Jump to content
Sign In

M1A2T Abrams: The ROCA's Steel Fortress

Yontzee

By Yontzee,
in China

 Share

M1A2T Abrams Poll  

78 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the M1A2T Abrams be added to War Thunder?

    • Yes
      60
    • No
      18

Yontzee

Yontzee 1,673

Posted (edited)

Flag_of_the_Republic_of_China_svg.png.8f  M1A2T Abrams: The ROCA's Steel Fortress  Republic_of_China_Army_(ROCA)_Logo_svg.p

Disclaimers: For the sake of vehicle designation and sources, I will refer to the Republic of China as Taiwan. Also, there are few images/videos of the vehicle at this time, this will be updated in due course. The acronym “ROCA” stands for Republic of China Army.

Taiwan_army_training_on_first_M1A2T_Abra

First look into a M1A2T that has been turned over to Taiwan. In this image, American contractors are testing/preparing the vehicle.

  • Description : 
    • The M1A2T Abrams is a modified M1A2 SEPv2 main battle tank that has been specifically designed for the Taiwanese/Republic of China Army. In 2019, the U.S. State Department approved Taiwan's request to purchase up to 108 modified M1A2 Abrams tanks to meet the needs of the Taiwanese Army. In June of 2022, the first two of 2018 were turned over to Taiwanese Officers, allowing Taiwan to create a training program to train its aspiring tank brigades in preparation for following deliveries. Along with operating the M1A2T, the Taiwanese Army is preparing underground fortifications and emplacements to assist in the vehicle's survival capabilities. Overall, the M1A2T is equipped with a number of advanced features that make it a highly capable and versatile platform for a variety of military operations. One of the key features of the M1A2T is its updated digital fire control system. Compared to a base M1A2 SEPv2, the M1A2T has received new microprocessors, display panels, memory, and interface to improve reaction capability and allow the tank's crew to quickly and accurately engage targets at long ranges, or in other words, increase the tank's first hit capabilities. The tank is also equipped with updated thermal imaging sights with Hunter-Killer capabilities developed by Raytheon, which provide the crew with enhanced situational awareness in all lighting conditions. These sights could be updated to the 3rd-generation IFLIR in the future. This advanced sighting system allows the tank to engage targets with precision, even in low light or adverse weather conditions. Another important feature of the M1A2T is its armor package. The tank is equipped with export composite armor, which provides excellent protection against a variety of threats, including armor-piercing rounds and shaped charges. The tank's armor package has been specifically designed to protect against threats from the front, and sides, making it a highly survivable platform in combat. The M1A2T is also highly mobile; being powered by a 1,500hp Honeywell AGT1500C Gas Turbine Engine that can propel the tank to speeds of up to 42 miles per hour (68 kilometers per hour). The tank is also equipped with a sophisticated suspension system that allows it to traverse rough terrain with ease. This mobility makes the M1A2T a highly effective platform for a variety of military operations, including offensive maneuvers, reconnaissance in force, and defense. In terms of firepower, the M1A2T is equipped with a 120 mm M256 L/44 Smoothbore Gun, which can fire a variety of ammunition types, including armor-piercing fin-stabilized discarding sabot (APFSDS) rounds and high-explosive anti-tank (HEAT) rounds. This cannon is highly accurate and can engage targets at long ranges with precision. The Taiwanese Army will operate the General Dynamics KE-W A1 APFSDS-T round that has been developed for export use with Taiwan purchasing more than 7,800. The tank is also equipped with a 7.62mm M240C coaxial machine gun and a M153A1E1 CROWS-LP (Low-Profile) remote-controlled weapons station, which is armed with a M2HB .50 caliber machine gun. The M1A2T Abrams is a highly capable and versatile main battle tank that has been specifically designed to meet the needs of the Taiwanese Army. Its advanced features, including its digital fire control system, thermal imaging sights, and improved armor package, make it a highly survivable and effective platform for a variety of military operations. Its mobility and firepower also make it a formidable opponent on the battlefield. The introduction of the M1A2T Abrams into the Taiwanese Army's arsenal in 2024 is a significant boost to the country's defense capabilities and underscores Taiwan's commitment to maintaining a strong and capable military.
  • Armament:
    • Main Weapon: 120 mm M256 L/44 Smoothbore Gun (w/ 42rds)
      • Rounds:
        • KE-W A1 APFSDS-T
        • M830 HEAT-T
        • M830A1 HEAT-MP-T
        • M908 HE-ORT
        • M1028 Cannister
      • Depression/Elevation: -10°/20°
    • Additional Weapons:
      • Coaxial 7.62mm M240C Medium Machine Gun
      • 12.7mm M153A1E1 CROWS-LP
      • 7.62mm M240C Medium Machine Gun
  • Maneuverability:
    • Engine: 1,500hp Honeywell AGT1500C Gas Turbine Engine
    • Transmission: Allison DDA X-1100-3C (8-forward, 4-reverse)
    • Chassis: High-hardness-steel Torsion Bars w/ Rotary Shock Absorbers
    • Max Speed: 67km/h
  • Dimensions:
    • Length: 7.93m (9.77m w/ Gun Forward)
    • Width: 3.7m
    • Height: 2.4m
    • Weight: ~63t 
  • Crew (4x):
    • Commander
    • Driver
    • Gunner
    • Loader
  • Features:
    • Heavy Export Composite Armor
      • Likely similar (or a bit better) armor utilized by the M1A1 AIM provided to Australia.
    • Optics (Block I FLIR for Commander and Gunner, possibly improved):
      • Gunner: Raytheon Gunner's Primary Sight- Line of Sight (GPS-LOS) (2nd Generation Thermal Imager)
      • Commander: Raytheon Commander’s Independent Thermal Viewer (2nd Generation Thermal Imager)
      • Driver: AN/VAS-5B Driver Vision Enhancer (DVE-A) (2nd Generation Thermal Imager)
    • Laser Rangefinder
    • M153A1E1 CROWS-LP Remote Weapon System
    • 12x Smoke Grenade Launchers
    • ESS
  • Reason for Implementation:
    • The M1A2T would be the peak of the ROC/Taiwan-side of the Chinese tree, following the CM11 main battle tank. Armed with a powerful 120mm main gun that is equipped with a wide variety of rounds, the M1A2T provides the Chinese tree with effective close or long range fire support and with the multi-purpose HEAT rounds, can target low-flying helicopters effectively. In terms of armor, the M1A2T utilizes very similar armor as the M1A1 AIM we have in-game, being equipped with export armor rather than the Depleted Uranium Armor found on the M1A2 SEP. The vehicle would excel at brawling, capturing points, and using its massive offensive power to overcome enemies. Adding this vehicle is not unprecedented as the Chinese Air Tree is equipped with the ROC/Taiwan’s F-16 MLU.
    • Estimated BR: 11.0+ (Only due to the fact it utilizes export armor).
    • Future immersive Republic of China lineup (not that competitive :D):
    1. M1A2T
    2. M60A3 TTS
    3. CM11 Brave Tiger
    4. M41D
    5. CM-34 IFV
    6. Cloud Leopard II M2 MGS
    7. CM-25
    8. Antelope AA
    9. AH-64E
    10. F-16V/F-CK-1C
  • Imagery/Videos:
Spoiler

