ukraine Ukraine Ground Forces Tree

[leroyonly 4,310]

Guys, keep it on topic. I know that this will stay as a rather volitile topic for the foreseeable future however do keep politics out of it. So far most of you guys have been keeping this suggestion on-topic, please keep it that way. I also cleaned up some of the off-topic stuff.

[Mahiwew 528]

57 minutes ago, ZVO_12_INCH said:

No!...You don't know much about history...
according to the current dates of independence....
1. UNR-9 (22) January 1918 as UNR (from Russia)
August 24, 1991 (from the USSR) ...
2. Poland-November 11, 1918 (from the RSFSR) ...
3. If we take the history of the Slavs, then this is the Prague-Korchak culture-originally (IV-V Century)...The region of Southern Poland/Slovakia/North-Western Ukraine...
4. Also, Kiev, according to any Dating, as an Independent city and a Tribal center, is the oldest among Slavic cities...

What exactly do tribal societies have to do with a game about 1930<'s vehicles?
You cannot convince me that Ukraine was an independent entity in between the 30's and 90's, especially one with a fairly prolific arms industry 

Taking statements out of context to fuel a non-existent argument is quite silly.

[Sarmatiko 673]

4 hours ago, Mahiwew said:

If anything Poland should be the main component if such tree is realized.

If anything Poland should be separate tech tree just like Ukraine. I don't know why you are arguing about who should be the sub-tree, if both countries could get their own tree eventually.

It makes sense to start Ukrainian tree like Israel TT since most of the tanks developed in Ukraine (and in USSR) were modern (adding T-34 and T-35 to the mix will only complicate things).

It also makes no sense to merge Poland and Ukraine into same tree on the basis of what, same border? Following this logic Polish TT can share the space with Czech-Slovakian tree, and I doubt anyone would want that (or at least players from those countries ).
 

 

ps: another vehicle to the honorable mentions\future additions list:
RCH 155

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Sarmatiko

[Raiden_Black 1,875]

13 minutes ago, Sarmatiko said:

If anything Poland should be separate tech tree just like Ukraine. I don't know why you are arguing about who should be the sub-tree, if both countries could get their own tree eventually.

It makes sense to start Ukrainian tree like Israel TT since most of the tanks developed in Ukraine (and in USSR) were modern (adding T-34 and T-35 to the mix will only complicate things).

It also makes no sense to merge Poland and Ukraine into same tree on the basis of what, same border? Following this logic Polish TT can share the space with Czech-Slovakian tree, and I doubt anyone would want that (or at least players from those countries ).
 

 

ps: another vehicle to the honorable mentions\future additions list:
RCH 155

 

well ... the 18 RCH 155 is slated to be delivered to Ukraine in 2024+ ... not anytime soon .. and the platform itself is still undergoing testing and Ukraine is supposed to be its earliest user/adopter

Edited January 8, 2023 by Raiden_Black

[Sarmatiko 673]

46 minutes ago, Raiden_Black said:

well ... the 18 RCH 155 is slated to be delivered to Ukraine in 2024+ ... not anytime soon .. and the platform itself is still undergoing testing and Ukraine is supposed to be its earliest user/adopter

Hence "future additions list". Gaijin now has plenty of time to order the model from 3D artists

[Sarmatiko 673]

34 minutes ago, Raiden_Black said:

most likely the Polish TT has higher chance of coming first

From the marketing point of view Ukrainian TT has better chances to come first, all things considered. If we would discuss that prior to 2022 I would agree that Polish or Czech tree could come first but things have changed. Now Ukrainian TT is overflowing with combat tested vehicles and still open for any possible additions.
And in the end, it's Gaijin we are talking about. "Strike while the iron is hot" as the old saying goes.

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 182]

The inscription "Rage moves the weapon" on 2S3 Akatsiya of 93 separate mechanized brigade.

Proposition to add it in decals section of this suggestion

Full image:

[Mahiwew 528]

2 hours ago, Sarmatiko said:

From the marketing point of view Ukrainian TT has better chances to come first, all things considered. If we would discuss that prior to 2022 I would agree that Polish or Czech tree could come first but things have changed. Now Ukrainian TT is overflowing with combat tested vehicles and still open for any possible additions.
And in the end, it's Gaijin we are talking about. "Strike while the iron is hot" as the old saying goes.

