Battlerating Overview updated

[SCCOJake 1,060]

1. You are never matched against planes more than 1 tier higher or lower than your plane, e.g. Tier I can never fly against tier III. 
 

 

I don't know if someone else covered this in here or not, but this is 100% false.  It's rare, but you absolutely can be matched with someone who has planes 2 tiers higher than your highest.  If you need proof I can direct you to my YouTube channel where I fly out in a Tier 2 Zero and get matched up with a guy flying the premium P-51 (Tier 4).

 

I admit that this is rare, but saying that it never happens is just wrong.

[Cth_ulu 203]

This whole BR rating thing needs to go away.

 

Planes need to be flown, even in arcade, according to ERA.  There were times when the Germans, Italians, and Japanese did have air superiority because they simply had the best planes in the air at that time.

 

Make the Eras Pre-war 34-37, Early war late 37 to 39, Early Mid 40 to 41, Mid 42 -43, early late 44 Late 45 and post war. 

 

This would mean planes would be pooled based mostly on the eras they appeared in,  it would also mean that you could have planes of all era mixing it up in late 45 (due to having the availability there.  And it wouldn't depend on johnny Twitch doing well with it now, or BROKENDAMAGE MODEL EXPLOITER MAN doing well with it while it was broken for it's BR to be Set.

 

BR can still be tracked and used as a subset but game matching should always be on eras.    

[Quax0815 1,989]

I updated the BRs according to patch 1.43 (see first post of the thread).

 

A lot of new planes, but no BR-changes so far.

[SENAdmiral 2,030]

I updated the Battlerating Overview after the new patch.
 
The Rules of Matchmaking are: (edited June 6th 2014)
 
1. You are never matched against planes more than 1 tier higher or lower than your plane, e.g. Tier I can never fly against tier III. 
 
2. The MM matches your plane against planes with a BR not higher or lower than 1.0 (since patch 1.39). Remember, the BR figures ingame are rounded, so 2.3 is 2.33 internally and 2.7 is 2.66. The steps are always 1/3 exactly.
 
The BR of an Arcade-Set is an average of the highest 3 planes, calculated by this formula: http://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/125109-battle-rating-for-arcade-matchmaking-explanied-139/
 
3. Depending on your win/loss-rate (not K/D-ratio) of your last 10 games in a given plane you may get a bonus to your planes BR, if you performed badly. This bonus is maximum 0.66 (=0.7), but usually just 0.33. The penalty for good performance, we had before 1.39, was removed.

This rule was canceled June 6th 2014.

 

 

This means, that in worst case the MM will match you in Arcade against planes 1.3 higher than your plane! In RB/SB it is 1.0.
 
If you find errors in the PDF, please let me know.
 
 
1.43.7.16 (October 9th 2014)

 

 

 

 

 

Wrong my friend here: "This means, that in worst case the MM will match you in Arcade against planes 1.3 higher than your plane! " ;

 

I meet planes 1,4 higher then my top plane. Before 143, even 1,7 higher; In Arcade , with BR manipulation,a 5,7 can be lowered at 5,3 then face a 4,3 plane : right now are tons of plp who do this ! So, 1,4 NOT 1,3 its correct.

 

 
If you are interested in the older versions since 1.37, please download from the german forum:
http://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/87360-battleranks-übersicht/

Edited October 9, 2014 by SENAdmiral

[Quax0815 1,989]

I meet planes 1,4 higher then my top plane. Before 143, even 1,7 higher; In Arcade , with BR manipulation,a 5,7 can be lowered at 5,3 then face a 4,3 plane : right now are tons of plp who do this ! So, 1,4 NOT 1,3 its correct.

Actually it seems that the max. difference is not 1.4 or 1.3 but 1.33. Because 5.7 is 5.66 and 4.3 is 4.33 internally. So 1.4 = 1.3 in Gaijin's World.

Either way, thanks for the hint, I will change the text for more clarity. Edited October 9, 2014 by Quax0815

[iYRe 587]

I have had planes 2 BR higher, because its not THE plane, but the average:

example: (5+4+4)/3 = 4.3 (because more than 1BR it only takes the highest one)

Which is 1.3 higher than my BR3 Avg - and I quit often am fighting these planes in my BR planes. So, Lagg 3 vsbearcat, or LA7, Spit Mk XIVe - etc.

