USA M1 tanks need upgrade shell

[cafebird 23]

Don't know how to say about the game balance, as a battle rating 10.0 tank, M1/ IPM1 can't even penetrate lower front plate of 2A5. So what is point of M1 can stay at 10.0? the penetrate value is worse than 9.3 tanks.

T80U,2A5 is totally immune to M774 frontally.

[Stofferberry 1,629]

3 hours ago, cafebird said:

Don't know how to say about the game balance, as a battle rating 10.0 tank, M1/ IPM1 can't even penetrate lower front plate of 2A5. So what is point of M1 can stay at 10.0? the penetrate value is worse than 9.3 tanks.

T80U,2A5 is totally immune to M774 frontally.

Well first remember the new rank 7 vehicles will get up-tiered sometime. Probably with the mid update br and economy changes. 

 

But it's stupid to have thrown the historical data on the M774 out the window and give it only 357mm flat pen, good angled pen, but it's not enough. Gaijin should give the M1 and M1IP the M833 and make the M774 stock. It didn't need it before the ammo pen changes but now with rank 7 on top of that it really does.

 

It's also stupid to say that the USA players deserve to suffer. Gaijin is the one who made top tier a mess. What do you expect US players to do? Not play a legendary tank, a really cool attack helicopter, or that new supersonic jet? People will play what they want to play, it's up to Gaijin to listen to community feedback left in the proper forum sections to balance the game. 

[sartt 1,460]

On 14/03/2019 at 13:26, Stofferberry said:

Well first remember the new rank 7 vehicles will get up-tiered sometime. Probably with the mid update br and economy changes. 

 

But it's stupid to have thrown the historical data on the M774 out the window and give it only 357mm flat pen, good angled pen, but it's not enough. Gaijin should give the M1 and M1IP the M833 and make the M774 stock. It didn't need it before the ammo pen changes but now with rank 7 on top of that it really does.

 

It's also stupid to say that the USA players deserve to suffer. Gaijin is the one who made top tier a mess. What do you expect US players to do? Not play a legendary tank, a really cool attack helicopter, or that new supersonic jet? People will play what they want to play, it's up to Gaijin to listen to community feedback left in the proper forum sections to balance the game. 

the m833 currently is still going to be useless, the only thing that will help the Abrams is the M900

On 14/03/2019 at 09:37, TheKomrade said:

Abrams players.. Feel the pain now. Nuf said. 

And people like you are the reason i  use helicopters.

[MagicalMethod 1,768]

2 hours ago, sartt said:

the m833 currently is still going to be useless, the only thing that will help the Abrams is the M900

US players have been claiming that ever since 2A4 got added... It doesn't need m900... However... If it was added then German players would have to get their historical values on DM23 or get the currently nerfed version of DM33... 

 

I won't even start on what the British and French would've needed that'd be too long list. 

[DaGreenBolt 1,403]

On 14/03/2019 at 11:26, Stofferberry said:

Well first remember the new rank 7 vehicles will get up-tiered sometime. Probably with the mid update br and economy changes. 

 

But it's stupid to have thrown the historical data on the M774 out the window and give it only 357mm flat pen, good angled pen, but it's not enough. Gaijin should give the M1 and M1IP the M833 and make the M774 stock. It didn't need it before the ammo pen changes but now with rank 7 on top of that it really does.

 

It's also stupid to say that the USA players deserve to suffer. Gaijin is the one who made top tier a mess. What do you expect US players to do? Not play a legendary tank, a really cool attack helicopter, or that new supersonic jet? People will play what they want to play, it's up to Gaijin to listen to community feedback left in the proper forum sections to balance the game. 

Actually the change on the m774 is historical, it wasn't suppose to have over 400mm of pen, that was the m833 shell.

Gaijin will balance things out once the economy patch drops, and br changes drop.

3 hours ago, sartt said:

the m833 currently is still going to be useless, the only thing that will help the Abrams is the M900

And people like you are the reason i  use helicopters.

Abrams doesn't need the m900 shell, unless you are willing for the m900 get to nerfed drastically in 60 degree pen, and buff the dm23, and dm33 to historical levels then ill be fine, till then nope.

[T1E6X1 292]

Honestly after 15 games with the Abrams, 14 losses, 1 victory, and over 400k sl in the drain, ive just given up.

[KILLAZS619@psn 3]

The abrams needs a new ammo and better armor because this is garbage we legit cant do anything ....... 

