ground vehicles T26/Sherman or M4A3 90

[Grand_Moff_Tano 3,460]

During 1944 a project, undertaken by Chrysler, involved putting a T26 turret onto the hull of an M4A3 Sherman in order to give Tankers a better weapon against German Armor. The project however was scrapped as it was believe to have slowed the production of the T26E1 and when these came into service would make the M4 Hybrid pointless with only 1 example built.

 

Such a vehicle would be a good stop gap between the Sherman and Pershing line once it comes out or as a US Premium Medium Tank at Tier 3.

 

 

Edited March 5, 2018 by VengefulChipmunk

[leroyonly 4,310]

even though we don't know anything about the US tank tree yet, looks interesting. open for discussion

[Grand_Moff_Tano 3,460]

even though we don't know anything about the US tank tree yet, looks interesting. open for discussion

Not knowing is what makes suggestions fun  :good:

[Montycz 17]

well....if this make it into game why not maus

[PeterLuk 731]

Turret looks so big on Sherman hull  :Ds But I am only for produced/in batlle used vehicles...

[Grand_Moff_Tano 3,460]

Turret looks so big on Sherman hull  :Ds But I am only for produced/in batlle used vehicles...

Good luck with T-34 Prototype and KingTiger 10.5cm, not to mention the Panther II.

Edited August 7, 2014 by PikachuTrainer

[PeterLuk 731]

I know. If there will be more of theese tanks, it will liek WOT... 

[Grand_Moff_Tano 3,460]

I know. If there will be more of theese tanks, it will liek WOT... 

Who cares if it's like WoT? At some point they will have to use Prototypes and blueprints to help balance the trees such as the US Heavy Line which is practically non-existent without these prototypes.

[PeterLuk 731]

Me. And lot of my friends. We just don´t want half of team in prototypes. There is lot of mass produced tanks to add into game first. 

[Grand_Moff_Tano 3,460]

Me. And lot of my friends. We just don´t want half of team in prototypes. There is lot of mass produced tanks to add into game first. 

Unless you wanted to fully balance each tree.

[Boceto 3,666]

Hm, did this even work? I mean, did the turret actually support that gun fully? The Brits even had issues with their Firefly, so I have some doubts this would IRL, and if it doesn't it shouldn't be added.

[Grand_Moff_Tano 3,460]

Hm, did this even work? I mean, did the turret actually support that gun fully? The Brits even had issues with their Firefly, so I have some doubts this would IRL, and if it doesn't it shouldn't be added.

It's not known whether it worked or not, don't think the prototype was tested, but the turret diameter was the same as the Pershings so it could have worked, albeit not as effectively.

[Lord_Tao 1,583]

I am not a research buff, but what I do know is that the 3 inch gun was too heavy to mount on a sherman, and was used on the m10 Wolverine instead.  The M10 needed a large counter weight on the back of the turret to balance out the gun.  Also the T1 and M6 heavy tank designs were constructed with the intention of having a platform to mount the 3inch gun.

 

Later many shermans were outfitted with 76mm guns.  Now the 3 inch is 76.2 mm, but it was developed completely separately from the 76mm.  Both guns do have very similar performance though.  Apparently shermans could be converted to mount the 76mm but not the 3 inch gun.  Why this is was never explained in anything I read.

 

Mounting a 90mm would be even worse.  At the very least the turret would have to have been completely redesigned as well as the turret ring and perhaps suspension.  The Germans tried to mount a panther turret and gun to the pz 4.  They tried, but scrapped the project because the chassis just could not handle the extra weight.  Essentially the pz4 chassis peaked out at 80mm of armour and the medium length 75mm.  I wouldn't be surprised if this serman project was scrapped for the same reason.

[KitCloudKicker 114]

The E2 Jumbo was the stop gap variant and with the 76mm should do pretty well.

I can't wait for that sucker and also along with the M36 Jackson and M18 Hellcat will be fun as heck.

[Helezhelm 10,626]

They only made one Sherman with 90mm and  it delayed the production of T26 aka Pershings in late '44 to '45... so I don't think it would work. 

maybe as premium? 

 

 

Sherman: A History of the American Medium Tank, by A.P Hunnicutt, page 567

 

Here's more information about 90mm Sherman if you want to:

 

 

 

Sherman: A History of the American Medium Tank, by A.P Hunnicutt, page 212-213

Edited August 8, 2014 by Helezhelm

[Grand_Moff_Tano 3,460]

I am not a research buff, but what I do know is that the 3 inch gun was too heavy to mount on a sherman, and was used on the m10 Wolverine instead.  The M10 needed a large counter weight on the back of the turret to balance out the gun.  Also the T1 and M6 heavy tank designs were constructed with the intention of having a platform to mount the 3inch gun.

 

Later many shermans were outfitted with 76mm guns.  Now the 3 inch is 76.2 mm, but it was developed completely separately from the 76mm.  Both guns do have very similar performance though.  Apparently shermans could be converted to mount the 76mm but not the 3 inch gun.  Why this is was never explained in anything I read.