[Quax0815 1,989]

In Arcade the max. BR difference between 2 plane-sets (average according to Gaijins rule as linked above) is 1.0! This range was reduced from 1.3 a few patches ago. They also removed these BR penalties based on player-efficiency, which could spread the BR range even more.

 

However, if one player downgrades his highest plane correctly via averaging (e.g. 5.3 + 5.0 + 4.7 = 5.0), but the other player does not (e.g. 4.0 + 4.0 + 3.7 = 4.0), a 4.0 plane does face a 5.3 plane. This is a difference of 1.3 (could be even 1.4 in an other example). But the difference between the 2 sets is still 5.0 - 4.0 = 1.0! 

Edited October 10, 2014 by Quax0815

[Ghond 569]

Yes, I can put a 7.3 saber against bombers and propeller planes easy now.

http://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/162293-squad-br-in-rb/

 

Thank you forced squads.

Edited October 10, 2014 by Ghond

[HoneyBadgah 288]

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the max amount that you can "lower" your BR 0.3? As in: if you have a 5.3 plane, no matter how much lower the other two planes are, you are getting 5.0 average BR.

[NectariaCoutayar 16,572]

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the max amount that you can "lower" your BR 0.3? As in: if you have a 5.3 plane, no matter how much lower the other two planes are, you are getting 5.0 average BR.

 

That's how it is supposed to work yes.

[HoneyBadgah 288]

That's how it is supposed to work yes.

 

So Bossman is full of shite then, seeing as how a 5+4+4 person would have an average BR of 4.7, not 4.3, giving a BR difference of 1.7 (vs a 3.0 average) which is higher than the servers allow for MM. So he could not possibly have seen Lagg-3 vs Bearcat, unless he brought a much higher BR plane in his roster and decided to spawn in a Lagg. In fact: given how someone fielding a Bearcat has a minimum BR of 4.7 (since the Bearcat is at 5.0) the lowest they can face is 3.7 regardless if we are using 1.0 or 1.3 max BR difference because it always rounds up (4.7-1.3=3.4 which is higher than 3.33, leaving us with the next "spot" which is 3.7, and if we are using 4.7-1.0=3.7). So long as the Lagg-3-66 has a comparable BR to your highest BR plane (for instance, 3.3+3 lagg+3), you will not be matched against Bearcats. And if you are fielding an airplane with a much higher BR than the Lagg-3-66 (say, 4.0+4.0+3.0 which gives 3.66 - that is what 3.7 actually is), then why are you complaining over facing Bearcats? Heck recently I have been using the B-25 - which has 3.7 BR for an average of 3.3 - and I don't think that I have ever faced Bearcats.

Edited October 10, 2014 by HoneyBadgah

[SENAdmiral 2,030]

In Arcade the max. BR difference between 2 plane-sets (average according to Gaijins rule as linked above) is 1.0! This range was reduced from 1.3 a few patches ago. They also removed these BR penalties based on player-efficiency, which could spread the BR range even more.

 

However, if one player downgrades his highest plane correctly via averaging (e.g. 5.3 + 5.0 + 4.7 = 5.0), but the other player does not (e.g. 4.0 + 4.0 + 3.7 = 4.0), a 4.0 plane does face a 5.3 plane. This is a difference of 1.3 (could be even 1.4 in an other example). But the difference between the 2 sets is still 5.0 - 4.0 = 1.0! 

 

 

NOP again !

 

If you go on 5,7 + 4 + 4 for ex you get 5,3 - so a 0,4 lower, not 0,3.

[SENAdmiral 2,030]

So Bossman is full of shite then, seeing as how a 5+4+4 person would have an average BR of 4.7, not 4.3, giving a BR difference of 1.7 (vs a 3.0 average) which is higher than the servers allow for MM. So he could not possibly have seen Lagg-3 vs Bearcat, unless he brought a much higher BR plane in his roster and decided to spawn in a Lagg. In fact: given how someone fielding a Bearcat has a minimum BR of 4.7 (since the Bearcat is at 5.0) the lowest they can face is 3.7 regardless if we are using 1.0 or 1.3 max BR difference because it always rounds up (4.7-1.3=3.4 which is higher than 3.33, leaving us with the next "spot" which is 3.7, and if we are using 4.7-1.0=3.7). So long as the Lagg-3-66 has a comparable BR to your highest BR plane (for instance, 3.3+3 lagg+3), you will not be matched against Bearcats. And if you are fielding an airplane with a much higher BR than the Lagg-3-66 (say, 4.0+4.0+3.0 which gives 3.66 - that is what 3.7 actually is), then why are you complaining over facing Bearcats? Heck recently I have been using the B-25 - which has 3.7 BR for an average of 3.3 - and I don't think that I have ever faced Bearcats.

