Ki-100 is very OP

[LolaLolaLola 1,009]

1 hour ago, Khurt said:

"Snip"

 

Well Ki-100 is undertired and so are allied planes. Ki-100 would do more then fine at 4.0 / 4.3 BR.

Edited August 4, 2016 by LolaLolaLola

[Khurt 840]

1 hour ago, warrior412 said:

snip

 

i totally agree with you that there were/are some undertiered planes in the japanese tree. Some has been fixed. J2M2 has been fixed, A7M1 has been fixed.

This is not a reason to put a plane with inferior performance at higher br.

 

P51 with 4 hispano sits at 3.7. it is faster, climb better, has a decent turn at high speed and it's even better in dive than the ki-100. why should the ki-100 be 4.0 then? P38 lighting is is a way better plane in capable hands, and again, it stay at 3.7.

 

I'm perfectly aware that this plane will be uptiered at 4.7 probably, but not because it need that br. this plane has the same performance of a 3.3 plane. there's no reason to send it vs yak9p, i185, spitfire mk XVI that outperform this plane in every aspect, when ki-100 vs F4U/P51/p47 is a totally balanced fight. 

Edited August 4, 2016 by Khurt

[Wundsalz 574]

19 hours ago, Hiromachi said:

Which says a lot.

 

Point is that arcade is not focusing on realism and plenty of things behave unrealistically. You want proper test of what this aircraft can or cannot than give it a go in test flight at least with realistic settings. 

Why? I only care about its performance in AB.I don't give a xxxx about how ti performs in realistic and sim as I don't play those modes. 

 

While I think it's fairly irritating a plane introduced in 1945 is settled in Tier 2 I don't think its BR is way off. It's a really good plane, but its performance isn't anywhere near as ludicrous as the the Bf 109 F4, J2M2 and P47 which have got similar BRs.

[Markus752 3,354]

14 minutes ago, Khurt said:

 

i totally agree with you that there were/are some undertiered planes in the japanese tree. Some has been fixed. J2M2 has been fixed, A7M1 has been fixed.

This is not a reason to put a plane with inferior performance at higher br.

 

P51 with 4 hispano sits at 3.7. it is faster, climb better, has a decent turn at high speed and it's even better in dive than the ki-100. why should the ki-100 be 4.0 then? P38 lighting is is a way better plane in capable hands, and again, it stay at 3.7.

 

I'm perfectly aware that this plane will be uptiered at 4.7 probably, but not because it need that br. this plane has the same performance of a 3.3 plane. there's no reason to send it vs yak9p, i185, spitfire mk XVI that outperform this plane in every aspect, when ki-100 vs F4U/P51/p47 is a totally balanced fight. 

 

Spitfire LF MKIX are no problem with a Ki-100. Same goes for a average P-51D. Not even the P-38's are a problem. The P-47N might be but that jsut got added so who knows.

 

It can even fight Bearcats on quite even terms. 4.7-5.3 is the BR range I see it fit in.

 

 

[Khurt 840]

and an i-16 can kill jets. then i-16 deserve 8.0 at least.

 

every plane can kill another plane. it's not like tanks where if your gun can't penetrate enemy armor, you can't do anything.

 

and you can't say that ki-100 vs bearcats is a fair match, just because you can take advantage of enemy mistakes. A plane that has to rely on enemy mistakes to make kills is not a balanced plane.

Edited August 4, 2016 by Khurt

[Terriblours 308]

21 minutes ago, Markus752 said:

It can even fight Bearcats on quite even terms. 4.7-5.3 is the BR range I see it fit in.

It certainly can fight at 4.7-5.3 range but an average player will only grab the crumbles of what the better planes (ki-84, J2M and N1K1) leave for it. Else it'll be outperformed in every aspect like the Ki-61 tei, hei and 2.

 

You only have a good dive speed and turn rate but you won't be able to use those if the enemy is above you because of a better climb rate and have a much better speed than you do (all 4.0-5.0 planes).

 

So i do think 4.0 BR would be a nice start for the ki-100 before sky-rocketing it to 5.0-5.3.

[Markus752 3,354]

19 minutes ago, Khurt said:

and an i-16 can kill jets. then i-16 deserve 8.0 at least.

 

every plane can kill another plane. it's not like tanks where if your gun can't penetrate enemy armor, you can't do anything.

 

and you can't say that ki-100 vs bearcats is a fair match, just because you can take advantage of enemy mistakes. A plane that has to rely on enemy mistakes to make kills is not a balanced plane.

 

So a Zero is a bad plane? Its almost excusively played at the mistakes of the enemy. And I didn't say the Ki-100 can kill those planes but that they are NO PROBLEM at all for it.

 

And I didn't say the F8F vs Ki-100 is a fair match up either. I just said it can fight them on even terms. All depending on the skill of both players.

