Aircraft/Loadouts Bf110C-6 as Premium

[I_MIKE_I 7,651]

Hello,

 

the Bf110C-6 is already in the release tree, yet not marked as a premium Plane.

 

 

As far as I am informed only a few were build (but at least one took part in the BoB), and it wasn't a main-production-model.

 

Therefore my suggestion is to make it a T-1 (with the proposed new System of course) Premium for the Germans.

 

 

 

Why?

 

Many players love "troll cannons" or "derp cannons",  while the overall performance is usually lower than the "normal" armament, people simply like to one-shot stuff. So I can see many people spending GE (=Money) for it which would be not exactly bad for Gaijin's economy.

 

Also, Germany has so far only one Gift-Plane which can join events and this Event isn't related to a historical battle. A Premium-Plane which was at a historical Battle AND can be justified as Premium because it's a relatively rare model and once released as a normal plane the chance would be gone to make money with it.

 

Another reason is, that the plane surely is one of those who people look forward to be implemented, and as a Premium Plane which most likely will be sold often (unless priced like a D-9 or La-5FN) it might find it's way into the Game sooner.

 

Finally, and the most obvious reason: I think it would make players happy,

those who have it because every once in a while you could score a lucky 1-shot,

those who fly against it because it's relatively easy to take down in a fighter plane.

 

Another somewhat important aspect would be two-sided as well:

 

With the new Tier-System, Germany has 2 planes with 2xMG FF each (and the single cannon on the He112, which isn't bad), but those guns are very difficult to use against enemy Bombers, which in the same tier could be ones like the H6K or Catalina that take a huge amount of punishment, one tier above (where it could land, if the pilots do well in it) and planes like the A-20G or B-25 which are pretty much impossible to take down with MG FF from planes that have about the same speed and therefore could close in only slowly.

 

Now, the aspect which speaks for premium in terms of balance is simple: it would otherwise flood the MM (if it still does, you'd at least make a huge amount of money with it) because everyone would think "I'm the one that takes down the Bombers". This would lead with Germany in about the same Situation as currently the U.S. or Japan are (edit: Japan was, G8N1 is pretty much gone): Their teams often consist of one type of plane (Bomber in that case) which the other team can take advantage off (in both cases, Fighters would just wreck the Team note: this was written before B-17 was that resistant and .50s a little less buffed).

 

 

 

 

PS: About the Camo: there is a Photo often mistaken as Bf110C-6 by ZG76, but in fact it's not a C-6. The only unit to use the C-6 was Erprobungsgruppe 210 (short: Erpr.Gr.210) (english: Test Unit 210) which became the Schnellkampfgruppe 210 (SKG 210) (english: Fast Battle Group ... well that sounds stupid...) and finally got absorbed Zerstörergeschwader (ZG) 1 (engl. Destroyer Wing).

 

Here's a Site to an interview with John Vasco (Author of "Bombsights over England", "Sting of the Luftwaffe" and "The Bf110 In Color Profiles" with pictures, including one where he's standing next to former Members of the Erprobungsgruppe 210.

 

http://falkeeins.blogspot.de/2012/11/the-story-behind-luftwaffe-book-john.html

 

Below; group photo of Erprobungsgruppe 210 former members and author John Vasco at Neunkirchen-am-Brand. From left: Karl-Fritz Schröder (3. Staffel); Karl Stoff (1. Staffel) (Pow 17/11/40); Wolfgang Schenck; author John Vasco; Balthasar Aretz (2. Staffel); Gerhard Schlee (2. Staffel); and Edmund Ernst (1. Staffel) (PoW 6/9/40).  Third from left Wolfgang Schenck finished the war with the Luftwaffe equivalent rank of Colonel and was the last Luftwaffe  'Inspector of Jet Fighters' in WW II.

Here's a Bf110C-6 which saw use in the BoB:

 

Bf110C-6 was ready in time for BoB and participated - so it can be used in the BoB Event.

 

Here's a Picture from July 30th 1940, showing (extreme right) Walther Rubernsdörffer (Commander of Erprobungsgruppe 210 who fell on August 15th) in a chat with Albert Kesselring who was visiting the Unit:

 

 

I hope these are enough reasons/sources to give us (NOW!) a Bf110C-6 as Premium in Tier 1.

