1.95 Rumor Round-Up and Discussion

[EpicBlitzkrieg87 8,350]

1 minute ago, Optical_Ilyushin said:

 

I really want more nations such as Yugoslavia, frankly speaking the combinations themselves prove to be entertaining just as much as the meme vehicles they bring to the table.

 

You mean that Sherman with the Russian 122mm?  

Their aviation would have some memes too. Like the S-49A prop with the weird gun setup (two M2 .50 cals and one Shvak) and the S-49C (one MG 151 and two Brownings)

[Kanyiko 8,568]

Throwing up a random (lead?) balloon as to what the Swedish/Scandinavian tree could look like.

 

Tanks:
T-26 (Finland, Rank I, BR 1.0)

Stridsvagn m/38 (Sweden, Rank I, BR 1.3?)

Stridsvagn m/40 (Sweden, Rank I, BR 1.7?) 

T-28E (Finland, Rank II, BR 2.7)

Stridsvagn m/42 (Sweden, Rank II, BR 3.3)

T-34 (1942) (Finland, Rank II, BR 3.7)

Panzer IVJ (Finland, Rank III, BR 4.3)

KV-1 (Finland, Rank III, BR 4.7)

Stridsvagn m/74 (Sweden, Rank III, BR 4.7)

Comet I (Finland, Rank III, BR 5.0)

T-34/85 (Finland, Rank IV, BR 5.7)

Stridsvagn 81/Centurion Mk.3 (Sweden, Rank IV, BR 6.7)

Stridsvagn 103 (Sweden, Rank V, BR 7.3?)

T-54 (1951) (Finland, Rank V, BR 7.7)

T-55 (Finland, Rank VI, BR 8.3)

T-55M (Finland, Rank VI, BR 8.7)

T-72 (Finland, Rank VI, BR 9.3)

Leopard 2A4 (Finland, Rank VI, BR 10.0)

Stridsvagn 122A/Leopard 2A5 (Sweden, Rank VII, BR 10.3)

 

Recon tanks:

Landsverk L-180 (Sweden, Rank I, BR 1.0/Reserve?)

T-50 (Finland, Rank I, BR 2.3?)

Pansarbandvagn 301 (Sweden, Rank III, BR ?) 

T-76 (Finland, Rank IV, BR 5.3)

Pansarbandvogn 501/BMP-1 (Sweden & Finland, Rank V, BR 7.3)

BMP-2 (Finland, Rank VI, BR 8.3)

Stridsfordon 90/CV90 (Sweden, Rank VI, BR ?)

 

SPAAG

Landsverk L-62 Anti II (Finland, Rank II, BR 3.7?)

57 ItPsv SU 57-2 (Finland, Rank V, BR 7.3)

ItPsv 90 (Finland, Rank VI, BR 9.3?)

ITO 90M (Finland, Rank VII, BR 10.0?)

 

SPG/Tank Destroyers

BT-42 (Finland, Rank I, BR ?)

Pansarbandvagn T fm/49 (Sweden, Rank I, BR ?)

m/43 (75 mm gun) (Sweden, Rank II, BR ?)

StuG IIIG (Finland, Rank II, BR 4.3)

Infanterikanonvagn 73 with 75 mm gun (Sweden, Rank III, BR ?)

m/43 (105 mm gun) (Sweden, Rank III, BR ?)

ISU-152 (Finland, Rank IV, BR 5.3)

Charioteer VII (Finland, Rank IV, BR 5.7)

Infanterikanonvagn 73 with 105 mm gun (Sweden, Rank V, BR ?)

Infanterikanonvagn 91 (Sweden, Rank V, BR ?)

122 PSH 74 (Finland, Rank VI, BR ?)

Infanterikanonvagn 105 (Sweden, Rank VI, BR ?)

155 PSH 17 (Finland, Rank VII, BR 10.0?)

 

Premium vehicles?