[IStrykerI 367]

The abrams didn't need the round before this patch but now it does. I am not a fan of the abrams ingame myself but I recognize that it does need something. Also, the cr1 needs the l26. I don't know the pen values of the american round they should add, but it shouldnt be a lolpen round like many want. The abrams advantages are still present. I know people are saying that the new tanks will be moved up, but that doesn't mean a thing for the previous top tanks. They will still be needed in everyone's lineup and the new tanks definitely aren't way out of touch. The t80u is barely an improvement. The m1a1 is a greater improvement. The cr2 is huge for the british. As for the 2a5, I am undecided still. It is very strong but I'm not calling it OP right now. I will have to see what happens when more people get the m1a1, t80u, and cr2

[JP_MR_Wiggles 885]

14 hours ago, SgtStryker said:

The abrams didn't need the round before this patch but now it does. I am not a fan of the abrams ingame myself but I recognize that it does need something. Also, the cr1 needs the l26. I don't know the pen values of the american round they should add, but it shouldnt be a lolpen round like many want. The abrams advantages are still present. I know people are saying that the new tanks will be moved up, but that doesn't mean a thing for the previous top tanks. They will still be needed in everyone's lineup and the new tanks definitely aren't way out of touch. The t80u is barely an improvement. The m1a1 is a greater improvement. The cr2 is huge for the british. As for the 2a5, I am undecided still. It is very strong but I'm not calling it OP right now. I will have to see what happens when more people get the m1a1, t80u, and cr2

your going have to wait a looooonnngg tttime for the m1a1 i gave up on it as soon as i saw it has heat as a stock round

[Caleb1718 7]

On 16/03/2019 at 14:54, DaGreenBolt said:

Actually the change on the m774 is historical, it wasn't suppose to have over 400mm of pen, that was the m833 shell.

Gaijin will balance things out once the economy patch drops, and br changes drop.

Abrams doesn't need the m900 shell, unless you are willing for the m900 get to nerfed drastically in 60 degree pen, and buff the dm23, and dm33 to historical levels then ill be fine, till then nope.

If you want DM23/33 buffed to historical levels then you'll also need to buff every other shell to historical levels as well, with that buff M829 would still be the best shell in game at the moment, if M900 was added it would be the second best shell in game beating JM/DM33 by around 5-10 mm of pen. After a lot of research I found out that the IPM1 could fire M900 but only around 100 rounds before the breech  would explode, so if the IPM1 did get M900 in game I would suggest a limited amount it would be able to carry, say around 5-10 rounds that wouldn't be restocked in a cap zone 

Edited March 19, 2019 by Caleb1718
Spelling mistake.

[JP_MR_Wiggles 885]

22 hours ago, Caleb1718 said:

If you want DM23/33 buffed to historical levels then you'll also need to buff every other shell to historical levels as well, with that buff M829 would still be the best shell in game at the moment, if M900 was added it would be the second best shell in game beating JM/DM33 by around 5-10 mm of pen. After a lot of research I found out that the IPM1 could fire M900 but only around 100 rounds before the breech  would explode, so if the IPM1 did get M900 in game I would suggest a limited amount it would be able to carry, say around 5-10 rounds that wouldn't be restocked in a cap zone 

this is warthunder where kv-2's can turn turrets on 50* slopes and fire without tipping over along with the german tiger 1p not randomly catching fire and other magicly working tanks why put that little detail in when other tanks dont get that?

 

either add all the quirks of a tank or non and since a certian nation didnt bother with standard radios in their tanks till late t3485's i think you know the answer here.

[MagicalMethod 1,768]

On 20/03/2019 at 06:45, JP_MR_Wiggles said:

this is warthunder where kv-2's can turn turrets on 50* slopes and fire without tipping over along with the german tiger 1p not randomly catching fire and other magicly working tanks why put that little detail in when other tanks dont get that?

 

either add all the quirks of a tank or non and since a certian nation didnt bother with standard radios in their tanks till late t3485's i think you know the answer here.

Tbh I still think a M900 is too much... All we need is debuffed shells... Not to mention... Have a look at what they've done to DM33/JM33... How badly do you think an M900 would end... This isn't Russian tank were talking about... Therefore it can't have anywhere close to historical pen values.. 

[Anju_Yuuki 983]

1 minute ago, MagicalMethod said:

Have a look at what they've done to DM33/JM33..

i dont get it what have they done to the DM33 shell?