 

 

Edit: Since the Post is from a time long before Tanks were finding their way into the Game:

 

It would certainly help Germans to fight against the strong Soviet T1 Tanks, like the Gift T-34, T-50 and the currently 2.3 rated T-34 which will be in T1 Matches most of the Time. However, making good use of it against tanks will come with a very high skill-cap,  due to slow RoF, the range+angle needed for a successful attack and the enemy AAA, so it's gonna be balanced out.

 

 

PS: If somebody wonders about the many historical references... the Post was done at a time when we were expecting a Date related MM, rather than the (...) one we actually got. I still think it should be Tier 1, tough - as it would most likely take your entire clip to kill one tank and a normal Bf110C-4 could just drop a Bomb... (but shooting is just so much more fun!).

Edited May 13, 2014 by MIKE1988

[kingoftigertank 73]

this aircraft should be a standard aircraft and not premium

[I_MIKE_I 7,651]

this aircraft should be a standard aircraft and not premium

Why? Only 12 or so were build... and I finally want a capable german premium plane in a low tier which makes some fun. Not just the same one as in the regular tree (He112) or captured ones that are nerfed (P47) or captured ones that can't be afforded (La-5FN) or captured ones that already suck AND get nerfed (Welly).

 

Also, as mentioned, it could be used in at least one historically accurate Event (BoB), unlike the other premium stuff Germany has or is supposed to get.

 

Since I still hope they make the events permanently available, this plane would certainly make it more fun.

[BlitzkriegWulf 4,265]

Errrrr.... 

 

You do realize this is already in the release tree, yes? as a regular plane, right?

 

 

What is the difference between the Mk 101 and Mk 103..? they seem to be the same gun... but do they weigh different or have different rate of fires?

[I_MIKE_I 7,651]

Errrrr.... 

 

You do realize this is already in the release tree, yes? as a regular plane, right?

 

 

What is the difference between the Mk 101 and Mk 103..? they seem to be the same gun... but do they weigh different or have different rate of fires?

Yes, but a Premium Plane that could be used in a Event would be something new for German-Side.

 

As I stated it was a small number of them, which was used only with the Erprobungsgruppe (Evaluation-Group or however you'd like to call it)... it sure can be regular looking at the F-2 Sabre being regular (or I-185) but imo Germany lacks Premium planes which can actually be used. Also, I'd guess it's gonna have a really hard time maintaining itself even if repair costs are low-ish because hitting something with a low RoF gun that only has 10 Rounds per clip (as mentioned can be reloaded from inside) with this thing will be a hard task.

 

"Only 12 were build because the cannon did not succeed in combat"

Mk 101 had a RoF of 260RPM and 920m/s velocity, Mk 103 had 440rpm and 860m/s velocity... Germans considered the Mk101 outdated as it appeared (because of RoF) although the stats match the NS-37 quite well.

 

Looking at tanks, it also had Thungsten-Core AP Rounds, which could penetrate 75mm of Armor at 300m, so if you feel like doin Kamikaze on Tanks this would be quite a chance...

[BlitzkriegWulf 4,265]

Yes, but a Premium Plane that could be used in a Event would be something new for German-Side.

 

As I stated it was a small number of them, which was used only with the Erprobungsgruppe (Evaluation-Group or however you'd like to call it)... it sure can be regular looking at the F-2 Sabre being regular (or I-185) but imo Germany lacks Premium planes which can actually be used. Also, I'd guess it's gonna have a really hard time maintaining itself even if repair costs are low-ish because hitting something with a low RoF gun that only has 10 Rounds per clip (as mentioned can be reloaded from inside) with this thing will be a hard task.

 

"Only 12 were build because the cannon did not succeed in combat"

Mk 101 had a RoF of 260RPM and 920m/s velocity, Mk 103 had 440rpm and 860m/s velocity... Germans considered the Mk101 outdated as it appeared (because of RoF) although the stats match the NS-37 quite well.

 

Looking at tanks, it also had Thungsten-Core AP Rounds, which could penetrate 75mm of Armor at 300m, so if you feel like doin Kamikaze on Tanks this would be quite a chance...

 

 

Hmm. I suppose it could be a premium, but the closest thing (looking at planned tech tree) you'd be able to get is just buying a talisman; the tech tree makes it look like the development want to have it as a regular. 

 

 

Well. seeing as it looks like they were used, and there were 12 of them (Plus prototypes?) it is viable. more were made than F2 sabres. the only thing I would find slightly confusing is how to model a "Reload" for the 30mm. 