38M Toldi I (Hungary, Rank I, BR 1.3?) (Landsverk L-60 tank with 20 mm AT gun)

38M Toldi IIa (Hungary, Rank II, BR 2.3?) (Landsverk L-60 tank with 40 mm AT gun)

Panther A (Sweden, Rank IV, BR 5.7 Premium?) - one example purchased from Allies after WWII for test purposes.

Pz. Kpfw. VI Ausf. B (P) (Sweden, Rank IV, BR 6.3 Premium?) - one example purchased from Allies after WWII for test purposes.

Stridsvagn 81 (Rb.52)/Centurion Mk.3 with SS.11 (Sweden, Rank IV, BR 6.7 Premium)

Stridsvagn 122B/Leopard 2A5M (Sweden, Rank VII, BR 10.3 Premium?)

Edited October 30, 2019 by Kanyiko

[Stridswombat 1,089]

8 minutes ago, EpicBlitzkrieg87 said:

 

Neither does Sweden, and it's still being implemented with lots of support for it. Yugoslavia in the game would be almost as interesting if not having the same level of interest. 

Except Sweden has the unique vehicles for it. China doesn't, but China has the market and was already in the game.  Yugoslavia and all the other tree suggestions doesn't have any of these.

[EpicBlitzkrieg87 8,350]

12 minutes ago, Stridswombat said:

Except Sweden has the unique vehicles for it. China doesn't, but China has the market and was already in the game.  Yugoslavia and all the other tree suggestions doesn't have any of these.

 

Doesn't sound like you dug deep enough. 

[Stridswombat 1,089]

2 minutes ago, Kanyiko said:

Throwing up a random (lead?) balloon as to what the Swedish/Scandinavian tree could look like.

Sweden really doesn't need any of those Finnish vehicles. At most the vehicles it "needs" are the Norwegian Chaffee and maybe Danish Bulldog as those are less populated BR's. Even then though that's not a necessity, just helpful. Finland for ground is mainly good for some interesting vehicles such as the BT-42 and Itpsv 90

 

The weakest rank for Sweden is Rank 4. Rank 5-7 is covered, rank 1-2 is well populated and rank 3 is mostly fine. 

 

If we look at rank 3 and 4 at 3.0-6.7, perhaps the weakest portion of the tree, you've still got atleast the below to cover it. That's without any other Scandinavian vehicles thrown into the mix. This is where stuff like the Norwegian 90mm Chaffee could come in handy.

*Strv m/42 EH
*Ikv 73

*Pvkv II
*Pvkv III

*Pvkv IV
*Sav fm/43 75mm pvkan m/43
*Strv m/42 DT
*Pvkv m/43 early
*Pvkv m/43 late
*Strv 74
*Ikv 102
*Ikv 103
*Sav fm/48

*Strv m/40L ATGM
*Landsverk-Unimog 80mm recoilless
*Landsverk-Unimog ATGM
*Strv 81

*Strv S2

*Swedish Tiger II (P) (Premium)

 

Anti Air:

*Tdgb m/40 LV
*Anti I
*Anti II
*Fältautomatkanon fm/45
*Lvkv fm/43 early
*Lvkv fm/43 late
*Lvkv 42

 

7.0-10.3 does better with atleast:

 

Strv 101
Strv 101 chain armour
Strv 101R
Strv 102R
Strv 104
Strv 105
Strv 104 120mm
Strv 103 0-series
Strv 103A
Strv 103B
Strv 103C
Strv 103D Early
Strv 103D Composite
UDES XX20
UDES 19

CV90105 XC-8
CV90105-TML
CV90120

CV9040 BILL
Pvrbv 551
Strv 121
Strv 122A
Ikv 91
Ikv 91-105
Ikv 105
Pbv 501 (BMP-1)
Pvrbv 452

 

Anti Air:

VEAK 40
Lvrbv 701
Lvrbv 4016
Lvkv 9040
Lvkv 9040C

2 minutes ago, EpicBlitzkrieg87 said:

 

Doesn't sound like you dug deep enough. 

Do they have more than Sweden? Because Sweden like some of the other minor trees have just about enough. I don't think Yugoslavia is going to have more somehow. And I do mean unique vehicles here from start to finish. China should never have been made a full tree but an off-shoot tree.