 

Mounting a 90mm would be even worse.  At the very least the turret would have to have been completely redesigned as well as the turret ring and perhaps suspension.  The Germans tried to mount a panther turret and gun to the pz 4.  They tried, but scrapped the project because the chassis just could not handle the extra weight.  Essentially the pz4 chassis peaked out at 80mm of armour and the medium length 75mm.  I wouldn't be surprised if this serman project was scrapped for the same reason.

If this is true then it would mainly be down to the Turret, not the tank itself as the turret was designed to mount a 75mm gun. Also it wouldn't be possible for the M-50/1 Super Sherman to have existed.

Edited August 8, 2014 by PikachuTrainer

[FeeTFooD 87]

Who cares if it's like WoT? At some point they will have to use Prototypes and blueprints to help balance the trees such as the US Heavy Line which is practically non-existent without these prototypes.

The M26 was originally classed as a heavy tank, and only received a medium classification post WW2. The US designated tanks according to their guns, light @ 76mm, medium @ 90mm and heavy at 120mm.

Gaijin could easily use the M26 with the 90mm M3, and the T26E3 (sans applique armour) as the next tier up. A small number of T26 were upgraded to the T15E1 cannon.

 

I am currently off my face on pain medication, so if this post makes no sense, I am the fellow on the right

[_Katyusha_ 1,829]

Looking at this vehicle, and then comparing it with the "Super Sherman" I find myself wondering if perhaps Israel didn't get their idea from somewhere....

[arczer25 5,202]

I am not a research buff, but what I do know is that the 3 inch gun was too heavy to mount on a sherman, and was used on the m10 Wolverine instead.  The M10 needed a large counter weight on the back of the turret to balance out the gun.  Also the T1 and M6 heavy tank designs were constructed with the intention of having a platform to mount the 3inch gun.

 

Later many shermans were outfitted with 76mm guns.  Now the 3 inch is 76.2 mm, but it was developed completely separately from the 76mm.  Both guns do have very similar performance though.  Apparently shermans could be converted to mount the 76mm but not the 3 inch gun.  Why this is was never explained in anything I read.

 

Mounting a 90mm would be even worse.  At the very least the turret would have to have been completely redesigned as well as the turret ring and perhaps suspension.  The Germans tried to mount a panther turret and gun to the pz 4.  They tried, but scrapped the project because the chassis just could not handle the extra weight.  Essentially the pz4 chassis peaked out at 80mm of armour and the medium length 75mm.  I wouldn't be surprised if this serman project was scrapped for the same reason.

3inch was bigger and heavier than 76mm M1A1, 76mm M1 could be fitted in Sherman from October 1942 and later post 1945 most 75mm Sherman were fitted with 76mm guns without changing turret and also didn't had any problems

[sharedmedia=core:attachments:168015]

 

about 90mm gun actually there was M36B1 and it didn't had any problems, M10A1 hull on with M36 was build had more problems (to high weight center).

M4 was very universal hull capable of many configurations

Edited April 9, 2016 by arczer25

[Whelmy 1,970]

More then one example was built, they had a M4A3E8 with a T26 turret that they tested

 

"In order to gain information as to the performance of the E8 suspension, a 2,000 mile test has been satisfactorily run on an M4A3 hull with E8 suspension, carrying a T26 type turret mounting the 90mm gun. The all-in weight of this trail vehicle was 102,000 lbs."

[StahlJaeger117 73]

yes. Re-searchable

[ganJ 2,692]

No  potato thrower?? Sherman with a gun ?? sure, why not ;)

[Results45 2,200]

Found more photos:

Edited April 19, 2017 by Results45

[Sirchby 3,711]

4 hours ago, Results45 said:

Found more photos:

 

This is M36 & M36B1 Jackson.

 

Quote

 

This is a very preliminary design for M4 tank with D50878 turret.

Not exactly a good performing tank compared to M4A3 with T26 turret which is more spacial.

 

On 8/8/2014 at 8:12 AM, Lord_Tao said:

Later many shermans were outfitted with 76mm guns.  Now the 3 inch is 76.2 mm, but it was developed completely separately from the 76mm.  Both guns do have very similar performance though.  Apparently shermans could be converted to mount the 76mm but not the 3 inch gun.  Why this is was never explained in anything I read.

 

Mounting a 90mm would be even worse.  At the very least the turret would have to have been completely redesigned as well as the turret ring and perhaps suspension.  The Germans tried to mount a panther turret and gun to the pz 4.  They tried, but scrapped the project because the chassis just could not handle the extra weight.  Essentially the pz4 chassis peaked out at 80mm of armour and the medium length 75mm.  I wouldn't be surprised if this serman project was scrapped for the same reason.

 

Most American tanks applied 69" turret ring during WWII.

Means you can switch M4 / M6 / M26 turret interchangeably.

 

It was a successful test, whatsoever.

In fact, this project continued up to installing M6 tank with T26 turret.

 

 

 

+1

Definitely a good substitute to T25 but lighter & faster.

@Whelmy might have a photograph of M4A3(90)W HVSS during trials.

Edited April 19, 2017 by Sirchby
+1 for M4A3(90)W

[Admiral_Aruon 2,264]

oh wow where has this been all this time? the US could FINALLY have a true 5.7 BR sherman! +1