FcbuqzKagAAK1Jf?format=jpg&name=medium

Another image of the Taiwanese M1A2T being prepared my American contracting teams.

cad1-hzrevpz9930013.jpg

The KE-W A1 APFSDS-T round Taiwan purchased.

D59NcXMUYAAwdLs?format=jpg&name=small

All the rounds that the M1A2T can fire with the exception being the KE-W A2 APFSDS-T as Taiwan has not purchased that round.

2560px-CROWS-LP_(2).jpg

The CROWS-LP being utilized by the new M1A2T.

 

 

PatriotDVEANVAS-5B-NVTS_2.12web.png

DVE AN/VAS-5B Driver's Thermal Imager.

 

 

Ignore the "Reveal hidden contents" drop down at the bottom of the suggestion as it is glitching.

Edited by Yontzee
  • Upvote 2
medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Yontzee changed the title to M1A2T Abrams: The ROCA's Steel Fortress
  • Suggestion Moderator
Thatz

Thatz 635

Posted

Open for Discussion :)

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
Yontzee

Yontzee 1,673

Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, 不是很能抗压 said:

Long long ago. Can it use KE-W II?:sleepsnail:

Technically yes but Taiwan only purchased the A1 variant. 

20 minutes ago, __Fleks__ said:

+1, but posted the thread very early, Abrams hasn't been delivered to Taiwan yet

Yeah it’s a bit early but I figured they have technical “ownership” of two in the USA even thought it’s for training purposes right now, might as well get a talking point up and early 

:happysnail:

Edited by Yontzee
medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
Rambolf

Rambolf 371

Posted

Lets be real with the way gaijin implements vehicles in the tech tree like the recently discovered T90S and the T80U in Sweden its most likely this will appear either as a high tier squadron vehicle for China or the end of the line for the Taiwan branch there's no getting around it, +1

  • Haha 1
medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
KilianL

KilianL 865

Posted

Would definitely like to see the ZTZ99s are already awesome 1 more good mbt in there cant hurt

+1

  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
warner7

warner7 81

Posted

Not needed, China should have a much more UNIQUE and domestic vehicle in top tier.