[EpicBlitzkrieg87 8,350]

10 minutes ago, Stridswombat said:

Do they have more than Sweden? Because Sweden like some of the other minor trees have just about enough. I don't think Yugoslavia is going to have more somehow. And I do mean unique vehicles here from start to finish. China should never have been made a full tree but an off-shoot tree.

 

I don't know about tanks but take a look here

 

Note that it's WIP and there's more to add

Edited October 30, 2019 by EpicBlitzkrieg87

[GildyMenn21@psn 482]

2 hours ago, Optical_Ilyushin said:

 

A great choice, I personally want an independent standalone Toyota ground forces tree.

Me playing Japan in 1.95 be like 

 

“See you on the battlefield with my Prius”

 

[konngou0224@psn 583]

3 hours ago, SPANISH_AVENGER said:

Gameplay wise, Type 10 (44 ton) is basically a Type 90 that looks different, and Type 10 (48 ton) is a Type 10 with the currently ingame ''M1A2'' level armor. It could also be added with Type 10 APFSDS to make it better, but i don't know what values it would have nor if it would be balanced.

 

I have no idea how on Earth Japan still has none of these, at least the 44 ton version.

False recognition and prejudice.  Check carefully about Type10.

[Kanyiko 8,568]

15 minutes ago, EpicBlitzkrieg87 said:

 

I don't know about tanks but take a look here

 

Note that it's WIP and there's more to add

 

Problem with a Yugoslavian ground tree would be that there's too much copy-paste going on, combined with a virtually non-existant Rank I and II.

 

Sure, you get some interesting vehicles such as the M5 with M45 Quad turret and the Somua S35 with 6-pounder in the lower tiers, and the M-320, M-636, the M-84 or the M-95 Degman in the higher ones, but most of the tanks would be bunched in the Rank III-V range (M4A3E8 Sherman, T-34/85, M18 Hellcat, M36 Jackson, M47 Patton, T-54, T-55, etc).

 

Unless you insert some suspiciously dodgy Rank 0 stuff.

 

Edited October 30, 2019 by Kanyiko

[SaekoB 2,053]

33 minutes ago, Stridswombat said:

Except Sweden has the unique vehicles for it. China doesn't, but China has the market and was already in the game.  Yugoslavia and all the other tree suggestions doesn't have any of these.

 

Modern day China has plenty of unique vehicles, they didn't have them during WWII. The Chinese tree is far from complete and if Gaijin start adding modern vehicles they'd have more of them than USA and Germany combined, just the ZTZ-96 had 4 variants + an export one, then we have other ZTZ models, ZTQ, etc, they also have two or tree models of domestic gunships, tons of domestic planes, and naval units.

 

Sweden is kind of the opposite of China, they have domestic WWII and cold war units, but most of their modern stuff is made in Germany, Switzerland or Finland, at least for ground forces. 

 

But, contrary to popular belief there are people who actually enjoy the modern aspect of this game more than the WWII parts, and of course there's people who prefer the opposite, but just because China was released in a state it is now, it should not be dismissed as just a copy+past nation, right now it is pretty uninteresting, but as said when they start adding modern units, the tree will have a bright future for those who enjoy high rank games. 

30 minutes ago, Stridswombat said:

China should never have been made a full tree but an off-shoot tree.

 

That's a very ignorant statement from someone who didn't do research on Chinese military forces. 

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, *GildyMenn21 said:

Me playing Japan in 1.95 be like 

 

“See you on the battlefield with my Prius”

 

 

This is better than nothing.

[Stridswombat 1,089]

30 minutes ago, EpicBlitzkrieg87 said:

 

I don't know about tanks but take a look here

Note that it's WIP and there's more to add

How many of those are Yugoslavian? I honestly can't tell. The problem is even if they have an air tree, not having a ground or naval tree makes things tricky. Now I don't think naval is very important imo (as long as you can manage ground and air that's fine in my book), but it is still a future concern.