[PainGod85 8,050]

1 hour ago, warrior412 said:

 

I tend to be quite outspoken on Allied aircraft as well, though I think it gets drowned out by the sheer obviousness of the needs for uptiering among some of them:

• I'd like to see the P-47D nudged up because it can handle such a nudge quite easily. 4.3 is not a bridge too far and (with settings that it should have) neither would 4.7.
• The P-51Ds need serious bumping immediately because they are wreaking havoc upon 3.3+ aircraft (the Japanese have suffered considerably with this), especially since the Tier restrictions in MM have been abolished. The P-51D-5 has absolutely no reason to be at 4.3. None at all.
• The P-63s are in a similar boat and could survive hikes

There are plenty of others and these aren't half of the planes that I would address in regards to undertiered Allied aircraft, but it is late and this is not a thread meant for that. I do care about fairness in tiering and that's why I oppose the presence of the Ki-100 at 3.0.

 

As long as there are Griffons at 5.3, I would suggest the P-47Ds with their current power settings stay below a BR that would enable the two to meet. At their 2550 hp or somesuch setting that most, if not all of the bubbletops were running, even 4.7 would be appropriate.

 

But please, add the P-47N weighed down with so much fuel it barely climbs any better than the current Ds, just so more morons with no idea how to fly it pay for the M, then use it to strafe ground targets.

 

The P-63C is a better 4.7 match than the P-51D-30. Hell, having these two switch places would actually be less unbalanced than it is now. At least the 63 can energy trap G-2s at 6-7 km without needing obscene amounts of separation.

 

(Of course, the gun is such bad, much terrible, very hard to use I keep wondering how I've been able to maintain my k/d of around 5:1 in it.)

[Khurt 840]

1 hour ago, Markus752 said:

 

So a Zero is a bad plane? Its almost excusively played at the mistakes of the enemy. And I didn't say the Ki-100 can kill those planes but that they are NO PROBLEM at all for it.

 

And I didn't say the F8F vs Ki-100 is a fair match up either. I just said it can fight them on even terms. All depending on the skill of both players.

 

yes, it is, compared to planes it has to face.

Speed is not everything, but the ability to engage and disengage at will, is not something you can renounce without consequences.

Planes that cannot take initiative start with a big disadvantage.

 

If you think that a ki-61-I can fight at the same level with a f8f, then probably you never meet a good f8f player (which is not that impossible).

[Markus752 3,354]

2 minutes ago, Khurt said:

 

yes, it is, compared to planes it has to face.

Speed is not everything, but the ability to engage and disengage at will, is not something you can renounce without consequences.

Planes that cannot take initiative start with a big disadvantage.

 

If you think that a ki-61-I can fight at the same level with a f8f, then probably you never meet a good f8f player (which is not that impossible).

 

I am not talking about the Ki-61 but the Ki-100. There are some difference4s.

[Warpig_ 5,473]

After spading the Ki-100, I think 3.7 would be a good spot for it.

Edited August 4, 2016 by Warpig_

[Dodo_Dud 5,074]

If the ki-100 is OP, then most 109s are too.

[blakeob 8,086]

9 hours ago, Silavite said:

I'll admit that the Ki-100 is a great plane, but I fail to see the logic of putting it at 5.0.

Ki-100

  Reveal hidden contents

P-38J (4.0 in RB)

  Reveal hidden contents

At 5.0, the Ki-100 would simply be outclassed, in spite of its maneuvering advantage. It would be akin to the A6M5.

Maybe if it didn't have that shockingly bad roll rate and the engine didn't die at high alt like it does in game (its 30 km/h too slow at 10km, though no one fights there). Also, unless this is terribly inaccurate (which I doubt) then it should still be doing a bit over 600 km/h, even at 7km. Not like IG where it does 575.

[tovarisch_ivan 87]

7 hours ago, Terriblours said:

With its current performance the ki-100 can be at 4.0, it wouldn't be able to club 2.0 planes anymore and the only thing to fear will be a good P-51D-30 player (even Spits f mk.9 are nothing to be afraid of)

ERM? They turn better, are faster, climb better and you only have better guns.

Should go to 3.3, it is quite fast for its br, but all stuff at its br out turn it.

(I don't have it, I'm going off facing it and winning turn fights with it.) 

Edited August 4, 2016 by chickenispro

[warrior412 14,723]

2 minutes ago, chickenispro said:

ERM? They turn better, are faster, climb better and you only have better guns.

Should go to 3.3, it is quite fast for its br, but all stuff at its br out turn it.

(I don't have it, I'm going off facing it and winning turn fights with it.) 

 

The Ki-100 is a decent turner but one of its key strengths is that it simply doesn't have to turn in the engagement if it does not wish to--it can dictate the terms of the engagement.

 

The deaths of a few people who handled their aircraft foolishly against better turning opponents should not be the cause for a low BR. On the basis of that rationale, we'd have the I-153 ranked higher than the P-51D because the Chaika can turn better.

