Ar 196A-3 for SUMMER 2020 event be upgraded to 196A-5

[Pony51 6,572]

The SUMMER 2020 event has a special prize of the Ar 196A-3.

 

This is a very much needed and welcome addition to WT, however Germany still lacks a Rank I seaplane anyone can get at any time (either unlock or for GE). 

Yes, Event units could be purchased on "marketplace" with GJC after, but they often sell for much more real money, and there are ways to earn Gold Eagles in game.  Event vehicles are effectively a very rare unit.  

  

As Naval games develop seaplanes become more and more critical for winning matches because they can cap water points and earn a victory. 

There is also a Warbond challenge that requires use of a "hydroplane" (seaplane) to complete a mission.

 

I play naval almost every day I often see seaplanes capping distant points, often winning the match for the side with the capping seaplane.  

 

USA, UK, and Japan have Rank I seaplanes in regular tree and Premium.

USSR has a Premium PBY-5a in Rank I

Germany (and the very recent addition of Italy) does not have an (easily accessible) seaplane.

 

Some players may know of the He 51 B-2/H seaplane, but that is a special event unit last offered 3+ years ago and few have it.  
The BV 238 is gargantuan BR 4.0 target that is not a good unit for capping points, it takes a very long time to slow down so is easy to coast over a point before it is capped.

 

Proposal:

Upgrade the Event Ar 196 to the later A-5 version. 

1. This upgraded the gunners obsolete MG 15 with a ROF of 1000 rpm to the massively better MG 81z with 3600 rpm!  

2. Later in the war the MG FF had a 90 round magazine, for a total capacity 180 rounds of 20mm.  90 round magazines were developed and produced early 1941, and was designed to fit all MG FF and MG FF/M installations (See the Fw 190A-5).

 

Later (next major?) the Ar 196A-3 version can be free to added to the main tree as a simple unlock.

 

This is a Win-Win situation.

Players in the event earn a very worthy prize unit that will be competitive with others.

All players can get a seaplane to do the events and warbond tasks.

Germany tree will be ready for upgrades to Naval game play.

 

 

Here is the only picture I could find with a clear view of the MG 81z

 

 

 

The only visual difference between the A-3 and A-5 for War Thunder purposes is the rear gunners weapon.  No changes to engine performance (only a documented propeller change) or added armor is noted.

The real aircraft had new radios changed radios and new cockpit instruments (not critical for making a new version) 

 

Limited online sources for A-5 (and are often copies of Wiki), some locations:

This is Kagero book, with 2 sentence on the A-5

Quote

The final model in the serial production was the Ar 196 A-5 powered by the BMW 132 K engine and equipped with FuG 16, FuG 25 and later FuG 141 radio stations. To provide better defence of the tail hemisphere, a single MG 15 machine gun on a flexible mount was replaced by twin 7.92 mm MG 81 machine gun with 2000 rounds.

http://www.kagero.eu/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=303:arado-ar-196&catid=95:aviation-of-ww2&Itemid=688&limitstart=2

 

https://www.asisbiz.com/il2/Ar-196/Arado-Ar-196.html

 

 

Here are the stats for the Ar 196A-5, taken off Wikipedia and but the MG 81Z replacing the MG 15.

General characteristics

• Crew: two (pilot and observer)
• Length: 11 m (36 ft 1 in)
• Wingspan: 12.4 m (40 ft 8 in)
• Height: 4.45 m (14 ft 7 in)
• Wing area: 28.4 m² (306 sq ft)
• Empty weight: 2,990 kg (6,592 lb)
• Max takeoff weight: 3,720 kg (8,201 lb)
• Powerplant: 1 × BMW 132K 9-cylinder air-cooled radial piston engine, 706 kW (947 hp)

Performance

• Maximum speed: 311 km/h (193 mph, 168 kn)
• Range: 1,080 km (670 mi, 580 nmi)
• Service ceiling: 7,010 m (23,000 ft)
• Rate of climb: 5 m/s (980 ft/min)
• Wing loading: 98.2 kg/m² (20.1 lb/sq ft)
• Power/mass: 0.167 kW/kg ( 0.101 hp/lb)

Armament

• Guns:
• 1 × 7.92 mm (0.312 in) MG 81Z machine gun (with 2000 rounds of ammo)
• 1 × 7.92 mm (0.312 in) MG 17 machine gun
• 2 × 20 mm (0.787 in) MG FF cannon
• Bombs: 2x 50 kg (110.231 lb) bombs

[Princess_Pinch 5,625]

Open for discussion. 

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

For the record, the He 51B-2/H can also be purchased on the Gaijin market too...though I must say that, at $29.40 USD for the cheapest one, it's a lot more expensive than it once was.  I would've thought Gaijin would've put it into the warbond battle trophy rotation by now but I guess not.

 

As for changing the Ar 196A-3, the problem here is that it's a PLAYER-MADE plane (made by the same guy that made the Ta 154A-1).  Gaijin would be better off releasing a different floatplane themselves.

