tanks/vehicles Schützenpanzer Marder 1A3

[Rohrkrepiererer 1,393]

13 minutes ago, dotEXCEL said:

why not

 

I mean, it would make the most sense, the 20mm auto cannon won't do a lot of damage against MBTs, and we would have a turreted ATGM armed vehicle on 3 out of 5 tank nations.

[Dalles 56]

+1

[Rohrkrepiererer 1,393]

Why aren't more people talking about this? It is kind of the german Sheridan...

[Retry 7,363]

Just now, Rohrkrepiererer said:

Why aren't more people talking about this? It is kind of the german Sheridan...

...It's not like the German Sheridan at all.

[Rohrkrepiererer 1,393]

2 hours ago, Retry said:

...It's not like the German Sheridan at all.

Its got no armor, is highly mobile, has a machinecannon comparable to a 50 cal, has a turret and launches ATGMs.

Considering all aspects that would be modeled in the game, it is.

Edited February 19, 2017 by Rohrkrepiererer

[Retry 7,363]

58 minutes ago, Rohrkrepiererer said:

Its got no armor, is highly mobile, has a machinecannon comparable to a 50 cal, has a turret and launches ATGMs.

Considering all aspects that would be modeled in the game, it is.

The M551 Sheridan is not that mobile, has a 152mm gun-launcher thing, is half the mass of a Marder 1, has rubbish aluminum "armor" and considerably smaller dimensionally as well.

The Marder 1 can actually resist 20mm and 25mm APDS rounds from short range with its RHA which is more than what one can say for the Sheridan, but the 20mm cannon isn't much better than that found on the '40s Wirbelwind.  Even "poorly armored" vehicles like the SU-122-54, Kanonenjagdpanzer, and Conway would likely be immune to the 20mm from the front, which means its only really potent weapon is its six MILAN missiles, which are exposed on the commander's cupola.

It's a German Bradley, not a Sheridan.  A less potent, crappy version of the Bradley, but a Bradley nonetheless.

 

Seriously, if you go with IFVs for all nations Germany will get the short end of the stick.  Their Marder 1 is one of the less-well armored and armed options of the Cold War.  At the time the Marder 1A3 was being introduced, the US was rocking their upgraded M2 Bradleys, the Brits were fighting in their Warriors, and the Japanese of all nations probably had a nasty little bugger called the Type 89.  The Slavs would have good armour on their BMP-3 with 30mm cannon protection at 200 meters, plus with a hefty power-to-weight, a 100mm gun-launcher and a 30mm autocannon they didn't really need it anyways.  Making the Marder 1A3 kind of garbage in comparison to the other nation's big ones of the same time period.

 

The only other IFV Germany would have to fight back is their Marder II.  Its 35mm or 50mm gun and heavy armour for its class would be able to take on the other IFVs in a fight with ease, but it loses the ATGM, which is kind of important.  So Germany either gets the ability to kill IFVs handily while being target practice for real tanks, or they get a tank-killing ATGM (that's one of the less effective ones of all the ATGM equipped vehicles btw) at the cost of struggling to actually kill anything with its main cannon.

[Shinzu 460]

Marder 1A3 also had the  MILAN DM82 / 1 ^^

Some info about Marder 1 and the MILAN DM82 / 1 system penetration/range/combat load

Spoiler

Source: "Worldwide Equipment Guide 2007" Page: 101/102/188

Edited February 20, 2017 by Shinzu

[Retry 7,363]

2 minutes ago, Shinzu said:

Marder 1A3 also had the MILAN 1 system ^^

Yeah, I know, I included that into the analysis.

 

The Bradley has a better main cannon AND ATGM system in the TOW.  I-TOW has similar penetration to the MILAN 1, TOW 2 has superior penetration to the MILAN 2, both are significantly faster ATGMs.

 

The Warrior can also mount a MILAN 1 system in addition to its superior RARDEN autocannon.

 

Type 89 Jyu-MAT is roughly equivalent to the MILAN 1, and its 35mm cannon is much more powerful.  The armor is more effective as well.

 

BMP-3 has a freaking Bastion ATGM which is launched at 500 m/s initially and has SALH guidance.

 

The Marder 1A3 is least competitive among the nation's available IFVs.

[Shinzu 460]

1 hour ago, Retry said:

Yeah, I know, I included that into the analysis.

 

The Bradley has a better main cannon AND ATGM system in the TOW.  I-TOW has similar penetration to the MILAN 1, TOW 2 has superior penetration to the MILAN 2, both are significantly faster ATGMs.

 

The Warrior can also mount a MILAN 1 system in addition to its superior RARDEN autocannon.

