When USSR jets will get R-73? Is it possible to get R-77 ?

[Cursedrider 59]

So we have the MiG-29 and Yak-141 against the F-16 and F-14A. Many American fans claim that this is the perfect balance, but in the next update, we will also have the F-14B with better Phoenix missiles. Everyone says that the balance between these aircraft exists because the Russian planes have the R-27ER, but they miss one important point: the MiG-29 only has two of them. The R-60M missiles are not a match for the enemy they are supposed to fight. At the same time, American planes receive all the latest technology. Yes, they lack the AIM-120, but if that missile arrives, then the question of where the R-77 is becomes relevant. Everyone says that in close combat, the MiG-29 is better because it is more maneuverable. That is probably true if the battle is 5 vs. 5 and the MiG-29 relies on the enemy not having flares to counter the R-60M. The other option is to rely on its superior maneuverability and the Gsh-30-1 cannon. In random battles, the main problem with the MiG-29 is that it cannot engage the enemy at a longer range at Mach 1 with the R-60M; it simply loses energy. The MiG-29 and Yak-141 have a smaller horizontal radar range compared to the F-16 and F-14, even though the radius of the Russian planes can be up to 100 degrees. In every aspect, American planes outperform Russian ones. There are only two advantages for the Russians: better maneuverability and more powerful engines, but that is not enough to achieve balance between American and Russian aircraft.

 

I say this as a player who has had 2514 battles with the MiG-29 and 2823 confirmed kills simply because it is my favorite aircraft.

[Balanced_Game 19]

The MiG-29 will be fine in the next meta. It does not have to be the strongest jet every time.

[Etheriith 7]

Other nations needs FOX 3

 

pretty imbalanced for only 1 nation to have it

[_J_ackal_ 284]

1 hour ago, Cursedrider said:

Many American fans claim that this is the perfect balance

Balance to an american main would be f-22 vs mig-21 (without r60s because too OP)

[Cursedrider 59]

1 hour ago, Etheriith said:

Other nations needs FOX 3

 

pretty imbalanced for only 1 nation to have it

Gaijin keep in balance other nations because many USA fans will cry.

[Balanced_Game 19]

1 hour ago, Etheriith said:

Other nations needs FOX 3

 

pretty imbalanced for only 1 nation to have it

nations didnt develop linearly with each other. Not every nation's FOX-3 is equivalent to every other nation's FOX-3. The R-77 for instance would not be balanced in the current game, but the phoenix more or less is.

17 minutes ago, Cursedrider said:

Gaijin keep in balance other nations because many USA fans will cry.

Not sure what you're trying to say here. Gaijin makes dozens of mistakes but not implementing things like the R-77 as of right now is not one of them.

[Cursedrider 59]

6 minutes ago, Balanced_Game said:

nations didnt develop linearly with each other. Not every nation's FOX-3 is equivalent to every other nation's FOX-3. The R-77 for instance would not be balanced in the current game, but the phoenix more or less is.

Not sure what you're trying to say here. Gaijin makes dozens of mistakes but not implementing things like the R-77 as of right now is not one of them.

Keep it phoniex lets be balanced. Where im not sure but ok lets be.    but where is R-73 ? 

Not sure what you're trying to say here. Gaijin makes dozens of mistakes but not implementing things like the R-77 as of right now is not one of them.
Trying to make a joke with current situation.

And how Phoniex is most balanced ? Where this is 1st and least the only 1 fire and forget long range missle ? 

Edited May 18, 2023 by Cursedrider

[Etheriith 7]

6 minutes ago, Balanced_Game said:

nations didnt develop linearly with each other. Not every nation's FOX-3 is equivalent to every other nation's FOX-3. The R-77 for instance would not be balanced in the current game, but the phoenix more or less is.

Not sure what you're trying to say here. Gaijin makes dozens of mistakes but not implementing things like the R-77 as of right now is not one of them.

So remove the aim54a/c

 

Thats the better option and its fair to other nations.

[Cursedrider 59]

1 minute ago, Etheriith said:

So remove the aim54a/c

 

Thats the better option and its fair to other nations.

Nope other nations want their FOX 3 and AIM-9L is not comparable with R60M

Here is the main differnace MatAwg show us how he made 3 kills in first 2 mins of the start. No other nations or jet can do that ? Is that a Balance ? 

[Balanced_Game 19]

6 minutes ago, Cursedrider said:

Keep it phoniex lets be balanced. Where im not sure but ok lets be.    but where is R-73 ? 

Not sure what you're trying to say here. Gaijin makes dozens of mistakes but not implementing things like the R-77 as of right now is not one of them.
Trying to make a joke with current situation.