 

14 minutes ago, SaekoB said:

Modern day China has plenty of unique vehicles, they didn't have them during WWII. The Chinese tree is far from complete and if Gaijin start adding modern vehicles they'd have more of them than USA and Germany combined, just the ZTZ-96 had 4 variants + an export one, then we have other ZTZ models, ZTQ, etc, they also have two or tree models of domestic gunships, tons of domestic planes, and naval units.

 

Sweden is kind of the opposite of China, they have domestic WWII and cold war units, but most of their modern stuff is made in Germany, Switzerland or Finland, at least for ground forces. 

 

But, contrary to popular belief there are people who actually enjoy the modern aspect of this game more than the WWII parts, and of course there's people who prefer the opposite, but just because China was released in a state it is now, it should not be dismissed as just a copy+past nation, right now it is pretty uninteresting, but as said when they start adding modern units, the tree will have a bright future for those who enjoy high rank games. 

 

That's a very ignorant statement from someone who didn't do research on Chinese military forces. 

"Modern day China" That's the thing though, isn't it? China has vehicles for the top of the tree, but not the start of it. For a full-fledged tree I'd argue you'd have to have a good spread of native vehicles from rank 1-7 and not just one portion of it. That's why Sweden works and not just because of the quantity of vehicles, but because of the spread. There's not a single rank that won't have a good chunk of Swedish vehicles of it, even the weakest ones (rank 3 and 4).

 

If it doesn't have that, what's the point of a whole tree, when 90% of the unique vehicles in it are in one side of it? That to me just add padding that makes me and I'm sure a lot of people less likely to play it because you can't reach the vehicles you're actually interested in. An off-shoot tree would solve this problem and do a lot to increase player numbers. Even if they add more modern vehicles, that just exacerbates the issue of the huge chunk of padding you have to grind through to get there first. As for your second statement: "That's a very ignorant statement from someone who didn't do research on Chinese military forces... Sweden is kind of the opposite of China, they have domestic WWII and cold war units, but most of their modern stuff is made in Germany, Switzerland or Finland, at least for ground forces. "

 

Aside from the Leo 2's, there's no modern vehicles that aren't Swedish that could be in the game. The only Finnish vehicles I'm aware of are APC's and armoured cars with HMG's and 20mm guns that wouldn't work in the game anyhow. As for the Swiss vehicles, I don't know of any so I'm not sure where you're referring to there. There's nothing there that could be of use anyhow unless you consider something like this game material.

Spoiler

 

The only 2 actual vehicles that aren't wholly Swedish for toptier are the Leo 2's. Strv 121 is a 2a4, albeit with Swedish APFSDS and HE and possibly some newer composite. The 122 was developed from the Leopard 2 Improved (not 2a5, it predates it) that was tested in the trial but with heavy upgrades. That's 2 vehicles, neither of which are identical to what we have in the game. The 121 has new ammo and possibly new composite, the 122 has different composite, add-on armour, ammo, smoke grenade launchers, FCS and combat weight to the 2a5. The 122 is about as close to a 2a5 as the CM11 is to a regular M60

[TheGaiaphage 118]

20 minutes ago, SaekoB said:

Sweden is kind of the opposite of China, they have domestic WWII and cold war units, but most of their modern stuff is made in Germany, Switzerland or Finland, at least for ground forces. 

Uh, what?

 

The high ranks in WT will have some modified Centurions and a couple Leo 2s, but it will still be mostly Swedish designs. Just look at the list Stridswombat posted for 7.0 to 10.3, there are 0 Swiss or Finish vehicles.

[Firnen_ 8,253]

17 hours ago, gromvoiny said:

It lacks the armament to be a rank 3. Also, it would cost more in that case. 

 

Allow me to point you in the direction of the US Bf 109 F-4. Apart from that, even bundle vehicles have moved in tier before, look at the Achilles. That also started out as a tier 2 and was moved up. The [insert name here] definitely should be a tier 3.

[warhammus 68]

Don't compare this two nations,china and sweden have both some beautifull tanks.

They both can have a tree. Sure China don't have ww2 tanks but they have a lot of modern.