  • Confused 7
  • Upvote 2

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
NAYEONnaise

NAYEONnaise 1,936

Posted (edited)
22 hours ago, warner7 said:

Not needed, China should have a much more UNIQUE and domestic vehicle in top tier.

china has the 99A as its literal culminating MBT both at top tier and in real life. they don't have armata, SEPV3, or 2A7V counterpart irl. give this thing a chance.

Edited by NAYEONnaise
  • Upvote 1
medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
Yontzee

Yontzee 1,673

Posted (edited)
On 03/06/2023 at 07:46, warner7 said:

Not needed, China should have a much more UNIQUE and domestic vehicle in top tier.

I mean you have the VT4, and VT-3/Durjoy but I doubt these are going to have the latest munitions and the Durjoy lacks armor for competing in top rank. Same goes for the Al Karrar and Al Khalid if you goes as far to include Pakistani vehicles. The VT4A1 may be the best bet.

 

Not to mention Taiwan is in the tree and we already have American-style vehicles in the tree from them. This is just another one to cap off the Taiwan side. 

Edited by Yontzee
  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
不是很能抗压

不是很能抗压 1,265

Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Yontzee said:

I mean you have the VT4, and VT-3/Durjoy but I doubt these are going to have the latest munitions and the Durjoy lacks armor for competing in top rank. Same goes for the Al Karrar and Al Khalid if you goes as far to include Pakistani vehicles. The VT4A1 may be the best bet.

In fact the VT-3 is ZTZ-99III

4 hours ago, Yontzee said:

Not to mention Taiwan is in the tree and we already have American-style vehicles in the tree from them. This is just another one to cap off the Taiwan side. 

I always dream one day i can use 99A, VT4 and M1A2T together.:lol2:

Edited by 不是很能抗压
  • Haha 1
  • Upvote 2
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
EL337GH0ST

EL337GH0ST 195

Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, NAYEONnaise said:

china has the 99A as its literal culminating MBT both at top tier and in real life. they don't have armata, SEPV3, or 2A7V counterpart irl. give this thing a chance.

And how exactly would the M1A2T be a counterpart to either of those? It's only a SEPv2 variant, with much worse ammo and armor. There is no country in the world with a counterpart to the M1A2 SEPv3 and newest Leo 2 variant, so don't expect other countries to get anything either (not counting prototype 140 mm MBTs and similar).

 

ZTZ99A would be more than a good equivalent to the current vehicles if they fixed the hull ERA to be FY-5, turret elevation and rotation speed, ammo penetration and reload rate.

 

Of course, -1 to this addition, Abrams should be unique to the US tree, if you want it, go play the US

Edited by EL337GH0ST
  • Confused 12
  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
MAUSWAFFE

MAUSWAFFE 194

Posted (edited)
On 05/06/2023 at 11:56, EL337GH0ST said:

Abrams should be unique to the US tree, if you want it, go play the US

 

I mean, realistically the Abrams isn't unique to the US either. Export variants are also used by Australia, Egypt, Poland and Saudi Arabia for example. So it would make sense for vehicles used by multiple nations in reality to be used by multiple nations in game too.

 

If you want them to be exclusive, ask the US to stop exporting. 

Edited by MAUSWAFFE
  • Sad 1
  • Upvote 6
medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
EL337GH0ST

EL337GH0ST 195

Posted
On 06/06/2023 at 15:02, MAUSWAFFE said:

 

I mean, realistically the Abrams isn't unique to the US either. Export variants are also used by Australia, Egypt, Poland and Saudi Arabia for example. So it would make sense for vehicles used by multiple nations in reality to be used by multiple nations in game too.

 

If you want them to be exclusive, ask the US to stop exporting. 

Yeah, except none of those countries are represented in-game, and the only "foreign" Abrams (which is actually just a US upgraded Abrams ALSO in service with the US and Australia) is in the US tree, where it rightfully should be. The other foreign variants would also be in the US tree, so your argument is moot.

  • Haha 1
  • Confused 6
medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
Mahiwew

Mahiwew 528

Posted
1 hour ago, EL337GH0ST said:

Yeah, except none of those countries are represented in-game, and the only "foreign" Abrams (which is actually just a US upgraded Abrams ALSO in service with the US and Australia) is in the US tree, where it rightfully should be. The other foreign variants would also be in the US tree, so your argument is moot.

