A move that completely baffles me every time

[ChaoticNeutral 129]

I don't understand it when I get killed this way:

 

It's at the start of the match, when the two teams are flying at each other. Natrually, I climb, find a good height, then just go full speed forward.

 

Occassionally, I see another plane coming at me, though about a kilometer below. I notice this plane is either the same model, or a lower quality model plane, so between that and the distance, I'm not worried about it.

 

I am wrong.

 

Somehow these planes manage to fly 90 degrees upward, then come to my level, and then get on my tail and shoot me.

 

How the fuck does the physics work there? Where the hell is my speed and height advantage?

[G18AkimboPro 5,390]

This is the magic of boosted FMs. (Though, helicopters happen in RB too :/ )

[Harveyp1 1,267]

WELCOME TO ARCADE!!

 

[GunFighter86 3,190]

I kept saying this is a thing now since the last big patch, but nobody believed me.

[Bohmesy 2,119]

I kept saying this is a thing now since the last big patch, but nobody believed me.

It's Arcade, I've been able to do this since I started with WT, 1.33-1.35ish. Not new to me.

[GunFighter86 3,190]

You were one of the ones that didn't believe it.
Yes it was possible, but now it's tragicomically out of hand.

[HochgeborenKlown 1,276]

I don't understand it when I get killed this way:

 

It's at the start of the match, when the two teams are flying at each other. Natrually, I climb, find a good height, then just go full speed forward.

 

Occassionally, I see another plane coming at me, though about a kilometer below. I notice this plane is either the same model, or a lower quality model plane, so between that and the distance, I'm not worried about it.

 

I am wrong.

 

Somehow these planes manage to fly 90 degrees upward, then come to my level, and then get on my tail and shoot me.

 

How the xxxx does the physics work there? Where the hell is my speed and height advantage?

1 km = 0.6 miles...Most everyone seems to set their convergence at 800 meters which is 0.5 miles...You are well within anyone's range who has 12.7mm or larger weapons...They only have to climb 0.1 miles to start killing you...It is not an AB thing, it simply climbing 0.1 miles to get you into their range...

[ChaoticNeutral 129]

1 km = 0.6 miles...Most everyone seems to set their convergence at 800 meters which is 0.5 miles...You are well within anyone's range who has 12.7mm or larger weapons...They only have to climb 0.1 miles to start killing you...It is not an AB thing, it simply climbing 0.1 miles to get you into their range...

 

No, at that distance, I can dodge them easily. I'm good at not being hit.

 

They get on my tail within 400 meters and kill me there.

[Nope 10,634]

No, at that distance, I can dodge them easily. I'm good at not being hit.

 

They get on my tail within 400 meters and kill me there.

 

However, energy retention is significantly better in arcade, thus meaning that exaggerating your altitude advantage is a must. If you're safe at x relative altitude in RB, you will be screwed at that relative altitude in AB.

[Boban_Rajovic 2,179]

~1 km altitude advantage is nothing unless the enemy is near-stall speed. He has his speed, which he translates to the altitude. If both of you were going, lets say, 450 km/h and you had the 1km altitude advantage, he can still get on your six, granted he'll have much lower traveling speed than you do and he won't be on your six (firing position) for long. He'll also point his nose to your future position by anticipating it following your movement, essentially making a shortcut.

 

It's doable in RB too, but on a lower scale.

 

So yeah, you should be worried about it, because you've made a mistake.

[VermWinterborn 619]

I absolutly LOVE when bombers go after other bombers.... >.> That happens to me alot. Like... fuck off, go bomb something lol

[Belicia 4,837]

I've had near-miss head-ons where the enemy plane has rushed past me in a dive while I'm flying directly away from them in a slight decline and, somehow, miraculously, they've turned and had me in their sights at a range of 0.40kms just a few seconds later.

 

I realise there's a lot of energy management at work here, but, turning-on-a-dime during a high-speed dive.... that's just broken.

[Scout99 81]

ChaoticNeutral,

 

I think you just described an Immelmann maneuver.  Depending on the aircraft turn radius and entry speed, the Immelmann maneuver allows a lower altitude aircraft to pull up in a half-loop, execute a half-roll, and be moving 180 degrees in the opposite direction, now at a higher altitude.  Yes, they trade speed for that new altitude.  Timed correctly, starting the turn even before you pass over them, they could end up 10 feet behind you and a 100 kph slower, but you will still have to move a kilometer away from them in relative speed difference.  If the relative difference in speed remained at 100 kph, or 100 k/60 minutes, that would mean about 36 seconds before you move to a separation of 1 kilometer.  36 seconds is a long time shooting at your rudder.