 

[Stridswombat 1,089]

8 minutes ago, TheGaiaphage said:

Uh, what?

 

The high ranks in WT will have some modified Centurions and a couple Leo 2s, but it will still be mostly Swedish designs. Just look at the list Stridswombat posted for 7.0 to 10.3, there are 0 Swiss or Finish vehicles.

Indeed. The point is Sweden can have Finnish vehicles, but they're not required to complete the tree and you certainly won't need any copy/paste vehicles. A good example of something Finland could contribute to it is ItPsv 90 as that's an interesting and unique SPAAG. That's the sort of thing they can add. Not copy/paste vehicles that aren't needed.

Spoiler

btw here's something courtesy of Steelbeasts. Sweden never actually fired DM 33 or DM 43 out of their Leo 2's. Instead they got some other shell for them. Not quite sure what the origin of it is, but it might be Israeli? It probably lands somewhere between DM 33 and DM 43 in performance as it is right in the middle when it comes to projectile length.

 

[NoodleCup31 8,824]

So apparently Sweden is on the allied side for reasons.

Now what happens when Swedish tank tree comes in?

CH/SWE/UK/US/USSR/FRA vs GER ?

 

Time for matchmaker rework

Oh, how about removing the matchmaking lock from Italy and Germany?

You know, after 2 years I think it is ok to balance things out a bit.

Edited October 30, 2019 by NoodleCup31

[Capt_Rodgers 2,370]

58 minutes ago, Kanyiko said:

 

Problem with a Yugoslavian ground tree would be that there's too much copy-paste going on, combined with a virtually non-existant Rank I and II.

 

Sure, you get some interesting vehicles such as the M5 with M45 Quad turret and the Somua S35 with 6-pounder in the lower tiers, and the M-320, M-636, the M-84 or the M-95 Degman in the higher ones, but most of the tanks would be bunched in the Rank III-V range (M4A3E8 Sherman, T-34/85, M18 Hellcat, M36 Jackson, M47 Patton, T-54, T-55, etc).

 

Unless you insert some suspiciously dodgy Rank 0 stuff.

 

Honesly Czechoslovakia is better nation with more domestic vehicles over all tree. In Czechoslovakia produced. Might be also fill with Poland and Hungary

[Stridswombat 1,089]

Just now, NoodleCup31 said:

So apparently Sweden is on the allied side for reasons.

Do we actually know that?

[Necrons31467 14,236]

59 minutes ago, Kanyiko said:

 

That looks awfully familiar.

 

 

 

[NoodleCup31 8,824]

6 minutes ago, Stridswombat said:

Do we actually know that?

Yes.

The 4.3 premium thing I can't spell was on the other side so far.

[Stridswombat 1,089]

7 minutes ago, NoodleCup31 said:

Yes.

The 4.3 premium thing I can't spell was on the other side so far.

Perhaps it's just neutral and not tied to any side for matchmaking?

[Охраняет-Камни 6,650]

26 minutes ago, NoodleCup31 said:

Oh, how about removing the matchmaking lock from Italy and Germany?

You know, after 2 years I think it is ok to balance things out a bit.

Yes, please, especially now in this Ka-50 spam vs ADATS spam situation(would be perfect to separate US and USSR from any other nation in top tier MM).

Btw Italian Kingdom flag has been changed to Republic one, maybe it's the first step to stop this modern Axis vs Allies MM?

15 minutes ago, NoodleCup31 said:

Yes.

The 4.3 premium thing I can't spell was on the other side so far.

It's a postwar plane.

Also in test flight Sweden planes have Bf.110 as allied bots.

Edited October 30, 2019 by _Condottiero_

[NoodleCup31 8,824]

5 minutes ago, _Condottiero_ said:

It's a postwar plane.

That doesn't matter really.

 

[Josephs_Piano 7,044]

1 hour ago, NoodleCup31 said:

Time for matchmaker rework

 

Long been time for a chronological basis for matchmaking and getting rid of the BR system entirely.

Edited October 31, 2019 by Josephs_Piano