aircraft/loadouts Bf 109 G-8 - Shooting Your Enemies In More Ways Than One

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

Okay, so I was bored and I figured I may as well make another suggestion, something "short and sweet".  Note that if this has been suggested previously, it wasn't listed as such.

 

So anyways, you may be asking 'what's a Bf 109 G-8?'  Simply put, it's a late model Bf 109 G-6 that entered service in November, 1943, with either the machine guns or cannon removed (for the sake of not making this thing totally useless, we'll assume this one's keeping the cannon - a single MG 151/20 with 200 rounds isn't all that bad if you're a good shot) and with a bunch of cameras installed in it for the armed recon role, said cameras consisting of either an RB 32/7 (though one source claims it was an RB 50/30) or two RB 12.7/7x9s mounted obliquely in the lower fuselage just aft of the cockpit (with a slightly strengthened rear fuselage to accomodate them) and a Robot II in the left wing that was aimed using the plane's gunsight and fired via the trigger normally used to fire the MGs on the base G-6 (later G-8s omitted this camera).  167 G-8s and 739 G-8/R-5s (the only difference between these being the radio) were delivered between November 1943 and the end of the following year, so while not the most produced Bf 109, over 900 units in total isn't that bad.

 

An illustration of the fuselage camera's installation (presumably with the RB 32/7) is provided below:

 

Performance-wise, it'd likely be pretty similar to a late model G-6, as while it is lighter due to the deletion of the MG 131s, the cameras and reinforcements to the rear fuselage do add a little bit of weight back.  Its BR could be the same as the G-6 or perhaps slightly higher (as it's based on a late G-6).  It could also either be in a tab with the G-6 or be added as a premium for people who want a rank 4 premium with a low-ish BR (compared to most of the existing ones Germany has) and with a more affordable price tag than...say, the Do 335 B-2 or the captured Tempest if they don't find the He 219 to be to their liking.

 

Performance

Admittedly mostly redundant seeing as this is modified from a plane that's already in the game, but it's here nonetheless.  Most of these specs (courtesy of wikipedia) are for the G-6 that this plane is based on, save for the armament which I've edited appropriately for this suggestion:

General characteristics

• Crew: One
• Length: 8.95 m (29 ft 7 in)
• Wingspan: 9.925 m (32 ft 6 in)
• Height: 2.60 m (8 ft 2 in)
• Wing area: 16.05 m² (173.3 ft²)
• Empty weight: 2,247 kg (5,893 lb)
• Loaded weight: 3,148 kg (6,940 lb)
• Max. takeoff weight: 3,400 kg (7,495 lb)
• Powerplant: 1 × Daimler-Benz DB 605A-1 liquid-cooled inverted V12, 1,475 PS (1,455 hp, 1,085 kW)
• Propellers: VDM 9-12087 three-bladed light-alloy propeller
  • Propeller diameter: 3 m (9 ft 10 in)

Performance

• Maximum speed: 640 km/h (398 mph) at 6,300 m (20,669 ft)
• Cruise speed: 590 km/h (365 mph) at 6,000 m (19,680 ft)
• Range: 850 km (528 mi) 1,000 km (621 mi) with droptank
• Service ceiling: 12,000 m (39,370 ft)
• Rate of climb: 17.0 m/s (3,345 ft/min)
• Wing loading: 196 kg/m² (40 lb/ft²)
• Power/mass: 344 W/kg (0.21 hp/lb)

Armament

• Guns:

1 × 20 mm (.78 in) MG 151/20 cannon as centerline Motorkanone with 200 rpg.

 

• Other:

1 x ETC 500 IX b bomb (R1 kit) or 2 x MG 151/20 gunpods (R6 kit)

 

So in a nutshell, what you'd get here is a lighter Bf 109 G-6 without the MG 131s or the ability to utilize MK 108s in exchange for non-functional cameras and slightly improved performance.  In the right hands, it could be slightly superior to the baseline G-6 in some roles, but it won't have the option to mount 30 mm cannons.  For people who prefer to fly the G-6 with 20 mm cannons though, it might as well be a straight upgrade.