And how Phoniex is most balanced ? Where this is 1st and least the only 1 fire and forget long range missle ? 

Phoenix has counters to it, namely the fact its not hard to dodge/notch currently, its very predictable when phoenixes will be incoming, and jets like the MiG-29 will always kill the F-14 first with the 27ER before the AIM-54 has had time to get near the 29. I will not speak for the performance of the newer phoenix coming on the F-14B because we have no data for it yet.

5 minutes ago, Etheriith said:

So remove the aim54a/c

 

Thats the better option and its fair to other nations.

I don't really see it as a current problem in the game.

[Cursedrider 59]

6 minutes ago, Balanced_Game said:

Phoenix has counters to it, namely the fact its not hard to dodge/notch currently, its very predictable when phoenixes will be incoming, and jets like the MiG-29 will always kill the F-14 first with the 27ER before the AIM-54 has had time to get near the 29. I will not speak for the performance of the newer phoenix coming on the F-14B because we have no data for it yet.

I don't really see it as a current problem in the game.

 

Watch this video on MatAWG he launch it Phoenix from 40 km away. In this scenario R-27ER will never kill F14 becaouse F14 after launch almost can get turn 180 degrees and go away and leave on Phoenix to do his job. R-27ER is unefctive on distance bigger then 17km beacause leave a time of the pilot to getting cold. For Phoenix do not have cold position, The only way is getting close to the graund,
 

 

Edited May 18, 2023 by Cursedrider

[Balanced_Game 19]

4 minutes ago, Cursedrider said:

 

Watch this video on MatAWG he launch it Phoenix from 40 km away. In this scenario R-27ER will never kill F14 becaouse F14 after launch almost can get turn 180 degrees and go away and leave on Phoenix to do his job. R-27ER is unefctive on distance bigger then 17km beacause leave a time of the pilot to getting cold. For Phoenix do not have cold position, The only way is getting close to the graund,
 

 

 

I've played the F-14A. I know what it's capable of. That said, the kills here in the clip are due to a lack of experience or knowledge on the enemy's part. The AIM-54 is very easily avoided.

[Cursedrider 59]

2 minutes ago, Balanced_Game said:

 

I've played the F-14A. I know what it's capable of. That said, the kills here in the clip are due to a lack of experience or knowledge on the enemy's part. The AIM-54 is very easily avoided.

Of course, you are absolutely right, but that is assuming that the Phoenix is likely coming for you. The R-27ER warns the enemy that they have been detected, which reduces its effectiveness by at least two times compared to the Phoenix.

[Balanced_Game 19]

1 minute ago, Cursedrider said:

Of course, you are absolutely right, but that is assuming that the Phoenix is likely coming for you. The R-27ER warns the enemy that they have been detected, which reduces its effectiveness by at least two times compared to the Phoenix.

The 27ER has IOG meaning you can fire it, switch to TWS, then re-lock for final approach.

 

Besides that, the phoenix warns you enough ahead of time and also has a long enough burn time to where it's almost always noticable. Only in extreme ranges can the phoenix really prove to be difficult.

[Cursedrider 59]

12 minutes ago, Balanced_Game said:

The 27ER has IOG meaning you can fire it, switch to TWS, then re-lock for final approach.

 

Besides that, the phoenix warns you enough ahead of time and also has a long enough burn time to where it's almost always noticable. Only in extreme ranges can the phoenix really prove to be difficult.

 

Please define for me what extremely large distances are. Is 40 kilometers from the MatAWG clip a small or large distance?

[Balanced_Game 19]

10 minutes ago, Cursedrider said:

 

Please define for me what extremely large distances are. Is 40 kilometers from the MatAWG clip a small or large distance?

again, those mig29s are just bad players, simply put. They had ample opportunity to avoid this since the Phoenix was still both 1. burning (missile diamond) and 2. pinging their RWR and 3. not very fast yet.

 

Phoenix doesn't become "uncounterable non-sense" sort of tier until you're VERY far out, maybe 80km+

[Cursedrider 59]

21 hours ago, Balanced_Game said:

again, those mig29s are just bad players, simply put. They had ample opportunity to avoid this since the Phoenix was still both 1. burning (missile diamond) and 2. pinging their RWR and 3. not very fast yet.

 

Phoenix doesn't become "uncounterable non-sense" sort of tier until you're VERY far out, maybe 80km+

Hahaha what a joke who will launch a Phoenix from 80km away. OK i guess we are discussed Phoenix and R-27R so i guess you think R-27R is bettar then Phoenix i cant accept this but probbaly you never will accept my point about does 2 missels. OK we are finish with this because its a pointles to contunie. But what abouth AIM-9L and R-60M is they are with equal chance against enemys ? 