 

 

What you need to understand its the "rounding up" its a two ways thing: Indeed they say you can max lower by 0,3 BUT they just "forgot"  the part where the 5,7 get lowered at 5,3.

Just make a line of 5,7 and 5 + 5  you will end with a 5,3 ! (its a 5,333...) BUT appear 5,3.

 

You will meet down to 4,3, where your 5,7 plane will club a 4,3 one, if are any.

 

The same work with 6,7 Jet +  6.0 + 6.0 and you club props with your 6,3 "average" since you will meet 5,3 props like mine line of 5,3  on the same example.

 

 

 

one image its more then 1000 words:

 

Edited October 10, 2014 by SENAdmiral

[HoneyBadgah 288]

What you need to understand its the "rounding up" its a two ways thing: Indeed they say you can max lower by 0,3 BUT they just "forgot"  the part where the 5,7 get lowered at 5,3.

Just make a line of 5,7 and 5 + 5  you will end with a 5,3 ! (its a 5,333...) BUT appear 5,3.

 

You will meet down to 4,3, where your 5,7 plane will club a 4,3 one, if are any.

 

The same work with 6,7 Jet +  6.0 + 6.0 and you club props with your 6,3 "average" since you will meet 5,3 props like mine line of 5,3  on the same example.

 

 

 

one image its more then 1000 words:

 

 

 

Actually, yeah, I was a bit careless: the rounding thing is 0.33. 5.7 is *actually* 5.66, and 5.3 is *actually* 5.33 like you wrote yourself. Its just that it is easier to just call it 0.3 instead (and there may be programming reasons behind it)

 

So when you use a 5.7+5+5 lineup, you are actually using a 5.66+5+5 lineup and are reducing it by a maximum of 0.33, which incidentally is 5.33 (what shows as 5.3). 

 

Similarly, when you use a 5+4+4 lineup, you are lowering it to 4.66 (not 4.33). The lowest you can face at 4.66 is an opponent with average BR 3.66 (if we go by the 1.0 Br spread) or 3.33 (if we go by the 1.33 BR spread) - both of whom are higher than 3.0. For you to have to face anyone with 4.66 when you have a Lagg, you would need at least 3.33 on two planes and 3.0 on the last one (which gives 3.22 - but that rounds up to 3.33 for whatever reason). There are only two Russian planes with 3.33 BR: The Yak-7B and the Pe-3 - none of whom are Laggs. Simply put: if indeed you are up against Bearcats in Laggs, the Lagg is not ever your highest BR plane - so the statement lacks meaning. Heck if I equip my Bf 109 K4 and then only two He 51s, and only spawn in the He 51s, I would probably face Bearcats in a He 51. And mind you: this is still only possible if we go by the max 1.33 BR spread, which according to people on this very thread has been changed anyway to 1.0. 

 

To add further: making such a combination (Yak-7B, Pe-3 and Lagg-3-66 as your highest BR planes) appears as an exceptional rarity as the two have an entire tier between them with plenty of planes such as the Yak-9T, the I-185 (M82), the last I-16 and the Pe-2 lines "between" them (as in: traditionally researched before and *far* more common in WT than the Pe-3). All of whom have higher BR than 3.0 as well, which would typically leave the Lagg as the *lowest* BR plane in  your roster when going up against Bearcats. Doubly so considering how rare it is for an average 3.33 player to come across Bearcats - again I have never encountered them in my B-25J (average BR 3.33).

 

At 1.0 max spread, you would need an average BR of 3.66 to face Bearcats. To achieve that, you would need at least two 3.66 planes and one 3.33 plane - leaving the Lagg far behind in your roster.