 

Several people have offered solutions, but I would think that the moment he starts up, you would start down, potentially in a split-s.  That means you would do the half-roll first, then pull back on the rudder until you were facing the opposite direction of your original flight and end up below him, going in the opposite direction and 100 kph faster (speed guess).  Even if he decides to do a split-s too, he will be starting his at 100 kph slower than you were when you began your split-s.  In the meantime, you extend away from him at high speed.

 

It doesn't have to be a head-on, but it has the potential to become real quick, so you might make that just a little bit less than a half-roll and then you won't be lined up directly with his flight path.  Practice the maneuver in the test flight zone without enemies around and see how much altitude you need with your favorite aircraft to do a split-s and not smear it into the deck.

 

Personally, I tend to panic when I see them bring their nose up and tracers starting on me and my split-s look more like a squiggle when the action is hot.  I feel sorry for the real pilots who had to learn these lessons, the first time, as their last time.  

 

[Franigo 2,253]

Players misjudge energy all the time. Granted, it can be quite difficult.

You climbed more than your opponent, so you have more energy stored in your altitude. But they, having climbed less, are probably faster. They convert that speed into altitude and are thus able to target you.

Lots of players also climb in less efficient ways. This could also be an issue.

[TheMysteriousStr 163]

Make the difference 2 km, look at them stalling, THEN dive on 'm. Glorious dakka dakka.

[Jabbathehutt 7]

I'd say do a slow climb up if you see them comming and then dive on them when they stall.  There are some crazy things that can be done in arcade but just get used to it and learn to counter it instead of complaining.

[SHID_MY_JORTS 1,863]

a kilometer below.

 

1 km is not a lot. You can easily climb that distance. He only needs to climb atleast 0.2 to actually start firing. When he climbs another 0.4 you are probably dead ( then is is approx. 0.4km away from you). Which is a pretty easy shot. 

[HochgeborenKlown 1,276]

No, at that distance, I can dodge them easily. I'm good at not being hit.

 

They get on my tail within 400 meters and kill me there.

I use stealth ammo exclusively...By the time you realize I am firing on you, you are either critted or dead..

[Badballie 1,219]

LOL - Boosted flight models means a plane flying straight and level can build up enough speed/energy to climb vertically for anything up to 2 Km before  stalling, come on people, this is ARCADE, learn the laws of physics that apply to this "world" and use them.

[GTL_Pizzaman 60]

The question is, if you are 1km above him, and he is in a similar or less level plane, why didn't you DIVE DOWN on him to make a BnZ?

 

That is the weird stuff. For sure, if I were the one flying lower, I'd get at your tail, before you get on mine.

Flying 1 km over a red plane... is just ASKING FOR IT. :salute:

[Ssijmisake 728]

With long ( 800+) convergance or whatever you spell it, I could took you down even WITHOU climbing for you my dear OP. 1Km is nothing in world of AB.

[Dstar_Canteen 34]

I had a good dogfight with a P80 the other day in my stock K4. I always had the energy advantage due to altitude but he always had speed on me. He pulled a good move managing to get under me and zoom climb before I could get the guns on him but for some unknown reason kept his climb going. I got around and zoom climbed after him and at 1.2km set him on fire with my 131's. Judging energy accurately is essential when engaging in dogfights at altitude and 1km is never enough seperation. If I don't have more then 2km I'm changing direction or may do a zoom climb myself to increase seperation.

[Pope_Shizzle 4,180]

In arcade energy retention and replenishment outweigh energy expenditure. This means that when some zoom climbs and then straightens out, they can regain energy faster than if they just climbed at 25 or 30 degrees the whole time.

[JA_37D 718]

I absolutly LOVE when bombers go after other bombers.... >.> That happens to me alot. Like... xxxx off, go bomb something lol

 

Yeah! I have been chased by them all, not just B-25s... I have seen fakking Wellingtons abort their bombing run (that is about to win it for the bad guys) and start chasing me in my bomber.. SM.79 is a classic that seems to love parking behind my .50 cal armed bombers.. because they have player controlled MG and for the lulz?

So why not grab a fighter? JFC..
 

[xoxSAUERKRAUTxox 410]

LOL - Boosted flight models means a plane flying straight and level can build up enough speed/energy to climb vertically for anything up to 2 Km before  stalling, come on people, this is ARCADE, learn the laws of physics that apply to this "world" and use them.

^ This.

 

Do you think that's air you're breathing?