Edited May 19, 2023 by Cursedrider

[Stimublas 7]

Hold my beer, according to the test of the Chinese, both of them are inferior to R27 for reilablity reasons. So they opted for R27 package knowing fullwell Indian's mig was kitted with the R77 package. 

[Klassischer_Durc 8]

On 19/05/2023 at 18:08, Cursedrider said:

Hahaha what a joke who will launch a Phoenix from 80km away. OK i guess we are discussed Phoenix and R-27R so i guess you think R-27R is bettar then Phoenix i cant accept this but probbaly you never will accept my point about does 2 missels. OK we are finish with this because its a pointles to contunie. But what abouth AIM-9L and R-60M is they are with equal chance against enemys ? 

Besides any discussion about what missile is better than the other you are missing an important point here, as War Thunder is a game of asymmetrical balance. Some vehicles are performing better than others because they do so in reality. Even though they are kind of equal ingame, one could still have more strenghts than the other, you just need to play to the strength of the aircraft. As theyve already made the manouverability of the F16 way worse than is should be (youll lose dogfights against phantoms on high speeds) they already balanced the aircraft to fit in with the MiG29. Speaking of the F14, they do have their AIM54s because these were simply the first missiles of that kind, so other nations have to deal with them, which really isnt hard if you keep your head up. AIM9Ls are definitly better than R60Ms, and so R27Rs are better than the AIM7Fs (as the AIM7Ms are Fs at the moment, I guess for balancing reasons). 

[Vyprex 729]

On 18/05/2023 at 18:13, Cursedrider said:

So we have the MiG-29 and Yak-141 against the F-16 and F-14A. Many American fans claim that this is the perfect balance, but in the next update, we will also have the F-14B with better Phoenix missiles. Everyone says that the balance between these aircraft exists because the Russian planes have the R-27ER, but they miss one important point: the MiG-29 only has two of them. The R-60M missiles are not a match for the enemy they are supposed to fight. At the same time, American planes receive all the latest technology. Yes, they lack the AIM-120, but if that missile arrives, then the question of where the R-77 is becomes relevant. Everyone says that in close combat, the MiG-29 is better because it is more maneuverable. That is probably true if the battle is 5 vs. 5 and the MiG-29 relies on the enemy not having flares to counter the R-60M. The other option is to rely on its superior maneuverability and the Gsh-30-1 cannon. In random battles, the main problem with the MiG-29 is that it cannot engage the enemy at a longer range at Mach 1 with the R-60M; it simply loses energy. The MiG-29 and Yak-141 have a smaller horizontal radar range compared to the F-16 and F-14, even though the radius of the Russian planes can be up to 100 degrees. In every aspect, American planes outperform Russian ones. There are only two advantages for the Russians: better maneuverability and more powerful engines, but that is not enough to achieve balance between American and Russian aircraft.

 

I say this as a player who has had 2514 battles with the MiG-29 and 2823 confirmed kills simply because it is my favorite aircraft.

R-73 or R-77 you can use at dev server a 1-2 patch ago. Its too broken and maps can't support that ammunitions.

[Faster_Boiiiii 753]

On 18/05/2023 at 18:36, Etheriith said:

Other nations needs FOX 3

 

pretty imbalanced for only 1 nation to have it

Yeah... Sweden and the UK are perfect canditates

[Cpt_Bel_V 4,789]

2 hours ago, Faster_Boiiiii said:

Yeah... Sweden and the UK are perfect canditates

France is currently waiting up,... even recieving it's earliest Fox-3 carrier, but with no Fox-3 on board,... 

Edited May 22, 2023 by Cpt_Bel_V

[Faster_Boiiiii 753]

8 minutes ago, Cpt_Bel_V said:

France is currently waiting up,... even recieving it's earliest Fox-3 carrier, but with no Fox-3 on board,... 

your MICA is going to stay not being implemented for a long while

[Cpt_Bel_V 4,789]

2 minutes ago, Faster_Boiiiii said:

your MICA is going to stay not being implemented for a long while

I know it's sad and i wished we had Mirage 4000 instead of that Piece of Crapmixed standard of the Whole Mirage 2000 family,... (i think it's clear enough, payload on this aircraft is nowhere near the real Mirage 2000-5F)

Edited May 22, 2023 by Cpt_Bel_V

[Khomuna 67]

I don't think USSR needs either right now, and this is from an USSR main.

 

R-27ER might not be Fox-3 and only comes in low numbers, but it's the fastest missile in the game and the planes that use it are also excellent dogfighters. We should get R-77s when AIM-120s come to the game.

 

R-73 is just not needed at the moment, for me that's something to get when AIM-9Xs are introduced, given it's the same type of missile (thrust vectoring).