rank 3 22 50 4 9 50 Rank 4 44 88 8 15 50 Rank 5 70 134 12 23 50 Rank 6 173 477 29 80 50 Rank 7 37 351 7 59 50 Total 1 Tab 355 1126 60 188 50 Total Everything 10650 33780 1775 5630 1900 As you can see for this method the price is more fixed and provides a slightly higher time effectiveness, especially at lower ranks if the player is utilizing a high rank premium. However, this method by itself is still unreasonable to research everything as it would take 15.42 years. The third method is free research. For this method I am going to assume the player has infinite free research available to simplify the calculation. At this time 45 RP is equal to 1 GE, this makes the free RP about 9868 RP per $ using the most discounted option. The advantage of this method is it takes no extra time on part of the player to research so long as the accrued free research is already available. Free research Minimum $ Maximum $ Rank 1 1.7 3.99 Rank 2 6.89 20.58 Rank 3 20.67 46.61 Rank 4 41.24 82.49 Rank 5 65.87 126.16 Rank 6 163.15 448.91 Rank 7 34.45 330.35 Total 1 Tab 333.97 1059.09 Total Everything 10019.1 31772.7 As you can see the primary disadvantage to the player with this method is the cost. With the cost of purchasing every vehicle in the game being only slightly less the actual cost of buying a real life functional tank, an old one at that. The fourth method is by buying boosters. The largest booster on sale is a +75% booster for 10 games for about $3.3. This provides the choice of the player to pick when to use a booster and is thus not time limited but play time is still required. Booster Minimum hours Maximum hours Minimum days Maximum days Minimum $ Maximum $ Rank 1 5 11 1 2 3.3 7.26 Rank 2 17 52 3 9 11.22 34.32 Rank 3 41 93 7 16 27.06 61.38 Rank 4 73 145 13 25 48.18 95.7 Rank 5 98 187 17 32 64.68 123.42 Rank 6 215 591 36 99 141.9 390.06 Rank 7 42 401 7 67 27.72 264.66 Total 1 Tab 491 1480 82 247 324.06 976.8 Total Everything 14730 44400 2455 7400 9721.8 29304 As you can see this method is the least efficient of the four as it requires the player to still play the game while having cost values that are comparable to outright purchasing a vehicle using free research. Combining these methods onto the ultimate payment plan. Below is the cost a player can achieve all vehicles in the game in the shortest amount of time: ALL Paid incentives Min RP Max RP Minimum hours Maximum hours Minimum days Maximum days Minimum $ Maximum $ All nations all tabs 98874000 313545000 Bought with Free RP 49437000 156772500 5009.62 15886.28 total boosts (4.5x) 49437000 156772500 2368 7508 395 1252 +75% boost 2368 7508 395 1252 1562.88 4955.28 premium time 2368 7508 395 1252 80.08 253.83 premium vehicle 1900 1900 Total Everything 8552.58 22995.39 To summarize, while the paid incentives do allow for faster progression, they require thousands of dollars and many years of constant gameplay in order to experience every vehicle the game offers. In the case of the fastest possible progression at 6 hours a day, it would take 3.43 years and $22,995 to attain every vehicle in Warthunder. This does not include any accrued costs or benefits due to spading a vehicle. Thanks for the hard work. It´s really disheartening that this bad eco was not bad enough and they tried to sneak in another -0.1, -0. 20 gain modifier for nearly all tanks and planes. Didn´t care for ships, so i don´t know how bad it would have been for ships. Oh and the worst part would have been the nerfing of nearly all premium planes and tanks (RP %,SL % and modifier). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slickshotz 93 Report post Posted June 3, 2023 I don't think they've even addressed the issue of research required for vehicles. That is very concerning that they've not said a word about it even with the post they've made about answering questions. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Real K Soze@live 407 Report post Posted June 3, 2023 On 26/05/2023 at 00:12, The_one_guy said: In the case of the fastest possible progression at 6 hours a day, it would take 3.43 years and $22,995 to attain every vehicle in Warthunder. Your overall post looks like a hell of hard work to show the grinding issues within war thunder. What i miss is a more practical approach, so like how long for an Air/Ground/Naval tree as imho with your current view you just address the rare species of "collectors" or people which see too unlock everything in a game as a desired goal. As a pilot or tanker main i usually just don't care about ships or vice versa. Anyway, great job and have a good one! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
icata1 87 Report post Posted June 4, 2023 also you have to put in that you don't make money with 80% of the stuff . so you will have to unlock like 5 tank's and go grind 5 mil in air or low br tanks to buy it ... xD add 5k/h more/h xD less if you are god pilot .. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_one_guy 45 Report post Posted June 4, 2023 22 hours ago, Uncle J Wick@live said: What i miss is a more practical approach, so like how long for an Air/Ground/Naval tree as imho with your current view you just address the rare species of "collectors" or people which see too unlock everything in a game as a desired goal. As a pilot or tanker main i usually just don't care about ships or vice versa. I wouldn't really describe it like being a collector. Comparing it to the battlefield franchise, a collector would be someone who gets every weapon, every attachment, every gadget, and every skin. Unless you really don't like playing a certain class, it is very easy for any die hard player to get every weapon. What I described above is just the research required to get every vehicle, I didn't add any extra time to get every module, or to get every skin, or the time to get event vehicles. If you want to know about just vehicle time for pilots and tankers it would take about 23.72 years for free. For my math I used a base time calculated from the ussr ground tree (1.19 years), and multiplied it by 3 per nation to get the total times. 1 for ground, 1 for air, and 1 for the combined helicopter and navel since they are smaller trees. 44 minutes ago, icata1 said: also you have to put in that you don't make money with 80% of the stuff . so you will have to unlock like 5 tank's and go grind 5 mil in air or low br tanks to buy it ... xD add 5k/h more/h xD less if you are god pilot .. This wasn't about silver lions, just focusing on the research points alone. But yeah, any time spent on grinding silver lions may impact grinding times. On 03/06/2023 at 12:03, Slickshotz said: I don't think they've even addressed the issue of research required for vehicles. That is very concerning that they've not said a word about it even with the post they've made about answering questions. What's bad is the whole reason it's on this page of the forums is because I did try to add this with some suggestions on the moderated forums and within like a day they removed it. I assume with so many people traveling there they didn't want people to see just how bad it is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slickshotz 93 Report post Posted June 6, 2023 On 04/06/2023 at 14:56, The_one_guy said: What's bad is the whole reason it's on this page of the forums is because I did try to add this with some suggestions on the moderated forums and within like a day they removed it. I assume with so many people traveling there they didn't want people to see just how bad it is. I would assume so, this is the typical let the storm die down and then give us a joke of a fix for the research required on vehicles. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HansHimmelreich 13 Report post Posted June 11, 2023 this is fine, gaijin is not greedy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