 

 

 

Similarly, the 4.33 BR plane you were clubbing in your 5.66 plane would - likely - be the lowest BR plane in the other persons roster. Now I am not saying that the MM is fair: obviously it is theoretically possible for a 4.33+4.33+4 player to go up against a 5.66+5+5 player and that is - plainly - unfair (for instance, FW 190 A5/U2 vs Bf 109 F4/Trop). But it is hardly "Lagg as highest BR vs Bearcat as highest BR" unfair. Frankly you are just as likely to be ranked in a match where you are at the higher end of the BR spectrum than at the lower one (enemies at 3.33 when you have 4.33).

Edited October 10, 2014 by HoneyBadgah

[Quax0815 1,989]

NOP again !
 
If you go on 5,7 + 4 + 4 for ex you get 5,3 - so a 0,4 lower, not 0,3.

I already wrote 
 

This is a difference of 1.3 (could be even 1.4 in an other example).

So, don't worry, I got your point.

Your main problem is, that you still calculate with the figures you see on your screen like 5.7 and 5.3. But these are obviously just rounded figures for presentation only. Calculating with 5.33 and 5.66 makes live much easier in War Thunder.

[Plane_in_Vain 845]

I've just come from a battle where my highest BR was 3.3 and several players had 4.7. I wasn't in a squad or anything like that.

 

Edit: I've just read the bits about rounding - I'm guessing I'm a victim of that. 

Edited October 11, 2014 by Plane_in_Vain

[_Skippy_ 240]

Yep unless the MM BR calcs have changed, the spread should still be 1.0 so your encounter with the 4.7s sounds feasible (assuming those players lowered their BRs to 4.3 with their 2nd and 3rd planes).

Been seeing some murmurs about the autosquad breaking things, but haven't seen evidence of that first-hand myself, yet. Edited October 11, 2014 by _Skippy_

[Quax0815 1,989]

I edited some mistakes in version 1.49.9.29.

 

Download the new version from the initial post.

[Agent_Of_Change 2,231]

1. You are never matched against planes more than 1 tier higher or lower than your plane, e.g. Tier I can never fly against tier III. 
 

 

This is incorrect.  Based on BR you can and will get matched well outside the tier of your aircraft.  eg. With an all T3 lineup with the FW190 A5/U2 (BR5.7)  you will see low T5 jets.  so you can get at least 2 tiers above your craft.

 

The MM doesn't care about Tier as far as I can tell, or if it does it's the first gate that breaks.

Edited November 6, 2014 by Agent_Of_Change

[Red_Angel_6 582]

This is incorrect.  Based on BR you can and will get matched well outside the tier of your aircraft.  eg. With an all T3 lineup with the FW190 A5/U2 (BR5.7)  you will see low T5 jets.  so you can get at least 2 tiers above your craft.

 

The MM doesn't care about Tier as far as I can tell, or if it does it's the first gate that breaks.

 

Yeah, but for clarity, it is coded to not go beyond 2 Tiers.   Todace in the MM and BR answers thread confirmed that this was the case.  However rare, though, you are right to say T3 can see T5.  Obviously the MM will try and avoid that, but if that is the only match it can make, it will do so.

[Agent_Of_Change 2,231]

Yeah, but for clarity, it is coded to not go beyond 2 Tiers.   Todace in the MM and BR answers thread confirmed that this was the case.  However rare, though, you are right to say T3 can see T5.  Obviously the MM will try and avoid that, but if that is the only match it can make, it will do so.

 

But it's not rare which is the point, last night 4 out of 4 matches with the A5/U2 i'm seeing jets.

 

Gaijin can tell you "it's not coded that way, but then Gaijin doesn't seem to know what it's code is doing half the time.  With the disaster they've made with Br's the only thing I've seen that seems to matter is BR and even them due to averaging it is possible to run into a plane a full 1.7 higher than your highest plane.

 

The only reason i mentioned it is that seeing planes 2 tiers higher is common enough that it seems misleading to tell people it can't or won't happen.

[Red_Angel_6 582]

But it's not rare which is the point, last night 4 out of 4 matches with the A5/U2 i'm seeing jets.

 

Gaijin can tell you "it's not coded that way, but then Gaijin doesn't seem to know what it's code is doing half the time.  With the disaster they've made with Br's the only thing I've seen that seems to matter is BR and even them due to averaging it is possible to run into a plane a full 1.7 higher than your highest plane.