 

Type 89 Jyu-MAT is roughly equivalent to the MILAN 1, and its 35mm cannon is much more powerful.  The armor is more effective as well.

 

BMP-3 has a freaking Bastion ATGM which is launched at 500 m/s initially and has SALH guidance.

 

The Marder 1A3 is least competitive among the nation's available IFVs.

Yeah but compare the date of introduction. Marder 1 was equipped with MILAN 1 in 1977

Type 89 prototypes are from 1984 and were first introduced 1989

BMP-3 prototypes from 1980 and first introduced 1990

The Bradley and Warrior are closer to the Marder 1A3 but still introduced 3-4 years later.

The Marder 1A3 is the oldest so to say.

Edited February 20, 2017 by Shinzu

[Retry 7,363]

Quote

Yeah but compare the date of introduction. Marder 1 was equipped with MILAN 1 in 1977

Yeah, the A1, but he's not suggesting the A1.

Either way, the Russians would still have the upper hand around the early 70s to mid 80s in BMP-2s with a better autocannon and Konkurs ATGMs.

Quote

Type 89 prototypes are from 1984 and were first introduced 1989

BMP-3 prototypes from 1980 and first introduced 1990

The Bradley and Warrior are closer to the Marder 1A3 but still introduced 3-4 years later.

Marder A3 upgrade program began in '88, making the BMP-3, Type 89, Warrior, and Bradley peers.

[dotEXCEL 5,969]

34 minutes ago, Retry said:

Yeah, the A1, but he's not suggesting the A1.

Either way, the Russians would still have the upper hand around the early 70s to mid 80s in BMP-2s with a better autocannon and Konkurs ATGMs.

Marder A3 upgrade program began in '88, making the BMP-3, Type 89, Warrior, and Bradley peers.

and still would break the meta now that we got hull break. i asked cokespray, he sees no problem for the A3.

[Mercedes4321 4,695]

Now if we want to get ridiculous with the Marder

 

 

 

 

I'm reasonably sure that would cause the ATGM haters to have an aneurysm from sheer rage.

Edited March 23, 2017 by Mercedes4321

[Rohrkrepiererer 1,393]

1 hour ago, Mercedes4321 said:

Now if we want to get ridiculous with the Marder

 

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I'm reasonably sure that would cause the ATGM haters have an aneurysm from sheer rage.

 

Bro, do you even lift?

[BucketOfKnobs 81]

While I would like to see this in game cos its cool, I just don't see how it'd fit, its more of an AA unit than a light tank, it would have trouble penning the tanks at its BR (which would have to be high is its sort of modern). If it got introduced as a AA unit I would have no problem with it but as a light tank, I don't see it happening.

Edited March 23, 2017 by BucketOfKnobs

[Wilhuff_Tarkin_ 467]

Modern IFV in general should be either kept out of the game or put on highest possible BR. They will make standard "ATGM only" vehicles obsolete.

For example. Let's imagine British TT get top tier Light tank FV 107 Scimitar and top ATGM FV102 Striker. Than you introduce FV 510 Warrior that can do the job of both those vehicle just as good.

Why would you choose Cannon only or ATGM only tank if you can pick vehicle that can do both ? I like IFVs but do not fit into the game in my opinion.

[Mercedes4321 4,695]

7 hours ago, Rohrkrepiererer said:

 

Bro, do you even lift?

There was also a Leopard version

[Rohrkrepiererer 1,393]

3 hours ago, Mercedes4321 said:

There was also a Leopard version

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

 

 

Seennit on your WT Live already. Pretty neat.

[Wilhuff_Tarkin_ 467]

6 hours ago, Mercedes4321 said:

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[dotEXCEL 5,969]

@Mercedes4321 sadly never went into production would be annoying as hell. new level of going hull down

Edited September 30, 2017 by dotEXCEL

[Mr_Hunter_99 781]

late +1

[dotEXCEL 5,969]

attention attention this is a bump

[Retry 7,363]

3 minutes ago, dotEXCEL said:

attention attention this is a bump

Ok but only if Russia gets a BMP-3

[Rohrkrepiererer 1,393]

1 hour ago, Retry said:

Ok but only if Russia gets a BMP-3

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just kiddin, I'd be fine with that...

[Mercedes4321 4,695]

28 minutes ago, Rohrkrepiererer said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just kiddin, I'd be fine with that...

And what does everyone else get in this deal?

[Retry 7,363]

8 minutes ago, Mercedes4321 said:

And what does everyone else get in this deal?

M2 Bradley, Type 89 IFV, FV Warrior