 

I dont think the back-seat gunner could reload such a weapon if you're pulling barrel rolls and loops(although, i suppose there are some talented individuals out there). there would have to be some sort of mechanic for stable flight while a 10s reload took place.

 

I honestly dont think the rate of fire is a concern; as you said this gun looks pretty similar to the NS-37,  although it doesn't seem to have the same power behind it (Lower caliber, shorter casing?) but one shell from this should do some pretty serious damage. 

 

 

 

 

 

As for tanks, I think it's mostly just about placement of the shots. IIRC, most tanks didn't have much more than 25mm of armor above the engine deck (and in certain spots, didn't they have -no- armor, due to the openings to vent air out?) 

[I_MIKE_I 7,651]

Hmm. I suppose it could be a premium, but the closest thing (looking at planned tech tree) you'd be able to get is just buying a talisman; the tech tree makes it look like the development want to have it as a regular. 

 

 

Well. seeing as it looks like they were used, and there were 12 of them (Plus prototypes?) it is viable. more were made than F2 sabres. the only thing I would find slightly confusing is how to model a "Reload" for the 30mm. 

 

I dont think the back-seat gunner could reload such a weapon if you're pulling barrel rolls and loops(although, i suppose there are some talented individuals out there). there would have to be some sort of mechanic for stable flight while a 10s reload took place.

 

I honestly dont think the rate of fire is a concern; as you said this gun looks pretty similar to the NS-37,  although it doesn't seem to have the same power behind it (Lower caliber, shorter casing?) but one shell from this should do some pretty serious damage. 

 

 

 

 

 

As for tanks, I think it's mostly just about placement of the shots. IIRC, most tanks didn't have much more than 25mm of armor above the engine deck (and in certain spots, didn't they have -no- armor, due to the openings to vent air out?) 

Talisman on a T1/2 plane isn't really ... interesting. Also I really don't care about RP, since I have no interest in high tiers anyway.

 

The 12 were the "Prototypes", and kinda failed.

 

They didn't have rolls but Magazines, and it was quite common on German Heavy fighters... Bf110 with the Mk101 or later the Bk 3,7 as well as even the Me410 with Bk 5 could be reloaded from inside... and ofc they didn't pull aerobatics while reloading. I dunno about the Ju88 and Ar234 Nightfighters, though... iirc Germans even fitted some He177 with a pair of them on the "chin" to hunt Bombers with it.

 

Well, the Mk101 should have used the "old" Mineshells which had 85g PETN instead of 72g, so I think the power wouldn't be the problem. The thing is a Yak-9T can point it's nose where it wants and catching up to Bombers etc. isn't much of a challenge for it. But a Bf110 isn't that superior to the average Bomber... and hitting fighters with it would be quite a miracle. Even at T1 I think it would be somewhat like the Me410 A-1/U4 at T4.

 

 

Armor is one thing, but the shell has to do anything after it, especially when targeting the engine penetrating the armor isn't gonna do it.

Also, higher penetration means you can do the same from further away.

Edited May 12, 2014 by MIKE1988

[wotertool 5,062]

I wanted to suggest the Hs 129 with the Mk 101 simply to have it ingame, yet, this is even better. The Bf 110, hated by many pilots, is one of my favourite twin engine airplanes in the german tree. With the Mk 101 it will be even better :D

[I_MIKE_I 7,651]

I wanted to suggest the Hs 129 with the Mk 101 simply to have it ingame, yet, this is even better. The Bf 110, hated by many pilots, is one of my favourite twin engine airplanes in the german tree. With the Mk 101 it will be even better :D

Actually, the Bf110 was quite liked irl, some pilots preferred it over the Me410. Though, the C-6 not so much...

[I_MIKE_I 7,651]

Bump... I'm still waiting... ;-;

[I_MIKE_I 7,651]

Have I already mentioned, that it would be nice to have this thing for mixed Battles? >_<

[Smin1080p 60,444]

Suggestion passed to developers   :salute:

[Lassar 9,736]

it's a pretty good a/c as a premium, but for the nearest half a year we have a definite plan for new aircrafts. I think this a/c may be implemented with new version of bf.110 in the future

[leroyonly 4,310]

As the Bf 110 C-6 has been implemented with Operation H.E.A.T.,

 

Moved to Implemented Suggestions.