I kindly underestimate Type 90 somewhat?

[kyoumu 35]

It is good because the armor thickness of Type 90 is good for balancing up to now, but if you really get T-80U, M1A2 etc etc, instead of implementing Type 10, the armor thickness of the 90 type is also chronologically with the T-80U etc etc Since it is in the same period, it should not be underestimated or prejudiced from Japan so that armor thickness should be matched. It is often said that armor of Type 90 is made of special bulletproof steel with ceramic of honeycomb structure sandwiched between them so it is nice to have it put in a little corner of the head. Personally I think that there is at least KE 600 mm, CE 900 - 1000.

Another additional type, armor of Type 90 destroy bullets while catching it, so it seems that the real thickness is thick.

Edited November 13, 2018 by kyoumu

[kstoff 508]

I very much doubt that Type 90 armor consist of any different material than other contemporary NATO tanks. Its armor protection overall may be even worse, as it was weight-limited design. Also the primary problem of Japanese tree is that Type 90 is the only top BR tank. The Japanese lineup is lacking and this is unlikely to change even with the possible addition of Type 10.

[sobawasab@psn 700]

18 minutes ago, kstoff said:

I very much doubt that Type 90 armor consist of any different material than other contemporary NATO tanks. Its armor protection overall may be even worse, as it was weight-limited design. Also the primary problem of Japanese tree is that Type 90 is the only top BR tank. The Japanese lineup is lacking and this is unlikely to change even with the possible addition of Type 10.

Why is Japan premised that technology is behind Europe?

I do not know the actual spec, but I hate that idea．

Russian tanks are light but very hard.

Edited November 13, 2018 by *sobawasab

[kstoff 508]

9 minutes ago, *sobawasab said:

Why is Japan premised that technology is behind Europe?

I do not know the actual spec, but I hate that idea．

Russian tanks are light but very hard.

 

The technology is not. The weight of Type 90 is.

[WulfPack 1,693]

52 minutes ago, *sobawasab said:

Russian tanks are light but very hard.

That's due to their size.

[llSolitairell@psn 5,728]

4 hours ago, kstoff said:

I very much doubt that Type 90 armor consist of any different material than other contemporary NATO tanks. Its armor protection overall may be even worse, as it was weight-limited design. Also the primary problem of Japanese tree is that Type 90 is the only top BR tank. The Japanese lineup is lacking and this is unlikely to change even with the possible addition of Type 10.

 

Depends if gaijin received sekrit dokumints on Type 89 IFV and Type 16 MCV, another Type 74 with later Type 93 APFSDS developed in Japan wouldn't be too bad at top tier either.

They're pretty well off in regards to Helicopters as well

 

If there's a nation I worry for at Rank VI it's Britain.

 

4 hours ago, *sobawasab said:

Why is Japan premised that technology is behind Europe?

I do not know the actual spec, but I hate that idea．

 

Technology isn't behind Europe, Japanese engineers had to cope with stricter weight limitations.

[swpixy 1,220]

5 hours ago, *sobawasab said:

Why is Japan premised that technology is behind Europe?

I do not know the actual spec, but I hate that idea．

Russian tanks are light but very hard.

Not comparable,since they are also WAY smaller.To give you a rough idea:

 

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/5Kx18cpvHNM/hqdefault.jpg

 

http://www.closecombatseries.net/CCS/modules/Forums/files/111104181543_t72mm1a1_180.jpg

 

And its not just the frontal profile,the T-64/72/80s are also a bit shorter than their western counterparts.The turret armor layout is also somewhat more efficient (aside from the modules already being much smaller) because they don´t have a turret bustle that they need to protect.
https://dxczjjuegupb.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/word-image.png

 

Downsides to that are,ammunition stored center-mass in the vehicle and over a relatively large area and the need for relatively small crewmembers to operate them properly.

Also,the turretroof can be somewhat of a weakspot against APFSDS:

https://forum.warthunder.com/uploads/monthly_2018_05/a179660db1fcc.jpg.8c8fe59d97743d1c07b3d7c421708343.jpg

 

As is the area around the gun,due to the way its mounted (basically no mantlet).