I’m sorry, but I don’t exactly see where it says that other nations cannot receive the Abrams. 
The ROC bought the tank and now it’s theirs. ROC is integrated in Chinese tree. This means that Chinese tree can get it.

 

Export vehicles are part of War Thunder trees and have been for a very, very long time. If a nation had a vehicle and is represented in the game, then they deserve to get such vehicle in their tree.  The ROC is one such nation. 
 

Should we remove the Leopard 2 variants from Sweden? 
Remove T-72M1 from Germany and Sweden? 

What of all the Shermans found throughout the trees? Or the Jacksons?

 

Sure, you can be of the opinion that no other tree should receive an Abrams, but the simple fact of the matter is that the possibility for such addition is definitely there and you can’t act like it’s something that’s forbidden.

  • Upvote 6
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
EL337GH0ST

EL337GH0ST 195

Posted
4 hours ago, Mahiwew said:

I’m sorry, but I don’t exactly see where it says that other nations cannot receive the Abrams. 
The ROC bought the tank and now it’s theirs. ROC is integrated in Chinese tree. This means that Chinese tree can get it.

 

Export vehicles are part of War Thunder trees and have been for a very, very long time. If a nation had a vehicle and is represented in the game, then they deserve to get such vehicle in their tree.  The ROC is one such nation. 
 

Should we remove the Leopard 2 variants from Sweden? 
Remove T-72M1 from Germany and Sweden? 

What of all the Shermans found throughout the trees? Or the Jacksons?

 

Sure, you can be of the opinion that no other tree should receive an Abrams, but the simple fact of the matter is that the possibility for such addition is definitely there and you can’t act like it’s something that’s forbidden.

And exactly which other country in-game uses the Abrams IRL? The answer is: none of them.

 

Just because the ROC is represented under the PRC, doesn't mean that's a good idea and especially doesn't mean that the M1A2 should be in the Chinese tree. 
China has their own domestically produced tanks for top tier, and they should only get that. Same goes for planes, China has their own planes and anything added after the F-16 should be of their own design (PRC).

 

If the ZTZ99As are fixed, adding the M1A2T would literally do nothing other than remove the uniqueness of the Abrams from the US tree. If you want an Abrams, play the US tree. Otherwise, with how fake F-16s are given to certain countries and Sweden getting trial vehicles, the US should also enjoy a slew of every other countries' vehicles.

  • Thanks 1
  • Confused 6
  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
Mahiwew

Mahiwew 528

Posted
4 hours ago, EL337GH0ST said:

And exactly which other country in-game uses the Abrams IRL? The answer is: none of them.

 

Just because the ROC is represented under the PRC, doesn't mean that's a good idea and especially doesn't mean that the M1A2 should be in the Chinese tree. 
China has their own domestically produced tanks for top tier, and they should only get that. Same goes for planes, China has their own planes and anything added after the F-16 should be of their own design (PRC).

 

If the ZTZ99As are fixed, adding the M1A2T would literally do nothing other than remove the uniqueness of the Abrams from the US tree. If you want an Abrams, play the US tree. Otherwise, with how fake F-16s are given to certain countries and Sweden getting trial vehicles, the US should also enjoy a slew of every other countries' vehicles.

The nation that operates the M1A2T is already in game comrade. They’re already owned by Taiwan.

 

I see no reason why it’d be a bad idea. Chinese top tier ground is already massively unique, this single “copy/paste” (which it isn’t) wouldn’t hurt whatsoever. 
And it doesn’t whatsoever hurt the uniqueness of American Abrams tanks, because they’re different from the variant presented here. The only way that this would be truly copy/paste is if both US and China got it, though I don’t think this would be so horrible either.

 

And sure, US definitely could get trialed export vehicles, but that has nothing to do with the topic at hand. 

ROC OWNS the M1A2T, it just needs to get shipped over. This lends quite a lot more credit to this being added to the Chinese tree than any trialed export vehicle for US. Not sure why this point is being brought up anyways.

  • Like 1
  • Confused 1
  • Sad 1
  • Upvote 4
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
Thug Shaker Actual

Thug Shaker Actual 225

Posted (edited)
On 08/06/2023 at 16:46, Mahiwew said:

The nation that operates the M1A2T is already in game comrade. They’re already owned by Taiwan.

 

I see no reason why it’d be a bad idea. Chinese top tier ground is already massively unique, this single “copy/paste” (which it isn’t) wouldn’t hurt whatsoever. 
And it doesn’t whatsoever hurt the uniqueness of American Abrams tanks, because they’re different from the variant presented here. The only way that this would be truly copy/paste is if both US and China got it, though I don’t think this would be so horrible either.

 

And sure, US definitely could get trialed export vehicles, but that has nothing to do with the topic at hand. 

