It should NEVER be possible to lose SLs on a win.

[Tarmok 38]

While I am only extremlly rarely effected by this myself I saw a lot of people talking about as part of the recent conversations.

 

Who even came up with this? Under no circumstances (aside maybe from full on inactivity) should it be possible to actually progress backwards in some sense for succeeding in the game.

While I am not against things like repair costs over all I think they should. remove repair cost or half it for the winning team, that way winning is rewarded, players once again would have an incentive to try and win, not just camp and get kills and 1 spawn quitting would be discouragedas well.

[Razielkaine 4,876]

No offence meant but winning  a battle while contributing just enough to spawn again will lose you money, especially if your not running premium time.  This isn't common but just because you won shouldn't indicate a profit if you've been inefficient for tour team.

 

You mention one spawn and quitting, this is a large problem for players who don't understand that respawning improves your chances of profit. If they die with a loss and quit they won't make that money back, but respawn they can get some kills or caps etc. And make back what they lost on the first spawn.

 

The economy incentivises respawning for profits. (As long as you don't through your lives away)

Edited May 23, 2023 by Razielkaine

[Lanata 29]

I don't believe in punitive measures. If there are a lot of players that spawn once and then leave, there's a problem with the game. If people only play premiums, there is a problem with the game. If people don't play high tier planes or tanks in minor nations, there is a problem with the game.

Repair costs is the reason behind all these issues. If gaijin removed repair costs, that would lead to far less one-spawn leavers, far less tryharding, far more people playing non-premium high tier planes, jets, and ships, and less of the same premium vehicle in every match. Just that one change would drastically improve the quality of the game.

Gaijin thinks of repair costs as a way to 'balance' the game. It does not balance anything, however. A cannon is still a cannon, no matter what price you put on it ―the price doesn't change what it is, only who has access to use it. And this is exactly what they want, because they chose this predatory monetisation strategy.

[Tarmok 38]

@Razielkaine @Lanata While I agree with some of your poits as I see it a removed/reduces repair cost for the winning team is a win for the entire player base. If the 52% avarage win rate that was thrown around recently is true, removing the repair costs would basicly remove half the overall repair cost (likely a bit less as you may have less repair costs on a winning game than a lost one) and even if you half it it would still be a quarter.

 

And what I think is even more important there is literally no one who is losing from that. Even a player far below the 52% win rate will have a net gain as even said player will have some wins.

[SaintGordon 67]

If u remove repair cost you will open the door for AFK botting.

 

You shouldnt lose money if u at least do something. in ground you can cap points, spot enemys, assist. kill enemys.

But most ppl, just hold W and go brain-afk into battle.

than its the repaircosts fault.

too many ppl just dont know what they do and some just dont want to lern.

[Tarmok 38]

7 minutes ago, SaintGordon said:

If u remove repair cost you will open the door for AFK botting.

 

You shouldnt lose money if u at least do something. in ground you can cap points, spot enemys, assist. kill enemys.

But most ppl, just hold W and go brain-afk into battle.

than its the repaircosts fault.

too many ppl just dont know what they do and some just dont want to lern.

 

I tend to disagree.

 

First of, there is not that much to actually gain from "AFK botting" as both research as well as SLs are not earned by simply being in the match.

And for people not knowing what they are doing. On one side I think most people actually try to play good and it often seems worse than it is. Also a player who actually gets more (or in this case loses less) actually has a reason to perform. IF your team is down 3/4 of their tickets people who died once or twice may actually do something to win to reduce their repair instead of sitting on the end of the map. After all what do they really gain from risking another death?

[SaintGordon 67]

i think you dont play the same game as me.

 

50% of my games i lose half of my team in 3 minutes.

Most oh them have less then 100 mission points.

they dont seems to get the game or i just have a lot of bad luck

[Razielkaine 4,876]

3 minutes ago, SaintGordon said:

i think you dont play the same game as me.

 

50% of my games i lose half of my team in 3 minutes.

Most oh them have less then 100 mission points.

they dont seems to get the game or i just have a lot of bad luck

Agreed

[Lanata 29]

10 minutes ago, Tarmok said:

First of, there is not that much to actually gain from "AFK botting" as both research as well as SLs are not earned by simply being in the match.

I agree with this. In naval, you can select your secondary or AA guns, and AI will take over your main guns. I have seen a lot of afk botting in naval.

Even if the repair costs contribute to there being less afk botting, there are plenty of other ways to discourage afk botting. For example: giving rewards when the player does something, and not giving rewards when the player is afk.

6 minutes ago, SaintGordon said:

i think you dont play the same game as me.