 

Before anyone questions adding a recon variant of an existing plane, remember that there's already recon variants of the Spitfire in-game...and yes, the title of this thread was a joke about shooting photographs.

 

As for skins...well, it's honestly kind-of difficult to find images that are definitely of a G-8, and even harder to find one in color (not counting references for modelers and profile drawings made after the fact), but at the very least, the G-8 was operated not only by the Luftwaffe, but also the Romanian, Hungarian, and Finnish Air Forces according to Wikipedia, so those could also be present as options (the last of which with unhistorical post-war markings to abide by certain laws, of course).

 

Sources:

http://www.historyofwar.org/articles/weapons_bf_109G.html

The Great Book of World War II Airplanes (1984 Edition) - relevant section written by Robert Grinsell

https://books.google.com/books?id=KzMqDwAAQBAJ&pg=PT79&lpg=PT79&dq=Bf+109+G-8&source=bl&ots=AKBx25EOwX&sig=TeYGMRrouNTDCPQ7MiLiUtH3fvM&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi8v-WsvPPWAhUF02MKHTYPB7k4ChDoAQg3MAM#v=onepage&q=Bf 109 G-8&f=false

 

EDIT: Found another source with more information.  Turns out, it COULD carry ordinance or gunpods, and could also have a GM-1 or MW-50 boost fitted to it (as seen in the U2 and U3 field modifications).

 

Edited March 2, 2019 by Z3r0_

[blakeob 8,086]

Open for discussion. 

More sources would be nice.

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

2 minutes ago, blakeob said:

Open for discussion. 

More sources would be nice.

 

I've already added three, which was more than the mandated minimum, but I'll see what I can dig up.  The problem with this variant is that, as it's not technically a FIGHTER variant, most sources barely make a footnote about it beyond stating that it was a G-6 modification and that it was made for armed recon.  The third source I added was the most detailed description I've seen on the G-8 so far, but if I find more, I'll be sure to add them.

Edited October 15, 2017 by Z3r0_

[CherryBlossom 4,210]

Sure. 

[ZapGun 20]

A 109 that made pictures...

Yes please! 

 

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

26 minutes ago, ZapGun said:

A 109 that made pictures...

Yes please! 

 

 

I'm actually tempted to suggest adding a gimmick feature where you could take screenshots of whatever's directly below your plane with this thing, complete with a grainy black and white filter over it.  Maybe you'd get a small point bonus if an enemy unit's in the picture (albeit you'd have a finite amount of film to use). 

 

Maybe that can come later as its own thread to apply to all recon fighters - could make a good April Fools thread.

Edited October 15, 2017 by Z3r0_

[_EQUAI_ 356]

Another 109 for the tree gets a yes from me. 

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

I guess I shouldn't be all that surprised about the fairly limited interest in this so far (what with only 11 votes in the poll in total).  Maybe I should put a link in my signature.

 

Anyways, I forgot to mention earlier that there could possibly be some alternate skins for this thing based on the livery of other air forces that imported G-8s (namely Romania, Hungary, and Finland).  The only hard part is actually finding a picture of a G-8 in that livery (finding pictures of a G-8 at all are difficult, at least where you can be sure it's a G-8 - most of the pictures are probably of G-6s)

Edited October 16, 2017 by Z3r0_

[Borotovas 4,500]

I support this vehicle.

[Nell_Lucifer 927]

Sure +1

[Admiral_Aruon 2,264]

i can always go for another Bf 109.

[*Deprimo 159]

Bring it! I love my KODAK

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

Kind-of surprised anybody else remembers that this thread exists considering how quickly the initial discussion died off.

[Kempston 342]

I like the looks of this, I think it would be suited more to the premium tree however as it is more of a niche variant but still, I like it!  