[MagicalMethod 1,768]

46 minutes ago, Anju_Yuuki said:

i dont get it what have they done to the DM33 shell?

 

They reduced pen from 540mm it had to 470mm it has now... 

They also nerfed DM13 as it will pen around 395mm now.... 

And DM23 will pen around 410mm only as well... 

Edited March 21, 2019 by MagicalMethod

[Cruorr 151]

I continue to not understand people who think the Abrams was EVER over powered. I wreck them in my Leopard 2. I have NEVER been like " damn Abrams, if that were another tank I'd have won" rather, I HAVE fought T64B and been like Damn T64B insanely good frontal armor and amazing gun, if that were a weak under powered helpless Abrams I'd have won" many times. And shhhhh yes try hitting the divers port when he is moving full speed over rough terrain and machine gunning your optic. I've killed a lot of T64/T80. Abrams is an easier target. Leopard 2 is a better tank than Abrams. 

 

Abrams absolutely needs m833 and m1Ip should have M900. Also, please fit the turret ring of all 3 Abrams so we aren't easy kills for WW2 tanks and AA.

[MagicalMethod 1,768]

5 hours ago, Cruorr said:

I continue to not understand people who think the Abrams was EVER over powered. I wreck them in my Leopard 2. I have NEVER been like " damn Abrams, if that were another tank I'd have won" rather, I HAVE fought T64B and been like Damn T64B insanely good frontal armor and amazing gun, if that were a weak under powered helpless Abrams I'd have won" many times. And shhhhh yes try hitting the divers port when he is moving full speed over rough terrain and machine gunning your optic. I've killed a lot of T64/T80. Abrams is an easier target. Leopard 2 is a better tank than Abrams. 

 

Abrams absolutely needs m833 and m1Ip should have M900. Also, please fit the turret ring of all 3 Abrams so we aren't easy kills for WW2 tanks and AA.

The strength of Abramses comes from high survivability, good enough armor and better mobility. 

 

Leopard 2a4 may have slightly better shells now and better turret armor but that's about it. Abrams has everything else. With the current changes to apfsds which everyone but ruskies suffer the meta has shifted a bit. 

Not by a lot as you may think. 

An example of ipm VS 2a4.

Ipm still can shoot at LFP and turret ring. And will pen at any range. 

2a4 won't penetrate LFP at longer distances then 200-300 meters because DM23 was nerfed. DM13 doesn't have a chance except for turret ring. 

I dunno seems the ipm is better off... 

For as long as the ammo stays nerfed to oblivion as it is. Both tanks are somewhat equal. 

 

[cafebird 23]

1 hour ago, MagicalMethod said:

The strength of Abramses comes from high survivability, good enough armor and better mobility. 

 

Leopard 2a4 may have slightly better shells now and better turret armor but that's about it. Abrams has everything else. With the current changes to apfsds which everyone but ruskies suffer the meta has shifted a bit. 

Not by a lot as you may think. 

An example of ipm VS 2a4.

Ipm still can shoot at LFP and turret ring. And will pen at any range. 

2a4 won't penetrate LFP at longer distances then 200-300 meters because DM23 was nerfed. DM13 doesn't have a chance except for turret ring. 

I dunno seems the ipm is better off... 

For as long as the ammo stays nerfed to oblivion as it is. Both tanks are somewhat equal. 

 

 Don't tell me DM23 can penetrate ipm's giant lower frontal plate, It's still can penetrate it within 2000ms. and most of engagement are within 1000ms, which DM23 can penetrate ipm lower frontal plate 100%. however, M774/M735 only can can penetrate lowest part of LFP of 2A4, which is almost impossible due to terrain gradient.

and now with 2A5, it just pop put turret and kill M1A1 like a knife cutting bean-curd, penetrate every place.

[MagicalMethod 1,768]

6 minutes ago, cafebird said:

Don't tell me DM23 can penetrate ipm's giant lower frontal plate, It's still can penetrate it withing 2000ms.

Yea sorry about that... i was living a lie... allways thought the LFP was 400mm thick... Ship sorry... my mistake...

[Cruorr 151]

2 hours ago, MagicalMethod said:

The strength of Abramses comes from high survivability, good enough armor and better mobility. 

 

Leopard 2a4 may have slightly better shells now and better turret armor but that's about it. Abrams has everything else. With the current changes to apfsds which everyone but ruskies suffer the meta has shifted a bit. 