[Khurt 840]

3 hours ago, Markus752 said:

 

I am not talking about the Ki-61 but the Ki-100. There are some difference4s.

oh yes, big differences... the ki 100 is just a bit more agile.

all ki 61 and ki 100 share the same frame.

ki 61 I ko, otsu, hei and tei share the same engine, and that's why the heavier the armament becomes, the slower the plane goes.

Ki 61 II use a more powerfull engine, and it's pretty faster.

ki 100 use a bit more powerfull engine than the base version, but at the cost of an increased drag profile, making the plane a bit more agile, but not increasing the top speed (indeed decreasing it at certain altitudes).

 

NONE of those planes can deal with an F8F in EVERY aspect. stop saying it is a fair match. It is not. How can it be when the f8f has almost 1000hp more and a more advanced design? No one care if YOU can kill it with ease. this is not an objective data.

 

ki 61 II is less powerfull than ki-84 and should NOT be at higher BR. it can sit confortably at 4.0 (p38J is 4.0 and is more powerfull).

ki 100 is less powerfull in every aspect than the ki 61 II, and is a bit less powerfull than the p51 with 4 hispano ==>ki 100 is a 3.3 plane.

[FursuitKnitter911 2,122]

8 hours ago, LolaLolaLola said:

 

Can you also explain more why 4.7 is the most reasonable BR? Would like to know since you advocate higher BR for axis planes on this forum 24/7.

4.7 when it gets it historical performance, As of now it's more of a 4.0-4.3 plane. Please show me an example of when i supposedly "Advocate the uptier of axis planes 24/7" Because if you actually payed attention to my posts, You'd see that I'm a strong advocate for the uptiers of undertiered allied aircraft, (such as the P47 and P51D30) As opposed to you and your unwillingness to except ever that any Japanese aircraft have been or are clubbing. As far as i can tell i can't even be on 24/7, I have a life you know.

[bellezza03 6,007]

5 hours ago, Markus752 said:

 

Spitfire LF MKIX are no problem with a Ki-100. Same goes for a average P-51D. Not even the P-38's are a problem. The P-47N might be but that jsut got added so who knows.

 

It can even fight Bearcats on quite even terms. 4.7-5.3 is the BR range I see it fit in.

 

 

spitifire LFMK9 is more than a match for a ki-100.... putting at 5.3 it's just no sense. FW190A8 sits at 5.0 and can do everything much better than a KI100 aside turning... and don't forget griffon engine spits... seriusly.. this plane can barely do 540 km/h on deck and 605 at altidute... do you want this against bearcat and griffon engine spits that if have at least the 1/1000000 skill of a normal player can do whatever he wants.... Ki100 should be maximum 4.0... maximum..

[FursuitKnitter911 2,122]

While it is definitely undertiered, Putting it at 5.0-5.3 is just madness. There is no reason for it to be fighting Griffion spits and Bearcats. 

[Hiromachi 8,004]

I doubt it will be any more clubbing than N1K1-J or J2M2. It's nice aircraft but really mediocre, despite some people sensation. 

[Terriblours 308]

56 minutes ago, Khurt said:

ki 61 I ko, otsu, hei and tei share the same engine, and that's why the heavier the armament becomes, the slower the plane goes.

Khurt, the ki-61 hei is actually lighter than the otsu even if it has bigger guns, 800 12.7 rounds weight more than 300 20, thats why the hei have a slight increase in speed.

 

1 hour ago, chickenispro said:

ERM? They turn better, are faster, climb better and you only have better guns.

Should go to 3.3, it is quite fast for its br, but all stuff at its br out turn it.

(I don't have it, I'm going off facing it and winning turn fights with it.) 

Are you confusing the F mk.9 with the LF mk.9 ? First the F mk.9 turn worse than the LF mk.9 but is also a worse climb rate. Also i already engaged in turnfights against F mk.9 and won, that probably because they didn't knew how to play but still, the Ki-100 can handle F mk.9 with ease.

[bellezza03 6,007]

ahahahahahahha..... ki100 handle a F mk9.... wait... if that spit decided to not turn and run? You would be kaput

[warrior412 14,723]

1 hour ago, bellezza03 said:

ahahahahahahha..... ki100 handle a F mk9.... wait... if that spit decided to not turn and run? You would be kaput

 

I encountered many Spitfire Mk. IXs in my Ki-100 (and as a teammate for other Ki-100s); while inexperience might have been a factor the Ki-100s did not have much trouble with the Spitfire Mk. IXs. (Spitfire Mk. IIbs and Vbs were mere chew toys).

[Markus752 3,354]

1 hour ago, bellezza03 said:

ahahahahahahha..... ki100 handle a F mk9.... wait... if that spit decided to not turn and run? You would be kaput

 

A Spitfire F MK IX isn't even that much faster at SL and only get a speed advantage above 4km. The Ki-100 also dives much better and got a better energy retention.

[fufubear 6,705]

1 hour ago, bellezza03 said:

ahahahahahahha..... ki100 handle a F mk9.... wait... if that spit decided to not turn and run? You would be kaput

If I could do it in the ki 61 hei I'm sure the ki 100 could handle them too.