Edited August 8, 2020 by Z3r0_

[Chomusuke1 1,219]

Same goes for the Fw 189 A-1...We should have gotten the more numerous A-2. Same goes for the Fw 200 C-1...We should have gotten the more numerous C-4. Same goes for the rare Jagdpanzer IV Ausf. F with 60 mm frontal armor...We should have gotten the more numerous 80 mm thick one. Same goes for the early Stug III G / Sturmpanzer IV Ausf. II / Ferdinand / Jagdpanther / StuH 42 and so on and so forth. Gaijin has a nasty tendency of deliberately depicting non-definitive/earliest possible features/rare vehicle configurations instead of going for an accurate, mass produced, most mainstream, most common representation or configuration of a vehicle. Anyway here is more Ar 196 stuff:

 

http://www.warbirdphotographs.com/luftwaffephotos/index.html#ar196menu

 

Edited August 8, 2020 by Chomusuke1

[Chomusuke1 1,219]

Translation help is needed:

 

 

[Milocat 4,854]

+1 for the Ar 196A-5 in some capacity.

[Solarmod 1,203]

+1, grinding the float rn (: 

[Target1331 3,055]

Totally agree, at least the Ar 196 A-5 should be in the tech tree, with it being the most common version and Ar 196 being the iconic German WWII floatplane (He 115 close contender) in general. Plus it has a good place at low tier naval battles, and so far there is no tech tree float or seaplane in the tech tree to support in naval battles.

 

On 08/08/2020 at 08:30, Chomusuke1 said:

Translation help is needed:

Quote

Ar 196 A-1: Engine: BMW 132 K

Weapons: 1 movable MG 15 with 525 rounds
Radio (FT-unit): 1 FuG V AU
Rack Unit: 2 ETC 50 VIII Sea
Propeller: 3-bladed, adjustable wooden prop black

Ar 196 A-2: like A-1, but with additional 2 MG-FF/M and one MG 17 and occasionally adjustable pitch prop
Ar 196 A-3: like A-2, but: FT-unit FuG X, Peil G IV, adjustable pitch prop
Ar 196 A-4: like A-2, but 800l fuel (tank)
Ar 196 A-5: like A-3, but FuG X, FuG 25, installation kit FuG 16, rack unit ASK-RZ for series drop, MG 81 Z as defensive armament

 

The build version overview from 01.Nov.1942 states for Ar 196 A-2 additionally the smoke generator SN 5 C, for A-3 a VDM adjustable pitch prop, artificial horizon, and upgrade kit of the MG 81 Z in B-Stand.
2 years later, on 01.Nov.1944, the following additions were made:
Ar 196 A-3/U-1: like A-3 with ice skates (IIRC those are strong metal strips running on the bottom rim of the floats)
Ar 196 A-4/U-1: like A-2 with aerial target towing equipment
Ar 196 A-5: Engine BMW 132 W, 2 MG 131 or MG 151 instead of earlier wing weapons (MG/FF)

 

However, there is a mismatch, in the list under A-2 it states MG-FF/M, but at the bottom it just states MG/FF under A-5.

 

Furthermore, I checked two of the books I have readily available and none talk about the MG-FF/M, just the MG/FF.

Luftwaffe in Action, Part 4 - Aircraft No.8 - Squadron Signal:

Spoiler

Warplanes of the Luftwaffe - Barnes & Noble (cutaway is Ar 196 A-5, due to MG 81Z shown):

Spoiler

 

Best regards,
Phil

[Pony51 6,572]

20 minutes ago, Target1331 said:

However, there is a mismatch, in the list under A-2 it states MG-FF/M, but at the bottom it just states MG/FF under A-5.

 

Furthermore, I checked two of the books I have readily available and none talk about the MG-FF/M, just the MG/FF.

Luftwaffe in Action, Part 4 - Aircraft No.8 - Squadron Signal:

  Reveal hidden contents

Warplanes of the Luftwaffe - Barnes & Noble (cutaway is Ar 196 A-5, due to MG 81Z shown):

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

3 possibilities.

 

1. People being lazy.  Often you see MG 151 missing the "/20", but when the ammo is mentioned as 20mm one knows it is "/20".

 

2.  AP rounds instead of Mine rounds, as the FF has a higher muzzle velocity with AP rounds, anti-ship.

 

3.  Free ammo.  There was a huge stockpile of AP ammo, so it was given to the KM (although I think the 196 pilots was still part of LW)

 

Last 2 could have been combined factors.

 

Anyone have a manual?

 

Quote

2 years later, on 01.Nov.1944, the following additions were made:
Ar 196 A-3/U-1: like A-3 with ice skates (IIRC those are strong metal strips running on the bottom rim of the floats)
Ar 196 A-4/U-1: like A-2 with aerial target towing equipment
Ar 196 A-5: Engine BMW 132 W, 2 MG 131 or MG 151 instead of earlier wing weapons (MG/FF)

 

So, the last A-5 update does not have any modifier?  /U1?  /R1?

[Target1331 3,055]

7 minutes ago, Pony51 said:

 

Anyone have a manual?