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

13 minutes ago, Kempston said:

I like the looks of this, I think it would be suited more to the premium tree however as it is more of a niche variant but still, I like it!  

 

That's one possibility that I have in mind.  The German air tree's regularly available rank 4 premium lineup consists of an overpriced captured single-engined fighter, another single-engined fighter that has to be bought outside of the client (so no golden wagers or tournament wins to grind out the GE for you), a bomber, and two heavy fighters.  The idea behind this is to give German players a cheaper alternative to something like the Tempest or the Fw 190D-13 if they prefer single-engined fighters, or simply prefer the 109s' playstyle to the alternatives.

Edited March 2, 2019 by Z3r0_

[Milocat 4,854]

Wouldn't be the worst addition.  +1.  Why not?

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

Figured I could revive discussion on this aircraft as there's a possibility to include it on the Swedish tree (with Finnish markings) as well.  See this thread for details: https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/482464-finnish-fighter-tree-in-swedish-aviation-tree/

[Zombificus 792]

This would be very nice to have, although perhaps not the most necessary addition to the research tree. Germany already has a lot of tree Bf 109s and this wasn't primarily a combat aircraft (although it could still fight), so I think it would feel right at home as a premium plane. The fact that it is, as you say, something of a straight upgrade for players who like to fly with 20mms would make it enticing, while its photorecon role and rather limited base armament would set it apart from most other 109s. It has that perfect premium combination of advantage, disadvantage and unusual nature compared to its tree counterparts, so I'd love to see it (especially since for actual home-grown premium fighters, German Tier IV has pretty slim pickings right now). 

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

On 26/04/2020 at 19:12, Zombificus said:

This would be very nice to have, although perhaps not the most necessary addition to the research tree. Germany already has a lot of tree Bf 109s and this wasn't primarily a combat aircraft (although it could still fight), so I think it would feel right at home as a premium plane. The fact that it is, as you say, something of a straight upgrade for players who like to fly with 20mms would make it enticing, while its photorecon role and rather limited base armament would set it apart from most other 109s. It has that perfect premium combination of advantage, disadvantage and unusual nature compared to its tree counterparts, so I'd love to see it (especially since for actual home-grown premium fighters, German Tier IV has pretty slim pickings right now). 

 

The other disadvantage is there wouldn't be an option to mount MK 108s on this at all, so for people who like the sheer "derpage" of the 30 mm cannon, they'll have to use the G-6 instead.  This isn't an issue most of the time, but you might wish you had 30 mms if you find yourself having to chase down a B-17 or Pe-8 that's up in space towards the end of a match.

Edited April 28, 2020 by Z3r0_

[Gahlok12 457]

On 15/10/2017 at 17:02, Z3r0_ said:

 

I'm actually tempted to suggest adding a gimmick feature where you could take screenshots of whatever's directly below your plane with this thing, complete with a grainy black and white filter over it.  Maybe you'd get a small point bonus if an enemy unit's in the picture (albeit you'd have a finite amount of film to use). 

 

Maybe that can come later as its own thread to apply to all recon fighters - could make a good April Fools thread.

I would love to see photo recon as a standard option in the game

[Z3r0_ 4,128]

5 hours ago, Gahlok12 said:

I would love to see photo recon as a standard option in the game

 

Indeed, though the question would be what it'd do.

There's the option of having it give you more points, a useless but fun feature.  Another option would be one exclusive to ground and naval forces: when you snap a picture, any enemy units in the 'frame' of the hypothetical image have their locations revealed and markers on the map.  Of course these markers don't move WITH the enemy and they'd fade after a little bit, but if the enemy doesn't move it can lead to them getting artied by your ground/naval forces.  Could be useful for flushing enemies out of known camping spots on certain maps.

Edited May 31, 2020 by Z3r0_

[Yeetus__Deletus 4]

+1