ROC OWNS the M1A2T, it just needs to get shipped over. This lends quite a lot more credit to this being added to the Chinese tree than any trialed export vehicle for US. Not sure why this point is being brought up anyways.

The Tawainese tree realistically should never be in the Chinese tree. Theyre vastly different entities, but the problem this game creates is that you can use both Chinese and Taiwanese vehicles in the same loadout. Chinese players using the Abrams and a ZTZ 99 is just ridiculous, backed up by their J-8 and F-16...and TOR M1.

 

And no it's not the only US tank in the Chinese tree. Something Something M18, M4 Sherman M60, M8 greyhound, M41, P47, P40....etc...etc.

 

The US Tree as of today is so uninteresting because it's just being nitpicked and much of it's uniqueness is flushed down the drain. China also isn't the only nation to get to many US vehicles. Almost every tree you play now you have US vehicle options. 

 

Nothing is unique atm, so imagine taking the top tier prize of America and just throwing it into the Chinese tree, a notion many Americans would hate.

 

As with trialed export vehicles what's the difference? By giving Tawain the Abrams you are giving China the abrams. Let's not pretend it's any different the way its fleshed out in game. Same with Chinese players being able to use the F-16...It's like gaijin isn't even trying anymore. It's all in the same lineup

 

When I opened up the suggestions today I clicked on "China", not "ROC". The least they could do is change the name of the tree or add both flags to the icon.

 

The ROC sub was ONLY added to give more things to *China*. The tree could not exist and they could just try harder for the Chinese tree vs copy and paste of assets and the world would keep spinning. Theres literally zero reason to even have the ROC tree other than to pad and virtue signal the Chinese tree

Edited by Thug Shaker Actual
  • Confused 6
medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
Yontzee

Yontzee 1,673

Posted (edited)
35 minutes ago, Thug Shaker Actual said:

The Tawainese tree realistically should never be in the Chinese tree. Theyre vastly different entities, but the problem this game creates is that you can use both Chinese and Taiwanese vehicles in the same loadout. Chinese players using the Abrams and a ZTZ 99 is just ridiculous, backed up by their J-8 and F-16...and TOR M1.

 

And no it's not the only US tank in the Chinese tree. Something Something M18, M4 Sherman M60, M8 greyhound, M41, P47, P40....etc...etc.

 

The US Tree as of today is so uninteresting because it's just being nitpicked and much of it's uniqueness is flushed down the drain. China also isn't the only nation to get to many US vehicles. Almost every tree you play now you have US vehicle options. 

 

Nothing is unique atm, so imagine taking the top tier prize of America and just throwing it into the Chinese tree, a notion many Americans would hate.

 

As with trialed export vehicles what's the difference? By giving Tawain the Abrams you are giving China the abrams. Let's not pretend it's any different the way its fleshed out in game. Same with Chinese players being able to use the F-16...It's like gaijin isn't even trying anymore. It's all in the same lineup

 

When I opened up the suggestions today I clicked on "China", not "ROC". The least they could do is change the name of the tree or add both flags to the icon.

 

The ROC sub was ONLY added to give more things to *China*. The tree could not exist and they could just try harder for the Chinese tree vs copy and paste of assets and the world would keep spinning. Theres literally zero reason to even have the ROC tree other than to pad and virtue signal the Chinese tree

As an American who is currently serving in the military and a USA main I have no problem (I don’t speak for everyone, just pointing that out) with the M1A2T, a specially designed variant for the Taiwanese/ROC in the China tree. One Abrams to cap off the ROC side of the tree isn’t going to destroy the game. It’s doesn’t have the unique DU armor, doesn’t use the fancy M829 rounds, it’s just an Abrams designed for ROC export. The USA Tree is still fun, there’s plenty of Abrams variants left that are unique that have special features. I mean we haven’t even gotten to later SEPv3 (and even a SEPv2) later variants with the Trophy yet. Not to mention, there’s still plenty of other vehicles that aren’t Abrams that are going to be fun to play like the Griffin III, the M10 Booker, Stryker variants like the M1134 and M1296 Dragoon, or the USMC’s ACV-30. The Abrams, like the Leopard 2 and the T-90 are exported vehicles and I’m sure we’ll see more of these vehicles in in-game and future trees. You’re still entitled to you’re opinion of course but evidence has shown this is the direction the game is moving. Your best option is to not play it if you don’t like it since you have the option to not unlock it whether its this specific vehicle or a different Abrams let’s say in a future Independent Polish Tree for example.

Edited by Yontzee
  • Confused 1
  • Upvote 3
medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites
 Share
Go to topic listing

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...