 

Found this thread where someone posted a ton of scan pages of an Ar 196 A-3 manual: https://ww2aircraft.net/forum/threads/arado-ar196.43170/page-2

And one page has the gun calibration page for the armament and it too only states MG-FF (Linker Flügel & Rechter Flügel / ESK 2000b is the gun camera):

Spoiler

 

Best regards,

Phil

[efetenekeci 1,841]

I think it can be added in German tech tree like the way they added OS2Us in USA tech tree. If somebody purchases a rank 2 German vessel, he can get the Ar 196 A-5

[Pony51 6,572]

4 hours ago, efetenekeci said:

I think it can be added in German tech tree like the way they added OS2Us in USA tech tree. If somebody purchases a rank 2 German vessel, he can get the Ar 196 A-5

OS2U was removed because it too poor of a unit to have (as in BR 0.0)  (remember the vanishing French tanks?)

 

Then the Navy came in and suddenly it was important for the game again.

The 196 is a far more useful unit, estimated BR 1.7, maybe 2.0.

[devilskid4 41]

I would prefer the A-5 to be the tech tree version. Also the He-51 Hydro can technically be gotten from warbonds in the random vehicle chest sometimes, it's how I got mine (not saying it was easy or reasonable for most players, just that it's possible).

[Chomusuke1 1,219]

Is someone going to bug report the MG FF/M & MG 81 z?

Edited August 16, 2020 by Chomusuke1

[Wolf_89 2,525]

We could always use more float planes and flying boats 

[gaelan@psn 1,951]

The trend of having every new float plane be a premium needs to die

[Chomusuke1 1,219]

On ‎10‎/‎08‎/‎2020 at 13:24, Target1331 said:

Translation help is needed

 

Ty for that. Could you do these two if it is not too much trouble?:

 

 

Edited August 17, 2020 by Chomusuke1

[Target1331 3,055]

2 hours ago, Chomusuke1 said:

 

Ty for that. Could you do these two if it is not too much trouble?:

 

The structure was identically to that of the series Ar 196 A-3. The radio equipment was improved. Inside the observation stand (i.e. doubling as gunner stand), instead of the movable MG 15, the twin-MG 81 was installed, which were also retro-fitted to the Ar 196 A-3 production series.

 

Quote

 

Technical Instruction from the "Generalluftzeugmeisters" (loosely: general aircraft master - responsible for technical aspects of the Luftwaffe i.e. development, testing and procurement; position filled by Ernst Udet and later Erhard Milch)

 

Concerning: Ar 196. - Changes of the production series designation Ar 196 A-3 into Ar 196 A-5.

 

The Ar 196 aircraft of the production series A-3, which are equipped with the FuG XVI (radio), will receive from c/n 196 0212 onward the production series designation A-5, provided the following listed change instructions and TAGL (technical instructions of the GL ("Generalluftzeugmeisters")) are being performed:

1. Change instruction No. 43 (Installation MG 81Z),
2. Change instruction No. 44 (cage-able artificial horizon),
3. TAGL lfd. (generally acronym for "laufend" = continuous) No. 718/42 (Mech. Compensation Installation), - (Unsure what the "Kompensiereinrichtung" should compensated for)
4. Engine change, Installation of VHF-interference-suppression by company BMW (caused by FuG XVI-installation).

After completion of these four points, the designation Ar 196 A-3 is to be changed to Ar 196 A-5 in the data card, type data plate, and aircraft logbook.

 

Best regards,

Phil

Edited August 17, 2020 by Target1331
clarifying word added

[Chomusuke1 1,219]

How easy would it be to take the current craft in the game and correct it to A-5 standards? Forgive my computer illiteracy but is there a program or editor which allows opening and editing of warthunder aircrafts?

[Pony51 6,572]

On 14/09/2020 at 13:16, Chomusuke1 said:

How easy would it be to take the current craft in the game and correct it to A-5 standards? Forgive my computer illiteracy but is there a program or editor which allows opening and editing of warthunder aircrafts?

I believe (from what little I know) the 3D models can be opened by most 3D software.  

 

There is also code for how the 3D model operates in game.

 

Finally the art for the skins.

[Chomusuke1 1,219]

On ‎15‎/‎09‎/‎2020 at 14:34, Pony51 said:

I believe (from what little I know) the 3D models can be opened by most 3D software.

There is also code for how the 3D model operates in game.

Finally the art for the skins.

Please provide step by step instructions on how to do this '3D software+code+skins'

[Pony51 6,572]

8 hours ago, Chomusuke1 said:

Please provide step by step instructions on how to do this '3D software+code+skins'

I am not the person to ask,  I do not know anything about this beyond "it can be done"

There is forums on Building and CDK, go look there, you will find what you want.

 

Ask the guy who made the Ar 196

[kkang2828 1,446]

Just give us the A-5 version in the tech tree.

[hemmerling 433]

On 08/08/2020 at 17:30, Chomusuke1 said:

Translation help is needed:

 

 

Just use your smartphone camera, and then apply OCR which is included by the smartphone app.

[Chomusuke1 1,219]

On 21/11/2020 at 01:36, hemmerling said:

your smartphone

 

You assume that I willingly possess a portable sterility inducing device. Anyway, someone has already translated it

 

Edited May 9, 2022 by Chomusuke1