Gundepression also kinda sucks compared to the western counterparts since they don´t have the space for that.

That said,neither of those were really problems for the russians and the way they intended to use these tanks.

And the upside is that they can use extremely dense armor modules (since the area covered is rather small),which in turn means higher LOS efficiency than on the western tanks,while keeping the weight relatively low-though the later models (i.e. T-72B and T-80U) went in to the mid-40 ton range aswell.

 

All of that considered,this is why some people are very sceptical about the Type 90´s supposedly amazing armor-The tank only weighs 50 tons,is roughly comparable to a Leopard 2 in size,with the exact same gun,but yet is somehow supposed to have armor performance comparable to tanks that are a good 12-13 tons heavier than it...While also simultaneously having ridiculously LOS efficient armor.

Problem with that being that generally,if LOS efficiency increases,weight efficiency decreases and vice versa.

 

 

Edited November 13, 2018 by swpixy

[Necrons31467 14,236]

6 hours ago, kyoumu said:

90 type is also chronologically with the T-80U etc etc Since it is in the same period,

 

Date of introduction isn't an accurate representation of protection or efficiency.

 

6 hours ago, kyoumu said:

Type 90 is made of special bulletproof steel

 

So... just steel then?

 

6 hours ago, kyoumu said:

with ceramic of honeycomb structure sandwiched between them

 

Source?

 

6 hours ago, kyoumu said:

Personally I think that there is at least KE 600 mm, CE 900 - 1000.

 

No offense, but we can't just go around changing the armour values because RandomForumUser #7915 says so.

 

[llSolitairell@psn 5,728]

7 minutes ago, Necrons31467 said:

 

No offense, but we can't just go around changing the armour values because RandomForumUser #7915 says so.

 

 

Why not

Just imagine what the Challenger 1 could become

[wulfalier 2,470]

1 hour ago, *RAazzy91 said:

 

Depends if gaijin received sekrit dokumints on Type 89 IFV and Type 16 MCV, another Type 74 with later Type 93 APFSDS developed in Japan wouldn't be too bad at top tier either.

They're pretty well off in regards to Helicopters as well

 

If there's a nation I worry for at Rank VI it's Britain.

 

 

Technology isn't behind Europe, Japanese engineers had to cope with stricter weight limitations.

So 87 is ok, Type 16 is for most people too "modern",another Type 74?Gj said no because they need complet documents about the changin on thermo vision or what is the big TV next to gun.

[llSolitairell@psn 5,728]

31 minutes ago, wulfalier said:

So 87 is ok, Type 16 is for most people too "modern",

 

Japan has always had some of the more modern tanks, I don't think Gaijin is too bothered about intro dates in regards to tanks and they said their intentions to add increasingly modern tanks.

31 minutes ago, wulfalier said:

another Type 74? Gj said no because they need complet documents about the changin on thermo vision or what is the big TV next to gun.

 

When someone asked whether Gaijin would add US cities as potential maps, they answered they wouldn't create fictional maps.

 

The American Desert devblog came 2 days later.

[Veðrfölnir 492]

On 13/11/2018 at 19:57, *RAazzy91 said:

I don't think Gaijin is too bothered about intro dates in regards to tanks and they said their intentions to add increasingly modern tanks.

There are rumors going on about the type-10 going to be added into either this update or next. Thats what I know about it.

 

Edited November 14, 2018 by Max_Ljunggren

[JuicyKuuuuki 486]

 

[Tantor57 10,318]

On ‎14‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 19:56, Max_Ljunggren said:

There are rumors going on about the type-10 going to be added into either this update or next. Thats what I know about it.

 

what is advertised as leaks is a simple wishlist that everyone went viral about. Next update is going to be about Italian tanks. Type 10 will never come into the game as there is 0... and I mean 0 RELIABLE and AVAILABLE information about that vehicle. It's an MBT that gotintroduced in 2012 FFS.

[ruby_red193 35]

 

5 minutes ago, Tantor57 said:

what is advertised as leaks is a simple wishlist that everyone went viral about. Next update is going to be about Italian tanks. Type 10 will never come into the game as there is 0... and I mean 0 RELIABLE and AVAILABLE information about that vehicle. It's an MBT that gotintroduced in 2012 FFS.