 

The only reason i mentioned it is that seeing planes 2 tiers higher is common enough that it seems misleading to tell people it can't or won't happen.

 

 

I guess it depends what time of day you play, the BR you select and which server you are on.  I am on the EU server and there are generally 50 to 60 thousand on line in the evening, so the MM does not have to stretch much.

 

I am agreeing with you by the way, just saying it cannot go to 3 tiers, but certainly can go to two.

[Quax0815 1,989]

The 1-Tier rule is still active. Perhaps the MM makes execeptions out of prime-time.

 

It is pretty easy to check. Fly the Hellcat Premium during prime-time with an average Set-BR of 2.3 in AB together with just lower planes in your set, e.g. the 2 Hurricanes. The MM will need a lot of time, exeptionally more time than usual, to get a match for you. 10 Minutes and more is not unusual for this set. I even saw matches in AB during prime-time this way with 4 players and 4 bots in every team. Fully impossible otherwise on this tier during primetime. But the Hellcat is that much out of bounds, that the MM has a very hard time to find a match for you, without breaking the 1-Tier-Rule.

 

Perhaps you had a Tier IV plane in your line-up together with your Fw 190 on BR 5.7? For the 1-Tier-Rule the tier of the highest plane counts.

 

I never had an issue with jets and high-tier III planes. But honestly, from my point of view, jets in Tier IV AB matches are just victims anyways. At least in 9 out of 10 matches they are, just if I face jets at all on Tier IV. But I have to admit, that I play almost only during primetime (50K+ players). And with Tier IV props I play with a max Set-BR in AB of 6.0. I rarely see jets. And if I face just a few of them, they are easily dodged.

Edited November 6, 2014 by Quax0815

[SCCOJake 1,060]

The 1-Tier rule is still active. Perhaps the MM makes execeptions out of prime-time.

 

It is pretty easy to check. Fly the Hellcat Premium during prime-time with an average Set-BR of 2.3 in AB together with just lower planes in your set, e.g. the 2 Hurricanes. The MM will need a lot of time, exeptionally more time than usual, to get a match for you. 10 Minutes and more is not unusual for this set. I even saw matches in AB during prime-time this way with 4 players and 4 bots in every team. Fully impossible otherwise on this tier during primetime. But the Hellcat is that much out of bounds, that the MM has a very hard time to find a match for you, without breaking the 1-Tier-Rule.

 

Perhaps you had a Tier IV plane in your line-up together with your Fw 190 on BR 5.7? For the 1-Tier-Rule the tier of the highest plane counts.

 

I never had an issue with jets and high-tier III planes. But honestly, from my point of view, jets in Tier IV AB matches are just victims anyways. At least in 9 out of 10 matches they are, just if I face jets at all on Tier IV. But I have to admit, that I play almost only during primetime (50K+ players). And with Tier IV props I play with a max Set-BR in AB of 6.0. I rarely see jets. And if I face just a few of them, they are easily dodged.

 

The devs have said that there is no 1 tier rule, it's a 2 tier rule.  With normal BRs that reflect the tier the spread should not normally go beyond 1 tier, but you can, will and do get matches where a lineup of, for example, tier 2 and tier 1 planes can face a lineup with a tier 4 max.  When you get BRs that are so far away from their own tier, such as the Fw 190 A5/U2 now, you will be much more likely to see that 2 tier spread.  This is because, no matter what other planes you take for a pure tier 3 or lower lineup, your can't average you BR down more than 0.3 (as far as I know).  The best case scenario for the A5/U2 is to get a 5.7 BR.  There are more than enough jets in Tier 5 with a BR of 6.0 to 6.7 that you will get matched with them from time to time.  Also, since there is now a Saber that sits at 7.0, it can average down to 6.7, which is totally within rage of the poor A5/U2's best case BR of 5.7.  The match you get depends on your average BR and the total number of people playing within your BR range.  There are a lot of people playing with a BR average of 6.7 that have multiple jets.

[Quax0815 1,989]

The devs have said that there is no 1 tier rule, it's a 2 tier rule.  With normal BRs that reflect the tier the spread should not normally go beyond 1 tier, but you can, will and do get matches where a lineup of, for example, tier 2 and tier 1 planes can face a lineup with a tier 4 max.  

 

If you could show me a link, where an Gaijin official posted this, I will correct my overview about the rules above.