Not by a lot as you may think. 

An example of ipm VS 2a4.

Ipm still can shoot at LFP and turret ring. And will pen at any range. 

2a4 won't penetrate LFP at longer distances then 200-300 meters because DM23 was nerfed. DM13 doesn't have a chance except for turret ring. 

I dunno seems the ipm is better off... 

For as long as the ammo stays nerfed to oblivion as it is. Both tanks are somewhat equal. 

 

Having both tanks I do not notice Abrams being faster than the Leopard 2, certainly not the M1IP. It's not substantial for sure. Leo has a better turret as you mention and with 16 rounds Leo is every bit as survivable. I easily pen the Abrams everywhere with DM23, I dont take stock rounds into consideration, I rate tanks fully upgraded. Abrams is quite easy to 1 shot from the front, I think people complaining comes from side shots being difficult 1 shots after they have become used to them being 1 shot kills for every other tank 1.0 to 8.7. Honestly I cant see anyone who has both tanks saying the Abrams is better than the Leopard 2, at best they are equal, I think the Leopard is better however, just for no huge turret ring weak spot. Only thing I miss on the Abrams is the .50 cal. 

[IStrykerI 367]

7 hours ago, Cruorr said:

Having both tanks I do not notice Abrams being faster than the Leopard 2, certainly not the M1IP. It's not substantial for sure. Leo has a better turret as you mention and with 16 rounds Leo is every bit as survivable. I easily pen the Abrams everywhere with DM23, I dont take stock rounds into consideration, I rate tanks fully upgraded. Abrams is quite easy to 1 shot from the front, I think people complaining comes from side shots being difficult 1 shots after they have become used to them being 1 shot kills for every other tank 1.0 to 8.7. Honestly I cant see anyone who has both tanks saying the Abrams is better than the Leopard 2, at best they are equal, I think the Leopard is better however, just for no huge turret ring weak spot. Only thing I miss on the Abrams is the .50 cal. 

The leo is a lot less survivable. It's not a problem with being ammo racked, it's that the crew are so close together. The abrams generally losses less crew per shot because of the spacing. Frontally, you can easily 1 shot a 2a4 by shooting on the left part of the hull. When the leo is slightly angled it gets 1 shot by crew quite often. I have both tanks and survivability is nowhere near the same. 

[Daffan 6,158]

This is the current meta.

 

2A5 > M1A1 > M1IP > M1 > 2A4 > 2K/XM1

 

Now I think a new shell is -ok- if the parameters aren't crazy but it just doubles down on US power. Right now there is a lack of M1A1 in Matchmaker but eventually the stomp will be back. 

[Kenny110 788]

23 minutes ago, DaffanZ said:

This is the current meta.

 

2A5 > M1A1 > M1IP > M1 > 2A4 > 2K/XM1

 

Now I think a new shell is -ok- if the parameters aren't crazy but it just doubles down on US power. Right now there is a lack of M1A1 in Matchmaker but eventually the stomp will be back. 

The only thing I verse in my 2a5 is M1a1s and t80u so I don't think there is a lack of  m1a1s in the matchmaking 

Edited March 22, 2019 by Kenny110

[Daffan 6,158]

42 minutes ago, Kenny110 said:

The only thing I verse in my 2a5 is M1a1s and t80u so I don't think there is a lack of  m1a1s in the matchmaking 

Yeah it might have changed overall but for me right now M1A1 is pretty rare. T80U seems more common. 

 

[Cruorr 151]

53 minutes ago, DaffanZ said:

This is the current meta.

 

2A5 > M1A1 > M1IP > M1 > 2A4 > 2K/XM1

 

Now I think a new shell is -ok- if the parameters aren't crazy but it just doubles down on US power. Right now there is a lack of M1A1 in Matchmaker but eventually the stomp will be back. 

Based on what? I have the same K:D on the 2A4 I have on the M1IP, and I find the 2A4 to be slightly better. No tinfoil turret ring. M1A1 is a joke to kill, there is a lack because its junk. Glass cannon.

[NoodleCup31 8,824]

22 hours ago, MagicalMethod said:

 

They reduced pen from 540mm it had to 470mm it has now... 

They also nerfed DM13 as it will pen around 395mm now.... 

And DM23 will pen around 410mm only as well... 

DM23 has around 460mm at 2000m. But Gaijibbles formulas are very correct