 

50% of my games i lose half of my team in 3 minutes.

Most oh them have less then 100 mission points.

they dont seems to get the game or i just have a lot of bad luck

Is this in high/top tier, or rather lower/mid tier? I have this issue a lot in high/top tier. In high/top tier, I also only bring one vehicle with backups rather than multiple vehicles, as I can't afford to use multiple vehicles. I don't see this issue often when I play low/mid tier, though there is still often one or two people in the game that will leave after one death. For context: I play sim where you are guaranteed 3/4 spawns if you have the vehicles.

[ManOfHarlech 4,428]

Removing repair costs? Nah, players need some motivation to do something useful in a match and use the matter between their ears instead of just "yolo hurr-durr wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww"...

Guarantee me my repair cost covered from 1 kill or cap and we can talk. Situation, when I need god knows how many kills to pay for my 15k repair is just keeping me away from spawning that vehicle...

[SaintGordon 67]

i do play mostly BR 9.3 and above.

And i always bring a full lineup.

i have Premium account.

I spawn 2 to 5 times a game and i rarely make negative SL.

I lose SL only 1 in 5 games and the other 4 games gring more then enough SL to be profitable.

And i am not more than average in WT.

 

So just be a benefit for the team and not dead weight and ist fine.

 

 

[Stavroforos 15,367]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrrhic_victory

[SaintGordon 67]

what do you try to say?

or like one of my ex GF sayed to her son: can you talk in sentences?

[Tarmok 38]

13 minutes ago, ManOfHarlech said:

Removing repair costs? Nah, players need some motivation to do something useful in a match and use the matter between their ears instead of just "yolo hurr-durr wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww"...

Guarantee me my repair cost covered from 1 kill or cap and we can talk. Situation, when I need god knows how many kills to pay for my 15k repair is just keeping me away from spawning that vehicle...

 

Did you even read? NOBODY said fully remove repair costs. What I suggested LITERALLY is to motivate players to try.

[ManOfHarlech 4,428]

40 minutes ago, Tarmok said:

 

Did you even read? NOBODY said fully remove repair costs. What I suggested LITERALLY is to motivate players to try.

Surprisingly I did read...

I did read your suggestion to remove repair cost for the victorious team...

And that's what I was reacting to...

I'm not gonna spawn a 15k vehicle just like that and hope for a victory unless the battle is "already over"...

[Tarmok 38]

6 minutes ago, ManOfHarlech said:

I'm not gonna spawn a 15k vehicle just like that and hope for a victory unless the battle is "already over"...

 

You do realize, that there is NO difference to atm, aside from the the fact, that you MAY only pay half or none of that 15k if your team wins. Should you lose it will be the same anyways.

 

No matter the vehicles you can only benefit from it.

Edited May 23, 2023 by Tarmok

[星空高过天陶德胜亲爹ATAT 6]

This will deny the efforts of the losing player

 

[_Zekken 714]

Im personally very much against a system making it easy to fail your way to the top without having to learn properly.

 

It'll make gameplay worse in the long term if you do that. Sometimes these types of barriers of entry tied to a players lack of skills are required for healthy long term gameplay. 

[El Bananito@live 829]

You should not nett an SL loss after a match. Win or lose... I've never thought it's ok to grind backwards and be punished for playing.

[Vamilad 238]

17 hours ago, Razielkaine said:

You mention one spawn and quitting, this is a large problem for players who don't understand that respawning improves your chances of profit. If they die with a loss and quit they won't make that money back, but respawn they can get some kills or caps etc. And make back what they lost on the first spawn.

 

The economy incentivises respawning for profits. (As long as you don't through your lives away)

 

This is completely devoid from reality and ignores the possibility of dying to CAS.

 

You rarely will ever see multiple spawns at top tier beyond spawning in to air or SPAA.  No one is willing to take a second 8k tank with the possibility and almost guarantee to die from orbit with no recourse but to spawn SPAA and offer yourself to your spawn being over run or again a bomb from orbit.  You need 4+ kills to break even with SPAA or more in most cases. 

 

Even ignoring the reality of CAS you refuse to acknowledge that after your first spawn you will lose the initiative on whatever engagement you set yourself to.  Players will already be in sniping positions or on flanks.  Your first spawn will always be the most profitable one.  This is the game's reality that the developers have created.

 

Unless repair costs are negligible or there is a system which prevents a negative SL change then one death leaving will remain the status quo as it has been for years.