I very much disagree.
Perhaps Ukraine would be more interesting for western audiences, but you forget that War Thunder has a very large Russian playerbase, as well as even in the West Ukraine is a highly controversial topic.

Poland has also been well regarded as one of the better potential new nations, much more so than Ukraine.

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 182]

12 minutes ago, Mahiwew said:

I very much disagree.
Perhaps Ukraine would be more interesting for western audiences, but you forget that War Thunder has a very large Russian playerbase, as well as even in the West Ukraine is a highly controversial topic.

Poland has also been well regarded as one of the better potential new nations, much more so than Ukraine.

As much as i know, mostly, players of WT are from Europe/Northern America/China(or from countries close to China)

[Raiden_Black 1,875]

On 29/12/2022 at 22:32, Yontzee said:

New update, if this does occur, it will be added to the honorable mentions/future additions tab of the suggestion. Reports are coming in that White House officials may send Bradley IFV’s to the UAF. I’m not sure what model, some options are M2A2 ODS, M2A3 Bradley, or M3A3 Bradley.

 

Source: 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-12-29/us-weighs-sending-bradley-fighting-vehicles-to-bolster-ukraine?utm_source=website&utm_medium=share&utm_campaign=twitter&sref=yYYRek8e

I’d like to mention @Renamed74985 for there awesome UA skin on WTLive for the M3A3 Bradley. 

Link:

https://live.warthunder.com/post/1058766/ru/

 

Bradleys, just after 1 hour being delivered to Ukraine :



 

Spoiler

 

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 182]

17 minutes ago, Raiden_Black said:

Bradleys, just after 1 hour being delivered to Ukraine :



 

Reveal hidden contents

 

 

What? You subbed to "ДШБ Official" too?

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 182]

 

Ukrainian BMP-2 "Bandit" somewhere in the ATO zone. Photo for 2014-2015.

Proposition to add "Bandit" sign to Decals section.

Edited January 8, 2023 by HIMARS_Enjoyer

[Red_Karen11 21]

IF Ukraine is included, then object 488 should also be included as well to the Ukrainian TT

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 182]

2 minutes ago, Red_Karen11 said:

IF Ukraine is included, then object 488 should also be included as well to the Ukrainian TT

Ah yes, Ukrainian Merkava...

[Rambolf 371]

34 minutes ago, HIMARS_Enjoyer said:

Ah yes, Ukrainian Merkava...

What an abomination...

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 182]

2 minutes ago, Rambolf said:

What an abomination...

You saying same about Merkava, yes?

[Rambolf 371]

3 minutes ago, HIMARS_Enjoyer said:

You saying same about Merkava, yes?

Merkavas turret is purpose built, that thing is just slapping a T84, im guessing, turret on a Box hull...

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 182]

1 minute ago, Rambolf said:

Merkavas turret is purpose built, that thing is just slapping a T84, im guessing, turret on a Box hull...

That was complete prototype. So not box hull. And what`s a problem of slapping T-84 turret on different hull?

[Rambolf 371]

1 minute ago, HIMARS_Enjoyer said:

That was complete prototype. So not box hull. And what`s a problem of slapping T-84 turret on different hull?

Looks weird

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 182]

10 minutes ago, Rambolf said:

Looks weird

Same as normal tanks looking like **** in russian propaganda heads mind

[Mahiwew 528]

2 hours ago, HIMARS_Enjoyer said:

As much as i know, mostly, players of WT are from Europe/Northern America/China(or from countries close to China)

Am I wrong to presume you to be a US server player?
In EU servers and obviously RU too you'll find plenty of them.
Russia is European after all.

[f_ritz 24]

On 06/01/2023 at 10:54, ZVO_12_INCH said:

by what criteria do you have a non-Soviet tank

 

That's my whole point: most Ukrainian tanks are just developments of Soviet tanks, and they use a lot of the same stuff.

The ones that aren't post-Soviet developments (Western lend-lease) can into the premium/event ranks of their donors

So why create yet another tree that'll mostly be copy-paste with a few minor changes?