The use of helicopter tree AH-1Z is from 2010. So, I think that era is not a problem.
Also, if you say reliable information, Type 90 is the same.
It is possible to input data of another tank (Leo2A4c of leak list, etc.) into Type10 and implement it.
I think that the next update will be an Italian tank, but I think that Type10 will appear in Warthunder in the future.

[wulfalier 2,470]

1 hour ago, Tantor57 said:

what is advertised as leaks is a simple wishlist that everyone went viral about. Next update is going to be about Italian tanks. Type 10 will never come into the game as there is 0... and I mean 0 RELIABLE and AVAILABLE information about that vehicle. It's an MBT that gotintroduced in 2012 FFS.

I will save this and when the tank will come i will repost this to you ok .

Saying this kind of stupidity,this will not come,that will not come,because of this and that.......when some of you will just admin that GJ will do what they think is needed in game.

[Tantor57 10,318]

50 minutes ago, wulfalier said:

I will save this and when the tank will come i will repost this to you ok .

Saying this kind of stupidity,this will not come,that will not come,because of this and that.......when some of you will just admin that GJ will do what they think is needed in game.

Gaijin at least needs a strict minimum amount of information to model a tank. And im not even talking about complicated stuffs there... Even armored plates layout and arrangeme,t is not known about the Type 10 and gaijin needs that just to make a working 3D model.

 

1 hour ago, ruby_red193 said:

 

The use of helicopter tree AH-1Z is from 2010. So, I think that era is not a problem.
Also, if you say reliable information, Type 90 is the same.
It is possible to input data of another tank (Leo2A4c of leak list, etc.) into Type10 and implement it.
I think that the next update will be an Italian tank, but I think that Type10 will appear in Warthunder in the future.

That's not how coding datas in 3D models works... If it was that simple, that'd be great.

[wulfalier 2,470]

26 minutes ago, Tantor57 said:

Gaijin at least needs a strict minimum amount of information to model a tank. And im not even talking about complicated stuffs there... Even armored plates layout and arrangeme,t is not known about the Type 10 and gaijin needs that just to make a working 3D model.

 

That's not how coding datas in 3D models works... If it was that simple, that'd be great.

And do you know what they have about the Type 10?Nobody knows what info on tanks Gj have.

[ruby_red193 35]

25 minutes ago, Tantor57 said:

Gaijin at least needs a strict minimum amount of information to model a tank. And im not even talking about complicated stuffs there... Even armored plates layout and arrangeme,t is not known about the Type 10 and gaijin needs that just to make a working 3D model.

 

That's not how coding datas in 3D models works... If it was that simple, that'd be great.

I know that there is no armor or layout information, Also but Type 90 is the same.
However, Type 90 has appeared in the game.
Considering this example, I think that it is possible to make it appear in the game by interweaving a reasonable guess.

[Tantor57 10,318]

2 minutes ago, ruby_red193 said:

I know that there is no armor or layout information, Also but Type 90 is the same.
However, Type 90 has appeared in the game.
Considering this example, I think that it is possible to make it appear in the game by interweaving a reasonable guess.

Gaijin managed to get information on the Type 90 directly from Japanese Army archives.

 

11 minutes ago, wulfalier said:

And do you know what they have about the Type 10?Nobody knows what info on tanks Gj have.

They have none. What they have would not even allow them to make a proper working and interacting 3D model of the thing.

 

 

[DELTACLUSTER 1,734]

15 minutes ago, Tantor57 said:

They have none. What they have would not even allow them to make a proper working and interacting 3D model of the thing.

 

There was a big collection of photos from a tank museum. This collection included the Type 10, so I strongly believe they can at least model it.

[ruby_red193 35]

14 minutes ago, Tantor57 said:

Gaijin managed to get information on the Type 90 directly from Japanese Army archives. 

The SDF 's weapons are not basically open to the public. There is only ambiguous information that can be disclosed.
Does Gaijin know about unknown information by anyone? I do not think so. I think that it is something that everyone, such as experts and researchers, knows.
However, if Gaijin got detailed information on Type 90 in that way, I think that you can get Type 10 information in the same way.