[Ggoddkkiller 1,235]

I really have no idea how some people claiming things like ''contributing to the team would make you earn more'' while in reality SL rewards of EVERYTHING are reduced. This is the actual reason how people can earn points to spawn again but not earn enough SL to cover their repair cost not because they aren't actually contributing to their teams!! Every single reward out there must be increased heavily and removed rewards like bouncing must be added back then repair cost wouldn't be this much of problem. Also people wouldn't quit as soon as they realize the match is lost to reduce their repair cost and yep, this is the exact reason why matches are ending in few minutes...

Edited May 24, 2023 by Ggoddkkiller

[Jarms 1,558]

18 hours ago, Lanata said:

I don't believe in punitive measures. If there are a lot of players that spawn once and then leave, there's a problem with the game. If people only play premiums, there is a problem with the game. If people don't play high tier planes or tanks in minor nations, there is a problem with the game.

Repair costs is the reason behind all these issues. If gaijin removed repair costs, that would lead to far less one-spawn leavers, far less tryharding, far more people playing non-premium high tier planes, jets, and ships, and less of the same premium vehicle in every match. Just that one change would drastically improve the quality of the game.

Gaijin thinks of repair costs as a way to 'balance' the game. It does not balance anything, however. A cannon is still a cannon, no matter what price you put on it ―the price doesn't change what it is, only who has access to use it. And this is exactly what they want, because they chose this predatory monetisation strategy.

Personally I’d prefer some sort of repair cost discount for playing multiple vehicles in a game.

- Spawn 1 vehicle: Full repair cost.

- Spawn 2 vehicles: 5% discount.

- Spawn 3 vehicles: 10% discount.

- Spawn 4 vehicles: 15% discount.

- Etc.

 

This rewards active players and penalises 1 death leavers. It also rewards people who purchase extra crew slots, as they can spawn additional vehicles increasing their discount.

 

I think it’s unreasonable to suggest 0 repair costs. A reduction sure, but I doubt we’d ever seen them removed.

[Lulzwhat 89]

18 hours ago, Tarmok said:

It should NEVER be possible to lose SLs on a win.

 

Reasonable suggestion but here's the problem...

In such case everyone will turn to play nation with current highest winrate.

And other nations will suffer.

It will bring even more economy disbalance than today.

[Razielkaine 4,876]

2 hours ago, Vamilad said:

 

This is completely devoid from reality and ignores the possibility of dying to CAS.

 

You rarely will ever see multiple spawns at top tier beyond spawning in to air or SPAA.  No one is willing to take a second 8k tank with the possibility and almost guarantee to die from orbit with no recourse but to spawn SPAA and offer yourself to your spawn being over run or again a bomb from orbit.  You need 4+ kills to break even with SPAA or more in most cases. 

 

Even ignoring the reality of CAS you refuse to acknowledge that after your first spawn you will lose the initiative on whatever engagement you set yourself to.  Players will already be in sniping positions or on flanks.  Your first spawn will always be the most profitable one.  This is the game's reality that the developers have created.

 

Unless repair costs are negligible or there is a system which prevents a negative SL change then one death leaving will remain the status quo as it has been for years.

Doesn't ignore cas at all.

 

People multi spawn all the time.  Not sure where you get this rubbish from. 8k or even 10k is not expensive or hard to earn.  You want expensive try the French 6.7 lineup before the economy changes that cost 30k each to repair.

 

Respawning does not lose the initiative, not spawning does.  Attrition is what wins these battles and not spawning just gives the win to the enemy.  First spawn most profitable?  Show me the proof of this completely subjective statement.

 

You continue to understand math.  If you die forst spawn and achieved nothing and quit you have a far greater chance of losing and will not make back the money you lost on that vehicle.  Respawn you increase your chances of winning and can make back the losses of the first tank and make profits.

 

 

Edited May 24, 2023 by Razielkaine

[_Pterodacty91855 193]

The entire game is designed so you bleed SL win or lose.  

 

• F-14B (US) :
  • Rank 8
  • BR : 12.0
  • Located after the F-14A
  • Stock Repair Cost : 4560 / 9160 / 15250 SL
  • Spaded Repair Cost : 7542 / 15150 / 25223 SL

25k repair cost at 12.0 means you can get 3-4 kills on a victory, but if you also get destroyed and lose the jet the repair cost will put you in the negative.  Why even add the jet in the game at a 25k repair cost? When I got the F5E I loved it.  Played it until my free repairs were up and then shelved it.  Never played it again.  At 19k repair cost with 2 Aim9J's who in their right mind would play that?  The F-4J has a 12k repait cost in comparison, and is a much better aircraft, and until recently with the BR changes they were in the same tier for a long time.  

 

High repair costs just make sure people dont play the vehicle.  Its dumb and pointless.