 

[Sarmatiko 673]

6 hours ago, f_ritz said:

 

That's my whole point: most Ukrainian tanks are just developments of Soviet tanks, and they use a lot of the same stuff.

The ones that aren't post-Soviet developments (Western lend-lease) can into the premium/event ranks of their donors

So why create yet another tree that'll mostly be copy-paste with a few minor changes?

 

Sorry, but your post is just as weird as claim "Why make Israel tech tree - it's just donated tanks and copy&paste Magach and Merkava!"

"most Ukrainian tanks are just developments of Soviet tanks" 
Not only there's enough modern Ukrainian tanks (have you looked at proposed TT mock-up image at all?) but those "soviet" tanks were also developed in Kharkiv, Ukraine. All Ukrainian tank crew training, production chains, maintenance is built around Ukrainian-developed tanks. Current Russia can't even exploit their own old stock of T-64 because they lack engine specialists, knowledge and manufacturing chains for maintenance - all this despite so called "soviet" status of the tank. "Soviet tank" but where are those "soviet people" who can maintain T-64 then? Why there's only "soviet people" who can revive T-62 from siberian long-term storage and not T-64? It's rhetorical question and you know the answer.

 

War Thunder already covered most major conflicts of XX century. It would be strange to ignore major conflict of XXI century in Europe and armed forces of the country that defended itself against invasion.
You may not like it, but Ukraine's TT will happen eventually. Don't like all those sweet T-64 mods, Oplots and western donations? Play some other trees from countries that never participated in modern war then?

[Sarmatiko 673]

Additions to the honorable mentions\event vehicles list (sorry if they were already mentioned or considered):

 

Т-72-120

 

Spoiler

 

Source: https://web.archive.org/web/20210511195026/https://morozov.com.ua/ua/bronetankovaya-tehnika-i-vooruzhenie/tanki/modernizaciya/t-72/

 

BTMP-84
 

Spoiler

 

 

Source: https://web.archive.org/web/20210511195442/https://morozov.com.ua/ua/bronetankovaya-tehnika-i-vooruzhenie/boevye-bronirovannye-mashiny/razrabotki/bmtp-84/

 

 

Edited January 9, 2023 by Sarmatiko

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 182]

1 hour ago, Sarmatiko said:

BTMP-84
 

Hide contents

 

 

Source: https://web.archive.org/web/20210511195442/https://morozov.com.ua/ua/bronetankovaya-tehnika-i-vooruzhenie/boevye-bronirovannye-mashiny/razrabotki/bmtp-84/

 

 

14 hours ago, Mahiwew said:

Am I wrong to presume you to be a US server player?
In EU servers and obviously RU too you'll find plenty of them.
Russia is European after all.

I`m playing on US and EU servers. In ground RB i mostly meet people from US/EU. And few idiots with Z/V symbols that is definitely russians. In Air RB if i meet Z/V idiot he is instantly dying. And still in battle there is 2-3 of them MAX. And russia is not European  . They are Swampean.

[Mahiwew 528]

10 hours ago, HIMARS_Enjoyer said:

I`m playing on US and EU servers. In ground RB i mostly meet people from US/EU. And few idiots with Z/V symbols that is definitely russians. In Air RB if i meet Z/V idiot he is instantly dying. And still in battle there is 2-3 of them MAX. And russia is not European  . They are Swampean.

2-3 Russian players per EU game still shows that there’s quite a prevalence of them.

Russians and Ukrainians have shown to be unreasonable to each other in the game previously, getting Gaijin to remove teamkill (excluding from the air) in ground battles and muting the chat on a few occasions. You can only imagine the issues that could arise with the arrival of Ukraine, which is why I highly doubt Ukraine is a top priority now.

Given the recent passed to devs topic, several Benelux related topics were passed. Though it generally means very little when something gets passed to devs, it is still worth noting when three separate suggestions are being looked at, two of which are tech trees. 
There are also other nations with a bigger abundance of vehicles and have room for expansion, as well as some nations that could be quite popular in Israeli style form. Had it not been for the war, Ukraine may have been up there in priority, but it would be too controversial to add during this conflict and likely several years after too.